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  1. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZNC View Post
    Plus they won some games in that Finals run in spite of Iverson's God awful shooting performances, but that doesn't fit the AI apologists agenda.

    It is easier to gameplan for a guy that you know is going to be looked upon to shoot every possession right? just my 2 cents on the matter

    you could say the same for the 02' Kings the 12' Thunder and so on, if one or two bad plays happen Jordan has 3 rings instead of six, go ask Kukoc and Kerr and Paxson

    I can say well Iverson played with a spinal contusionw(which he actually did) and that caused him to shoot more horrible and on top of that his teammates are GOD awful on offense where you really win the game, the team who scores the most points

    what did Mckie and Snow achieve before joining Iverson? I have to stick to his core guys who he played with the longest, so what did they achieve the most during their playing careers, was it with or without Iverson? now where do you rank Snow and Mckie all time on player list?

    see that's where you guys get real quiet when I mention the ranking of those players because you know they suck bad or just pretty avg

    when its time to say a player achieved something, you are talking about titles, but he accomplished ROY,Allstar,AllNBA'er,NBA MVP,carrying weak teams(even experts knew this),most steals in playoff game, only player with Jordan with two 50pt games in same series,put the media GOAT on the most watched highlight reel of all time, carried Snow and Mckie to playoffs, always played hurt/injured for most part, 4x scoring champ, poundforpound GOAT according to Lebron, culture impact being compared to Jordan, I mean the ultimate achievement is to be in the same breath as Jordan right? well he achieved that, he did stuff Jordan did which should mean something since Jordan is the media GOAT right?
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 07:04 PM.

  2. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    so you just agreed Iverson led the league in steals and did it for 3 straight years, no diff. than a scoring champ 3 straight or leading rebounder,shot blocker, that is contributing a lot

    what could Ratliff and Mutombo do on the block, were they Wilt or Shaq or Robinson like? so let me use the same strategy you use, since those shot blockers and defenders covered for Iverson then the fair trade was that Iverson covered for their lack of offensive prowess? fair exchange indeed, especially since its a team sport, Iverson was the ultimate team player, you want to know who won the league nba mvp in 01'? Iverson and you want to know who finished runner up the year before to Shaq, Iverson

    you want to know who has the weakest support cast to ever play in a Finals, Iverson and his 01' Sixers and you do know that Ratliff was a way way way better athletic fit with Iverson, they did the trade because Ratliff got injured, other than that I would have never made that trade based on pure fit alone, Iverson needed athletes and creators/scorers, not slow footed bigs or wings that just purely played defense, a bunch of Robersons AI had

    now how valuable is Roberson on that end for your OKC team? welcome to the wonderful world of Iverson and the Roberson bunch

    its like me saying Russ should fall back and let Roberson get more offensive touches when the guy is nothing but a dunk and layup maker, and every blue moon will hit a 3pointer as well as airball a free throw every other trip, well that's what you are basically saying Iverson should do, which makes no sense from a winning view of things

    you don't force the Roberson and Snows of the world to do what they are not capable of but at least Iverson maxed out Snow way more than Russ has done with Roberson

    Russ played with a top two player of his generation for 8yrs, Iverson played with Mckie for 7yrs, who you drafting first Mckie or KD? c'mon expert don't fail me and not reply
    1) Yes, and Lou Williams taking 40 shots per game would also lead the league in scoring. Except, his team will lose because it's not effective. Understand the difference, bud? Just like AI led the league in scoring a few seasons, you are an absolute fool to take him over Shaq as your offensive weapon.

    2) Lol. The team was built for Iverson. Of course Iverson would have to carry that load. It wasn't any different with many players back then who had an average team but it was a star vs star battle every night. Part of why people hate superteams is exactly because of this: You aren't sure who is the better player because a team is so stacked. And let me ask you, what part of Iverson's team did you think was better than Vince's team in 01? Enlighten me. Oh, btw, that lone Finals appearance Iverson made.. they won by one point in game 7 vs Raptors despite Iverson shooting below 30% from the field. In game 5 vs Bucks, Sixers won by one point. Wanna know how Iverson did? He shot 5/27 from the field. Below 20% and they won a game. Now, who you gonna credit that to? If Iverson can have those bad performances and come out winning, do you think his teammates are doing nothing? Which one of his teammates collectively shot below 30% and 20% in the games? Please, tell me buddy. Against Bucks, Allen Iverson shot 34% from the field. He took 30 shots per game. Let me ask you again, if Allen Iverson is playing that inefficient, who do you think is making up for it? Go take a look at the series stats: Allen Iverson got outplayed by Ray Allen.

    https://www.basketball-reference.com...-vs-76ers.html

    Woah, look at Allen Iverson's scrub Dikembe.. only averaging 17 points and 16 rebounds. What a total scrub. Ray Allen averaged 27/3/5 on 46% shooting but ends up losing. In what scenario does Ray Allen have a better team this series when he clearly outplays Allen Iverson?

    Okay, maybe that was one bad series. It happens. What about vs the Raptors?

    https://www.basketball-reference.com...-vs-76ers.html

    Oh goody, your dreamboy Allen Iverson gets outplayed by Vince Carter and still ends up winning. Go take a look at the rest of the roster.. Who in the Raptors is so good that Allen Iverson is legitimately playing with only scrubs? By who's definition? Your's? Do you make up who sucks and who doesn't so you can boost your boytoy up? Can you name an NBA superstar who shoots 43 TS% and ends up winning an NBA series? Please tell me who wins games doing that. The entire East was bad. It was a matter of who was going to be good enough so they can eventually get slapped around by Shaq-diesel. And your boy won a Golden ticket straight to it.

    3) Lol. Russ+KD teaming up in a superstacked era of basketball. Back then, you had one star on a team. Now, you're going up against numerous and it's all around the league. Russ would lead a team far better than AI did back then. Not even close. Russ is miles better than AI at performing. I don't need to debate that with you.

    Anyhow, it was fun but it seems your only source of evidence is your brain and nothing else.

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    because you or whoever I was replying to said he wanted the ball in his hands all the time so I said what you are replying to

    I don't think Iverson would have wanted ballhandlers if all he wanted to do was handle the ball/hog it, that wouldn't make sense for him at all to be switched to shootingguard and running off screens to shoot/attack, why not just do like his rookie year or O'Brien stint and run PG and have the ball at will

    for majority of his philly tenure he played shootingguard running off screens all game while Snow and Mckie fed him, how is that wanting the ball in your hands all the time when others are running the offense with the ''ball''?

    people on here amuse me with this Iverson chatter
    Ok well that's not what you said before. You said "why'd they go get snow if all he (iverson) wanted was to have the ball in his hands"

    Seems like you were offering that as some sort of defense against people saying Iverson was a selfish ballhog but as we know players don't acquire players. That's the GMs job.

    Just wanted to understand that statement

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  4. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post

    I mispoke there but my point is that he pounds the ball for too much and stays in the game for too long. No one has pounded the ball more than AI in those years. Not even close. His highest USG% was actually the year after the Finals. I'm not a fan of high USG% inefficient players who can't really do much else. Those are the worst


    NEWFLASHBOLT

    You have missed so bad on what you speak about this its pretty funny and sad at the same time, you are not a fan of high usage players but don't want to speak in the same breath the he had 4 Robersons, so Iverson relied on 4 super inefficient players but he gets shitted on because he carried them, wow

    just like you claim those 4 Robersons carried him on defense yet he contributes leading the league in steals 3 straight years during that span, and he also led the big east in steals while winning DPOY twice while there, I guess he didn't help that defense either while in college if we let you tell it

  5. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    Ok well that's not what you said before. You said "why'd they go get snow if all he (iverson) wanted was to have the ball in his hands"

    Seems like you were offering that as some sort of defense against people saying Iverson was a selfish ballhog but as we know players don't acquire players. That's the GMs job.

    Just wanted to understand that statement

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J120A using Tapatalk
    so why would they get Snow If Iverson wanted the ball all the time or Mckie? I am sure at that stage he had some influence, he wanted Pierce draft night and literally cried when they didn't get him so of course it comes down to the GM but the young franchise players always have a little say if they are really that selfish and hell bent on having the ball in their hands, as you guys on here seem like he wanted, well maybe not you but the others I reply to

    I was opening up Iverson to get bashed saying it wouldn't make sense for him to want those ballhandlers, why would a ballhog want others to take the ball from him? I wasn't making a defense for him because I always thought he was a team player,so bringing in those guys showed he was and didn't care about having the ball in his hands but wanted to win but they just nabbed the wrong duo and didn't do it right in the draft like a true rebuild is supposed to be done, and those moves were really L Brown, he loves those tough nosed defensive minded players, Iverson fell into his lap, its a reason why Brown calls Iverson the most unique athlete he has ever seen

    you don't cry getting eliminated from playoffs and not be a winner, I recall Kobe doing the same after a playoff loss and everybody talks about how much he wanted to win, well Iverson was the same way

    I know he played to win and not worry about stats or he would have been more cautious in his shot selection but he was ballhogging with a purpose, for the team
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 07:47 PM.

  6. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    when did you start watching actual basketball games, and have you ever played because all those guys were ball dominant or labeled ball hogs, Jordan was labeled a ballhog, that title shouldn't change just because he won nba titles
    I'm willing to bet that stigma disappeared - If it ever existed, when people gained confidence that his shooting efficiency matched his appetite for shooting.

    See, I think the term ball hog or chucker is as much about effectiveness as it is quantity of shots or whatever. If you dominate the ball you'd better be elite productive with it otherwise why the hell aren't you sharing it more.

    It's my criticism - historically at least, with westbrook, kobe, aldridge, melo and above all others iverson.

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    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 01-11-2018 at 08:00 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  7. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post

    I mispoke there but my point is that he pounds the ball for too much and stays in the game for too long. No one has pounded the ball more than AI in those years. Not even close. His highest USG% was actually the year after the Finals. I'm not a fan of high USG% inefficient players who can't really do much else. Those are the worst


    NEWFLASHBOLT

    You have missed so bad on what you speak about this its pretty funny and sad at the same time, you are not a fan of high usage players but don't want to speak in the same breath the he had 4 Robersons, so Iverson relied on 4 super inefficient players but he gets shitted on because he carried them, wow

    just like you claim those 4 Robersons carried him on defense yet he contributes leading the league in steals 3 straight years during that span, and he also led the big east in steals while winning DPOY twice while there, I guess he didn't help that defense either while in college if we let you tell it
    1) Super inefficient players? You do realize that includes AI, right? In what planet do you live on does a player shooting 42% from the field while taking 24+ shots not quantify as inefficient? Do you realize that your arguments are poor and terrible because almost everyone would agree that if a player shot that awful from the field, they would be 100% crucified on social media today. Ooooh, I bet you're going to mention RWB here. Yeah, the guy who averages a triple double in under 35 minutes per game while your boy AI can't even get 7 assists in 44 minutes. And who in Russ's team was better than the respective position AI had? Only Oladipo and that guy absolutely pooped the bed when he was here. So who else have ya got?

    2) Again using steals per game as the barometer for good defense. You're real bright, aren't ya? I already told you that plenty of players averaged a higher steals per possession than AI but they didn't absorb all the minutes AI did from his teammates. Who knew that playing 44 minutes per game would get you higher stats? That doesn't make him a great defender. Allen Iverson played for the Sixers way before the Sixers became great at defense. Can you please remind me what their defensive ranking was before Larry Brown got there? Thank you very much.

  8. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    so why would they get Snow If Iverson wanted the ball all the time or Mckie? I am sure at that stage he had some influence, he wanted Pierce draft night and literally cried when they didn't get him so of course it comes down to the GM but the young franchise players always have a little say if they are really that selfish and hell bent on having the ball in their hands, as you guys on here seem like he wanted, well maybe not you but the others I reply to

    I was opening up Iverson to get bashed saying it wouldn't make sense for him to want those ballhandlers, why would a ballhog want others to take the ball from him? I wasn't making a defense for him because I always thought he was a team player,so bringing in those guys showed he was and didn't care about having the ball in his hands but wanted to win but they just nabbed the wrong duo and didn't do it right in the draft like a true rebuild is supposed to be done, and those moves were really L Brown, he loves those tough nosed defensive minded players, Iverson fell into his lap, its a reason why Brown calls Iverson the most unique athlete he has ever seen

    you don't cry getting eliminated from playoffs and not be a winner, I recall Kobe doing the same after a playoff loss and everybody talks about how much he wanted to win, well Iverson was the same way

    I know he played to win and not worry about stats or he would have been more cautious in his shot selection but he was ballhogging with a purpose, for the team
    Lmao, you just admitted that he ballhogged FOR THE TEAM. Now let me ask you, why did he complain about refusing to come off the bench in Memphis? I thought he wanted to do what was best for the team. If he's willing to ballhog for the team, he's not willing to come off the bench knowing that he's past his prime? Oh, and let's talk about his ballhogging - which I haven't explained much at all. Yes, ballhogging is frowned upon. No, ballhogging doesn't make you a bad player. It's when you ballhog and aren't making the efficient plays. That's what AI did. He shot and shot until it went in and his poor dreadful Sixers squad never got credit for covering his mistakes. If you want a ballhogger, you want a guy like LeBron or Jordan. Guys who make the right play and do so efficiently.

  9. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    so why would they get Snow If Iverson wanted the ball all the time or Mckie? I am sure at that stage he had some influence, he wanted Pierce draft night and literally cried when they didn't get him so of course it comes down to the GM but the young franchise players always have a little say if they are really that selfish and hell bent on having the ball in their hands, as you guys on here seem like he wanted, well maybe not you but the others I reply to

    I was opening up Iverson to get bashed saying it wouldn't make sense for him to want those ballhandlers, why would a ballhog want others to take the ball from him? I wasn't making a defense for him because I always thought he was a team player,so bringing in those guys showed he was and didn't care about having the ball in his hands but wanted to win but they just nabbed the wrong duo and didn't do it right in the draft like a true rebuild is supposed to be done, and those moves were really L Brown, he loves those tough nosed defensive minded players, Iverson fell into his lap, its a reason why Brown calls Iverson the most unique athlete he has ever seen

    you don't cry getting eliminated from playoffs and not be a winner, I recall Kobe doing the same after a playoff loss and everybody talks about how much he wanted to win, well Iverson was the same way

    I know he played to win and not worry about stats or he would have been more cautious in his shot selection but he was ballhogging with a purpose, for the team
    I can tell you exactly why they did it and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out. They were smart enough to understand that they had to placate Iverson (by allowing him to play his game and not bringing in players that would compete with AI for touches) as they were fully invested in him and he was the face of the team, but they also knew (or I suspect Larry Brown insisted) that putting in a cerebral cautious point guard in would act as a bit of a safety valve that would give the coach some amount of control over how the offense was run.

    It was done to reign him in.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J120A using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  10. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    1) Yes, and Lou Williams taking 40 shots per game would also lead the league in scoring. Except, his team will lose because it's not effective. Understand the difference, bud? Just like AI led the league in scoring a few seasons, you are an absolute fool to take him over Shaq as your offensive weapon.

    2) Lol. The team was built for Iverson. Of course Iverson would have to carry that load. It wasn't any different with many players back then who had an average team but it was a star vs star battle every night. Part of why people hate superteams is exactly because of this: You aren't sure who is the better player because a team is so stacked. And let me ask you, what part of Iverson's team did you think was better than Vince's team in 01? Enlighten me. Oh, btw, that lone Finals appearance Iverson made.. they won by one point in game 7 vs Raptors despite Iverson shooting below 30% from the field. In game 5 vs Bucks, Sixers won by one point. Wanna know how Iverson did? He shot 5/27 from the field. Below 20% and they won a game. Now, who you gonna credit that to? If Iverson can have those bad performances and come out winning, do you think his teammates are doing nothing? Which one of his teammates collectively shot below 30% and 20% in the games? Please, tell me buddy. Against Bucks, Allen Iverson shot 34% from the field. He took 30 shots per game. Let me ask you again, if Allen Iverson is playing that inefficient, who do you think is making up for it? Go take a look at the series stats: Allen Iverson got outplayed by Ray Allen.

    https://www.basketball-reference.com...-vs-76ers.html

    Woah, look at Allen Iverson's scrub Dikembe.. only averaging 17 points and 16 rebounds. What a total scrub. Ray Allen averaged 27/3/5 on 46% shooting but ends up losing. In what scenario does Ray Allen have a better team this series when he clearly outplays Allen Iverson?

    Okay, maybe that was one bad series. It happens. What about vs the Raptors?

    https://www.basketball-reference.com...-vs-76ers.html

    Oh goody, your dreamboy Allen Iverson gets outplayed by Vince Carter and still ends up winning. Go take a look at the rest of the roster.. Who in the Raptors is so good that Allen Iverson is legitimately playing with only scrubs? By who's definition? Your's? Do you make up who sucks and who doesn't so you can boost your boytoy up? Can you name an NBA superstar who shoots 43 TS% and ends up winning an NBA series? Please tell me who wins games doing that. The entire East was bad. It was a matter of who was going to be good enough so they can eventually get slapped around by Shaq-diesel. And your boy won a Golden ticket straight to it.

    3) Lol. Russ+KD teaming up in a superstacked era of basketball. Back then, you had one star on a team. Now, you're going up against numerous and it's all around the league. Russ would lead a team far better than AI did back then. Not even close. Russ is miles better than AI at performing. I don't need to debate that with you.

    Anyhow, it was fun but it seems your only source of evidence is your brain and nothing else.
    1. When did Lou Will ever have a team built around him to shoot 40x? see you have to be capable and the situation has to call for itself, speaking of Lou Will he just dropped 50 and you know who he said his idol and bucket getting player was.....you already know TheAnswer

    2. the team was built flawed for Iverson just as the team was built flawed for Lebron first round with Cavs, Kobe came straight into a 50win team and that's how you make it seem like it was for Iverson, they built a taem with 4 Robersons around a 5'10'' guy, its crazy if they did then and its crazy if Russ had 4 more Robersons, we know he has one and how good is he on offense? oh we know he can play defense but what about offense? does Roberson mask Russ and guard the teams best perimeter play each and every game and play? Iverson was hurt that entire playoffs and missed a game or so in that Bucks series, he sat out the final 5 games of reg. season to try and recover from the beating he took trying to will those Robersons to victory, Iverson and the Robersons make a Finals trip and so did Russ/KD/Ibaka/Harden, Russ/KD made the same number of Finals trips as Iverson and the Robersons, Iverson is a legend

    I recall a friend of mine telling me right after that 01' season that Iverson needs to run into the front office lock the door and demand some basketball talent/help, c'mon man it was clear as day back then and now

    now go post Mckie/Snow numbers that series as well, and did Mutombo get those 17ppg from demanding the ball or did he get over half of those from Iverson dives to the basket where he collected the rebound since Iverson drew 3 guys on the drive? we all know Mutombo can rebound, his playing card was blocking shots and rebounding until the 3 sec. lane violation came in and it left him worthless pretty much the following season, you do know Mutombo was pushing like 35 or so years when he teamed up with Iverson, this wasn't the Nuggets version of him, and even then he wasn't carrying teams with offense, so those 17ppg were once again a product of playing with Iverson, if Iverson was such a ballhog how can a player like Mutumbo almost double his career scoring average with him? Mutombo avg like 9-10ppg for career, what happened?

    why didn't the Bucks win since they were clearly better on paper and R Allen outplays Iverson? like in game 7 where Iverson drops 44 and wins the series

    why would the Raptors run a Jordans rule defense on him in game 7 and he dropped 16 dimes if he is this big bad super ball dominant player? why did it take two 50pt games from Iverson during that series if Sixers were just so good compared to those teams? the Raptors had more proven players who were aged but still better than the support AI had, Curry was old and could outshoot Mckie and Snow with his eyes closed, Childs and that other PG were better than Snow, A Davis was better than Hill, I mean both teams were nothing to brag about so I guess the specialness of Iverson shined through, I guess the best player won the series, happens

    those were some ugly played games back then, those Robersons made it worse

    I can only imagine had Iverson went to the Finals with TMAC/Dirk they would have done the smacking around but hey at least Iverson didn't blow a 3-1 and wasn't preseason picks to reach a WCF/Finals like Russ was and failed, it wasn't close to being like that

    Iverson was Russ last year minues Oladipo for 10yrs, imagine taking Oladipo away and replacing him with ramon sessions and now telling Russ to go win games and play team ball, he would slap you and revoke your OKC fan pass

    and why do you nit pick and bring up random playoff games of him shooting bad but not the 82 game season stats of his sidekicks? why mention Mutombo 17ppg but forgot he only avg 9.8 for his career? that helps out Iverson and makes him look good because Mutombo would mostly get his points from offensive put backs and a post feed every now and then, I guess Iverson does make his teammates ''better''

    I could go and post Snow and Mckie numbers and you would run and hide in a cave somewhere

    3. they had a stacked team in a stacked era, the GM failed them as I have said what happens, let Harden go for 5mill only to sign Kanter/Singler for like almost 90mill combined, what a management waste

    source of evidence is Russ has played with far more talent than Iverson and has the same number of Finals trips so how in the hell is Russ miles better at performing when he couldn't get it done with a stacked deck? OKC was just as stacked as Dubs before KD left, they were really a bad matchup for the Dubs, that length really bothered the Dubs, now I know why KD left, because Russ couldn't perform like Iverson

    a sports debate will always be fun, but you guys think its about emotions

    why would I need to boost up Iverson, you act like he played with Shaq/KG/R Allen and shot 25x a game, no that was Russ who had KD and Ibaka and wanted to shoot 25x a game

    Russell is better at getting triple doubles, that's all, he is even better than Jordan at getting those, good for Russ for chasing those triple dubs, throw me one
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 08:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    I can tell you exactly why they did it and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out. They were smart enough to understand that they had to placate Iverson (by allowing him to play his game and not bringing in players that would compete with AI for touches) as they were fully invested in him and he was the face of the team, but they also knew (or I suspect Larry Brown insisted) that putting in a cerebral cautious point guard in would act as a bit of a safety valve that would give the coach some amount of control over how the offense was run.

    It was done to reign him in.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J120A using Tapatalk

    it would make sense if AI didn't cry on draft night in 98' after the Pierce meltdown, when you are a 20 win team you are not in position to placate anything, you are trying to get the best young player and it was clear as day back then as it is now that they just didn't draft or build outside the draft right

    being a combo guard he could have played whatever style, he showed it by playing at G'Town in fast pace then slow down grind it out with Brown as coach then open floor style later in Philly and with Nuggs, which is his style, not a grind it out style, open court Mike D style, like what Thompson did for him in college

    if he had a Pierce to lean on and another all star it would have allowed him to be way more effective, you always go with talent when rebuilding, you get other pieces via free agency but the better player will always have higher value just in case you want to make a trade so you draft the best player, its why I applauded Sixers later for doing just that, damn a fit get the best most dominant player especially If you are drafting in consecutive years in the lottery, of course you want balance so you go dominant Guard(Iverson), then dominant Center if available or another athletic scorer/creator, then a legit big man, that's how you build a team, you don't go get the same player when you already have him as they did with Hughes over Pierce, that's just flat out dumb and it cost the AI Sixers era big time

    it was done to reign him in, Stern hated him, especially when he made that infamous draft quote about not ''wanting to be Bird or Magic or Jordan or Isaiah'', Stern wanted to promote him with suits and ties and Iverson wasn't playing the game

    what made Iverson so popular outside of his game was that he was the average person height at the game pretty much, you felt like you could go out there and do it just looking at it from a pure size view, true baller

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    I'm willing to bet that stigma disappeared - If it ever existed, when people gained confidence that his shooting efficiency matched his appetite for shooting.

    See, I think the term ball hog or chucker is as much about effectiveness as it is quantity of shots or whatever. If you dominate the ball you'd better be elite productive with it otherwise why the hell aren't you sharing it more.

    It's my criticism - historically at least, with westbrook, kobe, aldridge, melo and above all others iverson.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J120A using Tapatalk
    40 shots is a lot of shots right? rather I make 10 or 15 or 20 I still hogged the shots, I don't have a problem with a ballhog just as I have no problem with those who have the ball and rack up assists like Nash and Stockton did since they were the best options for the job for their team

    people throw labels around without even looking at the total picture

    I like players who can do both equally, Stockton is a hell of an assist man but when the Jazz needed him to score against those Bulls teams in the Finals he wasn't programmed like that, even though I think he could have helped more, Iverson would have done that, just as he could go in assists mode like he did against Raptors

    a chucker is a chucker, Wilt avg 50ppg but he took a lot of shots because his coach and team depended on it, same thing with Iverson, just diff era same ish

  14. #209
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  15. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post
    in either that game or another game he crossed up Jordan as well it just didn't get the media worship from ESPN and others but it was Just as vicious, I recall talking to nba players and they were saying how locker talk was around the league and they would tell teammates to tape up the ankles extra tight, Iverson is in town

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