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  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post


    Would take me a while to sort out 20-100+ on my all time list. Was just wondering if you had him in a rough range off the top.
    Exactly. Iverson wasn't good enough IMO to warrant the type of effort it would take to determine his place. The same is true of most pros obviously.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J120A using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  2. #227
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    Iverson manages to be 11th all time in field goals missed, while being 29th in field goals made and 25th in all-time scoring


    His teams had better numbers when he was off the court than when he was on.

    I don't see how he can continue to be debated as an all-time great. He has years as an All-Star he shouldn't have been selected. He is one of, if not the, most over-rated player of the last 20 years.

    And we are comparing him to a guard who has changed the game completely. He efficiently chucks 3 after 3 and makes them like he is Steve Kerr. Despite the false argument that he only shoots wide open and that's why he makes his shots, it's simply not true. He literally has a better contested career field goal percentage than AI has overall lol.

    There is no comparison. The 76ers would have been light years better with Curry.
    Last edited by Jeffy25; 01-12-2018 at 10:22 PM.

  3. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Iverson manages to be 11th all time in field goals missed, while being 29th in field goals made and 25th in all-time scoring


    His teams had better numbers when he was off the court than when he was on.

    I don't see how he can continue to be debated as an all-time great. He has years as an All-Star he shouldn't have been selected. He is one of, if not the, most over-rated player of the last 20 years.

    And we are comparing him to a guard who has changed the game completely. He efficiently chucks 3 after 3 and makes them like he is Steve Kerr. Despite the false argument that he only shoots wide open and that's why he makes his shots, it's simply not true. He literally has a better contested career field goal percentage than AI has overall lol.

    There is no comparison. The 76ers would have been light years better with Curry.
    but if you put Curry in that era he'd be Michael Adams. if you put AI in this era he is Kyrie Irving with a lesser J
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  4. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    but if you put Curry in that era he'd be Michael Adams. if you put AI in this era he is Kyrie Irving with a lesser J
    LOL, maybe Adams is a little too far.

    I just think people are relying on stats too much and I agree with you era matters. It was a different game back then, defense schemes were different. Offensive schemes were different. People throwing stats around like Curry is going to shoot the same amount of 3's is funny to me. And yeah his game might not translate as smoothly as people think. I think his efficiency dips and his attempts go down personally.

  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heediot View Post
    LOL, maybe Adams is a little too far.

    I just think people are relying on stats too much and I agree with you era matters. It was a different game back then, defense schemes were different. Offensive schemes were different. People throwing stats around like Curry is going to shoot the same amount of 3's is funny to me. And yeah his game might not translate as smoothly as people think. I think his efficiency dips and his attempts go down personally.
    point remains. Today's game is set up for guys to beat you off the bounce. AI was the best at that in his time. The game in his era much more physical and played at a slower pace. AI flourishes more now. He takes you to the hole and gets to the line constantly and Jeffy likes him b/c he is efficient. Look at what IT is capable of b/c of a his speed and a spread floor.
    Last edited by ewing; 01-13-2018 at 10:17 AM.
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  6. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    point reminds. Today's game is set up for guys to beat you off the bounce. AI was the best at that in his time. The game in his era much more physical and played at a slower pace. AI flourishes more now. He takes you to the hole and gets to the line constantly and Jeffy likes him b/c he is efficient. Look at what IT is capable of b/c of a his speed and a spread floor.
    Yeah rules help drive and kick styles of players/offenses. It makes it easier for the ball handler to set up the defender/d. With the threat of the drive and the no touch rules, creating space off the bounce for a shot becomes a tonne easier.

  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    but if you put Curry in that era he'd be Michael Adams. if you put AI in this era he is Kyrie Irving with a lesser J
    Curry would be looked at like his HC if he played back then. Kerr was an excellent 3pt shooter, good handler, good passer. He was relegated to role player because the 3 was still not seen as a primary scoring option, so they saw it more as a gimmick than a tool. He would have never gotten the opportunity to be what he is now.

    Heck he would be the Milwaukee/Seattle version of Ray Allen.

    Meanwhile with this look at layup or 3, more spacing, and less lane congestion AI would thrive.

    Could you imagine if AI got a team like:
    AI
    Klay Thompson
    Robert Covington
    Jae Crowder
    DeAndre Jordan

    ....man. I would bank on that team being top 4 in either conference easily.

    PROCESSING

  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    point remains. Today's game is set up for guys to beat you off the bounce. AI was the best at that in his time. The game in his era much more physical and played at a slower pace. AI flourishes more now. He takes you to the hole and gets to the line constantly and Jeffy likes him b/c he is efficient. Look at what IT is capable of b/c of a his speed and a spread floor.
    Agreed, he just doesn't sniff curry

  9. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Iverson manages to be 11th all time in field goals missed, while being 29th in field goals made and 25th in all-time scoring


    His teams had better numbers when he was off the court than when he was on.

    I don't see how he can continue to be debated as an all-time great. He has years as an All-Star he shouldn't have been selected. He is one of, if not the, most over-rated player of the last 20 years.

    And we are comparing him to a guard who has changed the game completely. He efficiently chucks 3 after 3 and makes them like he is Steve Kerr. Despite the false argument that he only shoots wide open and that's why he makes his shots, it's simply not true. He literally has a better contested career field goal percentage than AI has overall lol.

    There is no comparison. The 76ers would have been light years better with Curry.
    AI had some years where he prolly should've sat a lot of games out.

  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    Curry would be looked at like his HC if he played back then. Kerr was an excellent 3pt shooter, good handler, good passer. He was relegated to role player because the 3 was still not seen as a primary scoring option, so they saw it more as a gimmick than a tool. He would have never gotten the opportunity to be what he is now.

    Heck he would be the Milwaukee/Seattle version of Ray Allen.

    Meanwhile with this look at layup or 3, more spacing, and less lane congestion AI would thrive.

    Could you imagine if AI got a team like:
    AI
    Klay Thompson
    Robert Covington
    Jae Crowder
    DeAndre Jordan

    ....man. I would bank on that team being top 4 in either conference easily.
    How many wins does that team get this season?

    Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk

  11. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Iverson manages to be 11th all time in field goals missed, while being 29th in field goals made and 25th in all-time scoring


    His teams had better numbers when he was off the court than when he was on.

    I don't see how he can continue to be debated as an all-time great. He has years as an All-Star he shouldn't have been selected. He is one of, if not the, most over-rated player of the last 20 years.

    And we are comparing him to a guard who has changed the game completely. He efficiently chucks 3 after 3 and makes them like he is Steve Kerr. Despite the false argument that he only shoots wide open and that's why he makes his shots, it's simply not true. He literally has a better contested career field goal percentage than AI has overall lol.

    There is no comparison. The 76ers would have been light years better with Curry.
    Love this guy. Iverson is the most overrated player in NBA history.

  12. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by LOb0 View Post
    Love this guy. Iverson is the most overrated player in NBA history.
    that should be a thread with a poll. i'd love to see if he wins in a landslide like i expect he would
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  13. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    point remains. Today's game is set up for guys to beat you off the bounce. AI was the best at that in his time. The game in his era much more physical and played at a slower pace. AI flourishes more now. He takes you to the hole and gets to the line constantly and Jeffy likes him b/c he is efficient. Look at what IT is capable of b/c of a his speed and a spread floor.
    Era would of course change some things.

    But Curry makes contested shots better than anyone else in the game, and he drives to the paint all the time. He doesn't get physically abused like he would have 20 years prior, but that's honestly the only difference.

    It still doesn't adjust for this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    They were better when he left for Denver (went from 5-12 at the time of the trade to 30-35 after he left) and returned to a .500 team after he was gone for the next two seasons, after being a .452% winning team the three years prior.

    I hate to break this to every one, but AI's lifetime wins vs loses in regular season games is 458-448. That's a .5055%. His teams, while he was on their rosters, was 552-538, that's a .5064%

    They were 104-90 without him (.536)

    The only year that his team sucked while he sat was in 02

    The year he showed up in Denver? They were 14-9 (.608%), before they got him, and finished out 31-28, 26-24 in the games he played in (.520%)

    It isn't just the bad shooting. His teams were literally better without him.
    Warriors aren't as good without Curry
    Last edited by Jeffy25; 01-14-2018 at 01:45 AM.

  14. #239
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Era would of course change some things.

    But Curry makes contested shots better than anyone else in the game, and he drives to the paint all the time. He doesn't get physically abused like he would have 20 years prior, but that's honestly the only difference.

    It still doesn't adjust for this:



    Warriors aren't as good without Curry
    don't forget how vastly improved Denver was with Chauncey over AI.

    Chauncey was a VASTLY superior player.
    Quote Originally Posted by NormSizedMidget View Post
    It's different now than it was.

    When he won the second one, Giants fans are here we're outside of their minds.
    That quote always cracks me up.

  15. #240
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    Because continuing to bash on AI is somewhat fun at this point

    Top 10 shots per 100 possessions all-time

    1. Jordan - 30.7
    2. Wilkins - 28.1
    3. Bryant - 27.9
    4. AI - 27.5
    5. Melo - 27.4
    6. Westbrook - 27.1
    7. Gervin - 26.8
    8. LeBron - 26.5
    8. McGrady - 26.5
    10. Wade - 25.9
    21. Curry - 24.0

    Top 10 points per 100 possessions

    1. Jordan - 40.4
    2. Durant - 36.8
    3. Bron - 36.7
    4. Kobe - 35.8
    5. Gervin - 35.3
    6. Shaq - 35.2
    7. Wilkins - 34.7
    8. Melo - 34.6
    9. Wade - 34.5
    10. Malone - 34.4
    12. AI - 33.7
    14. Curry - 32.8


    Curry has 1.37 pts per FGA
    AI scored 1.22 pts per FGA

    If Curry had taken 27.8 FGA per game like AI in 01-02 and scored his average rate of 1.37 FGA, he would have averaged 38.09 PTS/G

    If Curry was a poor contested shooter, or didn't constantly create for himself, then arguing that the Sixers would have been worse with Curry because he can only hit open shots, then I could see the argument.

    But Curry consistently makes contested shots, and does it incredibly efficiently.

    These are like the two worst comps possible lol.

    You have one of, if not the, least efficient guards in the history of the game, vs probably the most efficient (CP3 is up there with him).

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