Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 14 of 16 FirstFirst ... 41213141516 LastLast
Results 196 to 210 of 236
  1. #196
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    East of the Sun, West of the Moon
    Posts
    26,853
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    God doesn't disappear and appear [1], you still seem to not be able to grasp fundamental concepts about God and seem to view him as the creation [2], it creator (as evidence by your earlier insistence that he be measurable)

    If there is no creator, then there is no creation.
    I posed a hypothetical question. Answer it.
    You fail to grasp the reality that God as you claim "know" him does not exist. So there's that issue.
    Baseball Maverick: How Sandy Alderson Revolutionized Baseball and Revived the Mets
    I am that Daddy Cool

  2. #197
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    22,374
    Quote Originally Posted by Dugmet View Post
    I posed a hypothetical question. Answer it.
    You fail to grasp the reality that God as you claim "know" him does not exist. So there's that issue.
    That's like me posing a hypothetical question, if 5+5=8 then what happens to the color green?

    There's nothing to do with that question, it makes no sense.. All it does is show how diff our conceptualizations are from one another

    Wether my belief in God is true or false should have no bearing on this discussion, as we are simply explaining our views, which is what made me curious about what I asked in the first place
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  3. #198
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    14,656
    Quote Originally Posted by Dugmet View Post
    I abandon God and did not turn to sin. I found love -- really amazing, true, love. Worked for me.
    Abandonment is not the same as God disappearing, "poof!"
    How is it not? lol

  4. #199
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    39,326
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Well that doesn't really answer what I was asking then. I was asking specifically about the idea that going through bad times leading someone to the conclusion that God doesn't exist. That's what I was curious about hearing, the reasoning behind that
    I don't think bad times alone lead people to conclude God doesn't exist. That happens when they realize that not only is he not answering prayers but he's impossible to locate one way or the other, too.

    Obviously I can't speak for everyone who doesnt believe in God. But i think that's a pretty good start. If you have some time, here's a very powerful play about Auschwitz prisoners putting God on Trial as they await the gas chambers.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5caAug5n8Zk
    "Ain't got the call no more. Got a lot of sinful idears but they seem kinda sensible...."

  5. #200
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    22,374
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    I don't think bad times alone lead people to conclude God doesn't exist. That happens when they realize that not only is he not answering prayers but he's impossible to locate one way or the other, too.

    Obviously I can't speak for everyone who doesnt believe in God. But i think that's a pretty good start. If you have some time, here's a very powerful play about Auschwitz prisoners putting God on Trial as they await the gas chambers.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5caAug5n8Zk
    Saying God allowed bad things to happen to me is fundamentally entirely different reasoning for disbelief than saying God can't be measured. The latter we've covered numerous times on this forum, the former we haven't and that's what I'm curious about

    You keep kinda meshing the two, which is fine, I understand if both play a part in your disbelief, but it takes away from the discussion focusing on what I'm asking
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  6. #201
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    East of the Sun, West of the Moon
    Posts
    26,853
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack the Ripper View Post
    How is it not? lol
    Because he can still be present even if someone rejects him. C'mon man.
    Baseball Maverick: How Sandy Alderson Revolutionized Baseball and Revived the Mets
    I am that Daddy Cool

  7. #202
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    39,326
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Saying God allowed bad things to happen to me is fundamentally entirely different reasoning for disbelief than saying God can't be measured. The latter we've covered numerous times on this forum, the former we haven't and that's what I'm curious about

    You keep kinda meshing the two, which is fine, I understand if both play a part in your disbelief, but it takes away from the discussion focusing on what I'm asking
    I think Im gonna agree, that if you believe in God and bad things happen to you, youre more likely to hate God than to swear off his existence. That would require a less myopic view of things.

  8. #203
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    14,656
    Quote Originally Posted by Dugmet View Post
    Because he can still be present even if someone rejects him. C'mon man.
    I answered your question. lol

    If God just decided, "I'm not going to be present in this universe anymore and just disappeared," the result would be that depravity and evil would flourish. The example of people who reject God was just an example of what the absence of God looks like in life. Disappearance and abandonment will result in the same consequence. Life without God would give way to evil, sin, and depravity. C'mon man. It wasn't difficult to follow.

  9. #204
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    22,374
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    I think Im gonna agree, that if you believe in God and bad things happen to you, youre more likely to hate God than to swear off his existence. That would require a less myopic view of things.
    Sure, but in this discussion we are talking about people who believe in God, experience hardship, and then swear off his existence. That doesn't make sense to me so in trying to follow the reason to see how this is happening

    I think on a subconscious level this pertains to a lot more atheists than are aware of it. Many of them say they disbelieve through logic, but many times I can see emotional roots in their story. I believe the reason this is is because they've been sold on God through emotional reasoning to begin with, and so when that gets taken away it seems to lead down this domino effect
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  10. #205
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    39,326
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Sure, but in this discussion we are talking about people who believe in God, experience hardship, and then swear off his existence. That doesn't make sense to me so in trying to follow the reason to see how this is happening

    I think on a subconscious level this pertains to a lot more atheists than are aware of it. Many of them say they disbelieve through logic, but many times I can see emotional roots in their story. I believe the reason this is is because they've been sold on God through emotional reasoning to begin with, and so when that gets taken away it seems to lead down this domino effect
    It would be presumptuous for either us to speak for anyone elses underlying reasons to believe or disbelieve.

  11. #206
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    22,374
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    It would be presumptuous for either us to speak for anyone elses underlying reasons to believe or disbelieve.
    I say that as an outsider looking in, Im aware of that fact. But that doesn't render an outsiders perspective meaningless
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  12. #207
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    14,656
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    My understanding of God is based on the Bible, not what makes me sleep better at night.

  13. #208
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    39,326
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack the Ripper View Post
    My understanding of God is based on the Bible, not what makes me sleep better at night.
    You understanding of God based on the Bible and my understanding of God based on my own personal beliefs are equally valid.

    And equally invalid.

    Put more succinctly, the Bible and I are equal authorities on God. It's merely a matter of what one chooses to believe.
    Last edited by fanofclendennon; 06-12-2018 at 10:02 PM.
    "Ain't got the call no more. Got a lot of sinful idears but they seem kinda sensible...."

  14. #209
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    39,326
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    I say that as an outsider looking in, Im aware of that fact. But that doesn't render an outsiders perspective meaningless
    You can't speak for anyone individually as to why he/she might or might not believe in God.
    "Ain't got the call no more. Got a lot of sinful idears but they seem kinda sensible...."

  15. #210
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    14,656
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    You understanding of God based on the Bible and my understanding of God based on my own personal beliefs are equally valid.

    And equally invalid.

    Put more succinctly, the Bible and I are equal authorities on God. It's merely a matter of what one chooses to believe.
    No, they are not. One understanding is based on a book that is understood as being from God. A book that has checked out and been verified historically, contains not a single error, and will continue to prove itself through fulfilled prophecy. The other is an opinion based on... what? How you feel?

Page 14 of 16 FirstFirst ... 41213141516 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •