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  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    Wrong. His career usage is 31.8%. His usage in Philly was 33.2%. His career high was 37.8% for only year, the year we made the finals.
    I mispoke there but my point is that he pounds the ball for too much and stays in the game for too long. No one has pounded the ball more than AI in those years. Not even close. His highest USG% was actually the year after the Finals. I'm not a fan of high USG% inefficient players who can't really do much else. Those are the worst.

  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    I mispoke there but my point is that he pounds the ball for too much and stays in the game for too long. No one has pounded the ball more than AI in those years. Not even close. His highest USG% was actually the year after the Finals. I'm not a fan of high USG% inefficient players who can't really do much else. Those are the worst.
    00-01: Stackhouse was within 1 point for usage
    01-02: Wizards MJ was a 35% usg player
    02-03: AI was behind TMac, PP, Kobe for usage
    03-04: TMac within 1 point for usage

    Players were close to him those years. Itís not like he was at 33% and everyone else was 20%.

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  3. #183
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    If you replace AI with Curry on the 01 Sixers they would win 40-45 games. Yes Curry is the better player but I don't believe he can get enough out of that abysmal offence in order to win as many games as Iverson did. Not even close. Curry would have to create a lot more for himself and probably attack the basket more often.

    Keep in mind that Iverson took an absolute BEATING when he played with the Sixers. He's one of the toughest players ever to play in the NBA but it often gets overlooked because of how small he is. I don't think Steph could handle the abuse that AI did.

    There's also the fact that on off nights Steph couldn't really defer to anyone on that Sixers team for too long. He'd have to work through it. I'm a huge fan of Steph's but the only person who'd be better for that 01 Sixers team is Michael Jordan or Larry Bird.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    00-01: Stackhouse was within 1 point for usage
    01-02: Wizards MJ was a 35% usg player
    02-03: AI was behind TMac, PP, Kobe for usage
    03-04: TMac within 1 point for usage

    Players were close to him those years. Itís not like he was at 33% and everyone else was 20%.
    And take into consideration the minutes played.. He pounded the ball more than anyone and it isn't close. Those are actually terrible numbers for such a ball pounder.

  5. #185
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    This is no slight to Curry. Iverson is a well-deserved first ballot HOFer, and in some ways, Curry is just as good or even better. I just donít know if Curryís game is built to carry a team of dreck on his back like AI did that season.

    So to answer the question: I think Iverson makes the 2001 Sixers better than Curry could.

    Curry in his own ways makes other teams way better too. The Warriors (pre-Durant and with Durant) would not be as good with Iverson as they are with Curry. I bet the Nuggets teams with Melo could have been better with Curry than they were with Iverson.

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by sixer04fan View Post
    This is no slight to Curry. Iverson is a well-deserved first ballot HOFer, and in some ways, Curry is just as good or even better. I just donít know if Curryís game is built to carry a team of dreck on his back like AI did that season.

    So to answer the question: I think Iverson makes the 2001 Sixers better than Curry could.

    Curry in his own ways makes other teams way better too. The Warriors (pre-Durant and with Durant) would not be as good with Iverson as they are with Curry. I bet the Nuggets teams with Melo could have been better with Curry than they were with Iverson.

    The defense is what carried that team, not Iverson. Iverson was the guy that was just told to shoot at will while his teammates did everything else.

    Iverson was good enough to pull that off, but a lot of scorers could've as well, and better.

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    My requirement of winning isn't about rings. I'm talking about a player with winning capabilities. AI does not have that because of his inherent size. And I already mentioned his instinctive selfish nature of basketball. The guy is on the court for 44 minutes and pounds a USG% rate of 38. This was for many seasons - not just the 2000-2001 season (the only one where he actually got deep into the playoffs).

    Again, point to where I said winning a ring is the only part of a winning capable player. A guy like Kevin Durant might have won a ring last season but he was always a "winning" player because he does more to elevate his team. Russell Westbrook, as I have said numerous times, I have wanted him traded because I don't trust his ability to win on a championship level. I even said, I only liked having him because he was putting up huge numbers on what would obviously been a bad team without him. When did AI put huge numbers up that Westbrook did? He didn't. And our team roster wasn't better than that Sixers team. CP3 is a winning player.. he's efficient and knows how to play the game other than score - which he does better than AI as well.

    I'm just confused as to why you guys continue defending AI. I'm asking for evidence or a part of his game you admire. Other than his heart and tenacity, which part of his game spelled W-I-N-N-I-N-G for you? You guys blame his teammates that was designed for the only way AI knew how to play? When he got to Denver, did they not get better trading him for Billups - who was a lesser player but had better winning capabilities than Iverson? I mean, other than 2000-2001, please tell me what AI has achieved on a winning level. If getting to your team to the top 8th seed in the dreadful East is your requirement, then no offense, I think it is because you expect less of your team.

    Rings is more team oriented than individual. But what matters also is building a team to help your individual players. I have no idea how you can win with AI other than stacking the deck. As for Curry's case, sorry, the guy help built the Warriors while playing alongside the days of Monta Ellis. It's not like they started winning because KD came. Curry quickly became a winner.
    So why didnt Westbrook play the entire game or avg 44mpg since his team sure as hell needed during the regular season and postseason? a franchise player can always tell the coach to let me go during the biggest games of the season, of course his size hurt him in the big picture, why do you think Lebron said he played like he was 6'8'' shootingguard? because he did things that obviously you didn't watch, like the late great Daly said about Iverson, he does things on the court that you don't see, Daly said only difference between Jordan and Iverson was Jordan had Pippen and Iverson had Flashbolt, imagine that Iverson had nobody as a sidekick

    you never said what your definition of winning is, you just threw it out there like it would stick because you said so which is false, KD didn't elevate **** until he got Russ/Harden/Ibaka and they went through the lumps of a young but hell of a core and got a Finals trip until they ripped up the pieces prior to a couple of WCF trips, so KD didn't do **** on his own, he didn't lead OKC to a WCF without plenty of help at his side, which is needed so its no knock on KD, just like its no knock on what Iverson did for that philly team as constructed, difference is Iverson never had a Harden or Westbrook, Ibaka was Ratliff like but can also shoot the 3 now so he is more valuable when you factor in the surrounding talent

    so 33ppg and 8apg is chopped liver playing with baby Iggy and Korver as your sidekicks? those aren't similar numbers to Westbrook minus the rebounds which I don't expect a 5'10'' guy to out rebound a 6'4'' guy, CP3 is a winning player but never reached a Finals with more talent than Iverson had but Iverson took a 18 win team and by year 3 had them in the playoffs and by year 4 had them at almost 50 wins and then 56 the following with those 6ppg scorers he had for a core, so that's the conclusion you came up with for labeling Iverson a loser? got traded to Denver and they make the playoffs as a 8th seed 50win team, let me know when a 50 win team ever was the 8th seed, that conference was brutally balanced out, they lost to the Spurs and Lakers in his 1 1/2 seasons in playoffs with Nuggets, and guess who else lost to those teams in 07/08, the entire rest of the western conference

    He played 1 full season with Melo and they were 2nd highest scoring duo in league and Iverson had Nene for the 1/2 first season and Nene missed all of 08' which hurt them because he was supposed to be 3rd option with JR Smith, then when Billups got there Nene was back and K Mart was healthier and everything clicked and still Detroit had the 4th seed with Iverson until that Stuckey/bench mess took place and Detroit snowballed from there, but it wasn't like they got Iverson and went to 8th seed, they were top 4 in the East and were on the downside or done with their run, this wasn't 2002 anymore, it was 09' and Pistons core had run its course and Iverson was 33 yrs of age so what is he supposed to do? win a title a team that wasn't built for winning it at that stage

    defending him over what? what part of his game other than his heart and tenacity? like his ability to play above the rim, his ability to attack the basket, his ability to hit 3's and jumpers and run off screens or on the ball doing it, his toughness mentally and physically, never afraid of the moment like during his rookie year when he just turned everyone into a highlight, his killer instinct, him diving for loose balls night in and out, wanting to play the entire game, calling out the nba for being fake and many other things that I identify with, not admire

    they never stacked the deck with Iverson, you are confusing Iverson with Magic and others who have worked with a stacked deck, its almost like you are answering your own questions and are still asking why, crazy
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 05:22 PM.

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    And take into consideration the minutes played.. He pounded the ball more than anyone and it isn't close. Those are actually terrible numbers for such a ball pounder.
    when did you start watching actual basketball games, and have you ever played because all those guys were ball dominant or labeled ball hogs, Jordan was labeled a ballhog, that title shouldn't change just because he won nba titles

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    It was a close Playoff series in their 2nd/3rd playoff rounds and you make it seem as if it was a tough Eastern Conference. One or two bad plays and the Sixers would have gotten bounced off the playoffs. Other than that lone NBA Finals appearance, what has AI achieved in his career?
    but they didnt get bounced lol and we faced other HOFers in those series. it was no cake walk and as its been stated no less than 183472234747 times we had the least talented cast
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  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    I mispoke there but my point is that he pounds the ball for too much and stays in the game for too long. No one has pounded the ball more than AI in those years. Not even close. His highest USG% was actually the year after the Finals. I'm not a fan of high USG% inefficient players who can't really do much else. Those are the worst.
    so leading the league in steals is not doing something else from the PG spot? drawing 3 guys at you on a basket drive leading to put backs/offensive rebounds is doing nothing? being a decoy so you teammate can get a wide open layup is doing nothing else? being option 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and decoy 5th is doing nothing? so a player who does that much for a team on offense is now frowned upon?

  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post


    Eric Snow, Aaron McKie were his two longest teammates. I'll give you a minute to see what they were like.
    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    Answer the part about Lebron
    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    So why didnt Westbrook play the entire game or avg 44mpg since his team sure as hell needed during the regular season and postseason? a franchise player can always tell the coach to let me go during the biggest games of the season, of course his size hurt him in the big picture, why do you think Lebron said he played like he was 6'8'' shootingguard? because he did things that obviously you didn't watch, like the late great Daly said about Iverson, he does things on the court that you don't see, Daly said only difference between Jordan and Iverson was Jordan had Pippen and Iverson had Flashbolt, imagine that Iverson had nobody as a sidekick

    you never said what your definition of winning is, you just threw it out there like it would stick because you said so which is false, KD didn't elevate **** until he got Russ/Harden/Ibaka and they went through the lumps of a young but hell of a core and got a Finals trip until they ripped up the pieces prior to a couple of WCF trips, so KD didn't do **** on his own, he didn't lead OKC to a WCF without plenty of help at his side, which is needed so its no knock on KD, just like its no knock on what Iverson did for that philly team as constructed, difference is Iverson never had a Harden or Westbrook, Ibaka was Ratliff like but can also shoot the 3 now so he is more valuable when you factor in the surrounding talent

    so 33ppg and 8apg is chopped liver playing with baby Iggy and Korver as your sidekicks? those aren't similar numbers to Westbrook minus the rebounds which I don't expect a 5'10'' guy to out rebound a 6'4'' guy, CP3 is a winning player but never reached a Finals with more talent than Iverson had but Iverson took a 18 win team and by year 3 had them in the playoffs and by year 4 had them at almost 50 wins and then 56 the following with those 6ppg scorers he had for a core, so that's the conclusion you came up with for labeling Iverson a loser? got traded to Denver and they make the playoffs as a 8th seed 50win team, let me know when a 50 win team ever was the 8th seed, that conference was brutally balanced out, they lost to the Spurs and Lakers in his 1 1/2 seasons in playoffs with Nuggets, and guess who else lost to those teams in 07/08, the entire rest of the western conference

    He played 1 full season with Melo and they were 2nd highest scoring duo in league and Iverson had Nene for the 1/2 first season and Nene missed all of 08' which hurt them because he was supposed to be 3rd option with JR Smith, then when Billups got there Nene was back and K Mart was healthier and everything clicked and still Detroit had the 4th seed with Iverson until that Stuckey/bench mess took place and Detroit snowballed from there, but it wasn't like they got Iverson and went to 8th seed, they were top 4 in the East and were on the downside or done with their run, this wasn't 2002 anymore, it was 09' and Pistons core had run its course and Iverson was 33 yrs of age so what is he supposed to do? win a title a team that wasn't built for winning it at that stage

    defending him over what? what part of his game other than his heart and tenacity? like his ability to play above the rim, his ability to attack the basket, his ability to hit 3's and jumpers and run off screens or on the ball doing it, his toughness mentally and physically, never afraid of the moment like during his rookie year when he just turned everyone into a highlight, his killer instinct, him diving for loose balls night in and out, wanting to play the entire game, calling out the nba for being fake and many other things that I identify with, not admire

    they never stacked the deck with Iverson, you are confusing Iverson with Magic and others who have worked with a stacked deck, its almost like you are answering your own questions and are still asking why, crazy
    Lol, I'm not going to read your nonsense. It was more effort enough for me to have to put you back on my unignore list because of your terrible basketball analysis on many subjects. First off, Westbrook didn't put in 44 MPG because, and this might shock you, we didn't need him to. Westbrook made actual impact when he's out there. He's not just absorbing all the shots and ballhogging but also making plays for others and rebounding. Did Iverson do that at a high level? Last I checked, which player in the Thunder outside Westy was better than Dikembe or Theo Ratliff in 01? For Christ's sake, we kept a guy who shot 35% from FT during a stretch on the court because we needed his defense and because sadly, he was still one of our best players. Funny you mention his 33/8 season. Which player averages those numbers and still end up on a terrible team? Oh, Allen Iverson DING DING DING. Funny how that season he has help and what do you know, Allen Iverson jacks up 25 shots per game - the 3rd most of his career. And I'm sick of you quoting people who quite frankly, no one cares about in terms of credibility. "Only difference between Jordan and Iverson is Jordan had Scottie." Are you mentally impaired? The only difference is Jordan is the GOAT and Iverson isn't close to it. You are an absolute clown who continuously quotes these imbeciles and frame it as truth. I don't care about what Chuck Daly said so quit spitting that same junk about what he said about AI over and over again.

    Allen Iverson's ability to hit threes? Buddy, the guy shot 30% from three. That's BELOW average. WAY below average. In fact, it's so bad that he probably cost his team a crapload of games just by shooting them. You prove my case once again.. "his ability to shoot threes" yet he shot them at a 30% clip. You sure make for an entertaining beatdown. What else do you got to say? Oh, more baloney such as "he was not afraid of the moment." Go save your eulogy for another day. Iverson never stacked the deck because well, the truth is, no one wanted him anyways. Oh wait, wasn't this the same AI who wouldn't come off the bench? Yup, that's the AI. Same one who didn't know how practice could help his teammates.

    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    when did you start watching actual basketball games, and have you ever played because all those guys were ball dominant or labeled ball hogs, Jordan was labeled a ballhog, that title shouldn't change just because he won nba titles
    The difference is, Jordan ballhogging was a proven recipe for success. Allen Iverson wasn't. There's a difference. I can dislike ballhoggers but I can't argue with results. Jordan had results. Allen Iverson didn't. In no scenario would Allen Iverson qualify in my list of being capable of leading my team. And if he was leading my team, I'd fill the stadiums up and forget about my chances of winning a championship.

  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by europagnpilgrim View Post
    so leading the league in steals is not doing something else from the PG spot? drawing 3 guys at you on a basket drive leading to put backs/offensive rebounds is doing nothing? being a decoy so you teammate can get a wide open layup is doing nothing else? being option 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and decoy 5th is doing nothing? so a player who does that much for a team on offense is now frowned upon?
    More nonsense based purely on emotion and zero insight. Yes, Allen Iverson led the league in steals. Do you know why? Because he wasn't capable of guarding his own man and strictly played passing lanes. His team was good enough to cover for Allen Iverson's mistakes. Maybe you heard of Theo Ratliff and Dikembe? Idk, they were only two of the best shotblockers in the NBA those years. Btw, can I ask you a question? Which player was the DPOY in 2000-01? Dikembe. I guess he had nothing to do with AI being allowed to roam around. And you mentioned led the league in steals, right? Yes, he played 44 minutes per game. He should be leading in a statistical category if he's draining all the minutes.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDish87 View Post
    but they didnt get bounced lol and we faced other HOFers in those series. it was no cake walk and as its been stated no less than 183472234747 times we had the least talented cast
    Least talented cast? Why don't you prove it instead of using generic statements. It seems you just say things and then disappear only to say the same thing again without any evidence. And it doesn't matter if you guys got bounced or not. It was a weak East and as soon as the East got good again (Pistons/Heat/Celtics) AI was nowhere to be found. Oh, excuse me, the Nets were historically great. is that what you want me to say?

  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    Lol, I'm not going to read your nonsense. It was more effort enough for me to have to put you back on my unignore list because of your terrible basketball analysis on many subjects. First off, Westbrook didn't put in 44 MPG because, and this might shock you, we didn't need him to. Westbrook made actual impact when he's out there. He's not just absorbing all the shots and ballhogging but also making plays for others and rebounding. Did Iverson do that at a high level? Last I checked, which player in the Thunder outside Westy was better than Dikembe or Theo Ratliff in 01? For Christ's sake, we kept a guy who shot 35% from FT during a stretch on the court because we needed his defense and because sadly, he was still one of our best players. Funny you mention his 33/8 season. Which player averages those numbers and still end up on a terrible team? Oh, Allen Iverson DING DING DING. Funny how that season he has help and what do you know, Allen Iverson jacks up 25 shots per game - the 3rd most of his career. And I'm sick of you quoting people who quite frankly, no one cares about in terms of credibility. "Only difference between Jordan and Iverson is Jordan had Scottie." Are you mentally impaired? The only difference is Jordan is the GOAT and Iverson isn't close to it. You are an absolute clown who continuously quotes these imbeciles and frame it as truth. I don't care about what Chuck Daly said so quit spitting that same junk about what he said about AI over and over again.

    Allen Iverson's ability to hit threes? Buddy, the guy shot 30% from three. That's BELOW average. WAY below average. In fact, it's so bad that he probably cost his team a crapload of games just by shooting them. You prove my case once again.. "his ability to shoot threes" yet he shot them at a 30% clip. You sure make for an entertaining beatdown. What else do you got to say? Oh, more baloney such as "he was not afraid of the moment." Go save your eulogy for another day. Iverson never stacked the deck because well, the truth is, no one wanted him anyways. Oh wait, wasn't this the same AI who wouldn't come off the bench? Yup, that's the AI. Same one who didn't know how practice could help his teammates.



    The difference is, Jordan ballhogging was a proven recipe for success. Allen Iverson wasn't. There's a difference. I can dislike ballhoggers but I can't argue with results. Jordan had results. Allen Iverson didn't. In no scenario would Allen Iverson qualify in my list of being capable of leading my team. And if he was leading my team, I'd fill the stadiums up and forget about my chances of winning a championship.
    you cant ignore what actually happened, you can deny it but not ignore it that's why you replying back, chinks in the armor

    all I heard was Westbrook had to shoot this much and blah blah blah, they were like he had no help and then Oladipo is lighting it up in Indy and now every one is like did Russ hold him back, Russ and KD had a 3-1 and were favorly matched up with Warriors and choked a 3-1 lead, Iverson and another all nba/HOF caliber player would have closed that deal, Russ not only dominated super hogged the ball he played the shittiest defense ever to get rebounds, Iverson played in a bigman true era where they gobbled all the boards,so appreciate the Drummonds and other supreme rebounders of this time, its not many left, all the Guards gobble those up now

    you keep on getting stumped about did Iverson do this and that, and I see you don't read my posts at all you just take a line from it and go from there, Snow was averaging around lets say 3ppg before joining Iverson, after that he had seasons of 12 and 13ppg, now if my math serves me correct that would be a 9-10ppg increase, now if you avg 20ppg then the following year you spike to 29-30ppg would you be looked at as a really good player or no? so Iverson helped Snow raise his avg so how is that not involving your team? it wasn't like Snow was capable of dropping 35 like Oladipo can and Iverson froze him out to 12ppg, it was maximizing Snow and what he was capable of doing, good try though

    Now imagine Russ with 4 other Robersons in the lineup, how much do you expect him to shoot per game? how much do you trust all those other Robersons to score and create? Russ would need help right? c'mon expert teach me more

    DING DING DING, go show me a writer/journalist/expert outside of Philly who had the Sixers preseason title favorites or legit contenders when he put up those PG numbers in 05&06' seasons, I will bet you whatever you have in your account you wont find none outside of Philly in the U.S. nba journalist market, you make it seem like he held them back with the roster they had, he maximized the inefficient talent on the roster, same what Russ did last year until you see Oladipo ball, with or without Iverson Snow and Mckie were just what they showed us they were

    what help are you talking about? and you better not mention Webber and his 2 career ending surgeries, you do know Webber basically retired 2yrs later right? you keep dodging the question about how good his support cast was, c'mon expert you are better than that

    coming from a coach who coached against both I would have to roll with him on this matter, Jordan is the GOAT because who said so? see how that works, Jabbar is the GOAT because I said so, see how that carries not a ounce of weight, why should you care what Daly said, you never coached against those legends, you only watched highlights of those players and figured you know about basketball

    there you go once again not overstanding percentages, he shot 30 playing with nobody who could actually create a wide open 3 shot for him, let that sink in for a minute, how many wide open actual 3's did Russ get last year from mates setting him up? I bet its slim and I only watched a couple handful of OKC games last year, it don't take much for me to see what you are and what you have to do from a player view of it

    Iverson with a big legit 3 shoots 40pct from 3 easily, and his overall FG would be around 48-50pct, similar to his college numbers since he was the same player rookie year until 08', you really think Iverson would shoot worse with wide open 3's as opposed to off the dribble on his own shooting them? Iverson could do what he wanted on the court, he was that good, once again you are looking at his percentage but ignoring the cast around him, was Mckie a Curry type shooter, was Snow a Nash type shooter? would Iverson shoot 30pct from 3 with Klay and KD surrounding him drawing attention and leaving him open? you need to cut it out

    Jordan ballhogging was a proven success or a product of broken down dynasties which opened the path for his ballhogging to accumulate titles, you think being efficient is not ball hogging? if Jordan shot 20 f or 40 those 40 shots aren't ballhogging? you must be on that good ish if you think otherwise, its still 50pct shooting but he shot 40 shots which take away from others, as Pippen and Grant and others have stated Jordan was a score monger/shot taker, and told them before every game he was going to get his shots regardless, ballhogs are dominant players, deal with it

    you are so funny I sware, nobody wanted Iverson yet he goes first overall in 96' draft and then they have back to back lottery picks and wiff on those, its the same situation your OKC were in when they drafted KD as the core piece to build on, they didn't wiff with Russ and Harden, if they had wiffed KD probably leaves sooner and doesn't sign second extension to stay

    if he was leading your team would you be more Sterling/Billy King or Presti/Riley? if the latter then your team would be throwing a parade or 3 in a 8yr span, easily

    Jordan won 10 scoring titles and 6 rings, while playing what 15 seasons, the ballhogging won the race by 4 and has a better ration for 10 for 15 over 6 for 15, so the recipe was kind of flawed seeing it took him 7yrs to win a title, after the true dynasties of the East and West disappeared, Jordan beat a nursing home team in 91', Portland was better equipped to give them a better matchup that year but they failed to get it done, so no Jordan ballhogging was a proven success to bolster his brand and image in the mainstream market, that was a hell of a recipe right there

    the recipe for Jordan titles were bye bye dynasties of Celtics/Sixers/Lakers/Pistons, they all beat each up for years and after beating up on Jordan for years they all aged and expansion draft happened and DING DING DING there is your recipe Jordan scored 6 titles in 8 years with 2 expansion drafts in between those 3peats with the refs in his back pocket, Stern as well, Jordan was the cash cow of the league, he had to win sooner or later, Iverson and Shaq were the bridge to Lebron
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 07:24 PM.

  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    More nonsense based purely on emotion and zero insight. Yes, Allen Iverson led the league in steals. Do you know why? Because he wasn't capable of guarding his own man and strictly played passing lanes. His team was good enough to cover for Allen Iverson's mistakes. Maybe you heard of Theo Ratliff and Dikembe? Idk, they were only two of the best shotblockers in the NBA those years. Btw, can I ask you a question? Which player was the DPOY in 2000-01? Dikembe. I guess he had nothing to do with AI being allowed to roam around. And you mentioned led the league in steals, right? Yes, he played 44 minutes per game. He should be leading in a statistical category if he's draining all the minutes.


    Least talented cast? Why don't you prove it instead of using generic statements. It seems you just say things and then disappear only to say the same thing again without any evidence. And it doesn't matter if you guys got bounced or not. It was a weak East and as soon as the East got good again (Pistons/Heat/Celtics) AI was nowhere to be found. Oh, excuse me, the Nets were historically great. is that what you want me to say?
    so you just agreed Iverson led the league in steals and did it for 3 straight years, no diff. than a scoring champ 3 straight or leading rebounder,shot blocker, that is contributing a lot

    what could Ratliff and Mutombo do on the block, were they Wilt or Shaq or Robinson like? so let me use the same strategy you use, since those shot blockers and defenders covered for Iverson then the fair trade was that Iverson covered for their lack of offensive prowess? fair exchange indeed, especially since its a team sport, Iverson was the ultimate team player, you want to know who won the league nba mvp in 01'? Iverson and you want to know who finished runner up the year before to Shaq, Iverson

    you want to know who has the weakest support cast to ever play in a Finals, Iverson and his 01' Sixers and you do know that Ratliff was a way way way better athletic fit with Iverson, they did the trade because Ratliff got injured, other than that I would have never made that trade based on pure fit alone, Iverson needed athletes and creators/scorers, not slow footed bigs or wings that just purely played defense, a bunch of Robersons AI had

    now how valuable is Roberson on that end for your OKC team? welcome to the wonderful world of Iverson and the Roberson bunch

    its like me saying Russ should fall back and let Roberson get more offensive touches when the guy is nothing but a dunk and layup maker, and every blue moon will hit a 3pointer as well as airball a free throw every other trip, well that's what you are basically saying Iverson should do, which makes no sense from a winning view of things

    you don't force the Roberson and Snows of the world to do what they are not capable of but at least Iverson maxed out Snow way more than Russ has done with Roberson

    Russ played with a top two player of his generation for 8yrs, Iverson played with Mckie for 7yrs, who you drafting first Mckie or KD? c'mon expert don't fail me and not reply
    Last edited by europagnpilgrim; 01-11-2018 at 06:53 PM.

  15. #195
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt View Post
    It was a close Playoff series in their 2nd/3rd playoff rounds and you make it seem as if it was a tough Eastern Conference. One or two bad plays and the Sixers would have gotten bounced off the playoffs. Other than that lone NBA Finals appearance, what has AI achieved in his career?
    Plus they won some games in that Finals run in spite of Iverson's God awful shooting performances, but that doesn't fit the AI apologists agenda.

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