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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashBolt:32025581
    I'm making an official thread where we can all add and contribute to an overall glossary of advanced statistics. I'll add this to it if Indy Realist permits.
    Can you add Indy's post? Or anyone? If not, I'll do it when I get a chance.
    “It’s about winning,” Stoudemire said. “You win, you’re going to get on national TV. Simple. In Phoenix, we won — Western Conference finals three, four years, playoffs every year. We won. If you don’t win, nobody really wants to see you.”

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    No. TS% is just another data point, it's not a replacement for FG%. TS% has issues too in that it undervalues great FT% and overvalues bad FT%. It's not useless but it's not a replacement for basic data either.

    PPP is probably a more useful stat than TS% for figuring out a players offensive efficiency, but like all stats PPP has it's own set of caveats.
    FG% should never be used in this day and age. I always quote 2pt FG and 3pt FG seperately. eFG% is the most direct replacement for FG%.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyRealist View Post
    FG% should never be used in this day and age. I always quote 2pt FG and 3pt FG seperately. eFG% is the most direct replacement for FG%.
    Do you mind adjusting your beginning post and make it a general advanced statistics thread? That way we won't have to scroll through pages to find it.

  4. #19
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    IDGAF - a measure that determines the amount of ****s given is 0.
    https://s26.postimg.org/a20wgmf49/20969116_474690526257462_6125363099198291968_n.jpg

    Looks good in that wine and gold, CavsNation were coming!!!!

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyRealist:32026435
    FG% should never be used in this day and age. I always quote 2pt FG and 3pt FG seperately. eFG% is the most direct replacement for FG%.
    eFG% shouldn't even be considered an advanced stat anymore. In fact, Basketball Reference has it categorized in their per game stats.
    “It’s about winning,” Stoudemire said. “You win, you’re going to get on national TV. Simple. In Phoenix, we won — Western Conference finals three, four years, playoffs every year. We won. If you don’t win, nobody really wants to see you.”

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots:32026206
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    TS% should always be used instead of FG%.
    No. TS% is just another data point, it's not a replacement for FG%. TS% has issues too in that it undervalues great FT% and overvalues bad FT%.
    Based on what?


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    Based on what?
    i'm also wondering the same

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by WaDe03 View Post
    IDGAF - a measure that determines the amount of ****s given is 0.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyRealist View Post
    FG% should never be used in this day and age. I always quote 2pt FG and 3pt FG seperately. eFG% is the most direct replacement for FG%.
    I'm unwilling to say that any stat should never be used. All stats have a context and if everybody in the discussion doesn't understand any of the stats being used it all falls apart. I too use 2FG%, 3FG%, and eFG%.
    MacLean's Law: Everywhere you go there will be a jerk. Corrolary: If you go somewhere by yourself you become a jerk.

    I don't care where anyone chooses to go in free agency. I really don't. Yes, KD "broke" the NBA for a year or two, but I can't blame him for going to the team that fit what he wanted.

    The worst part about the Warriors winning is that now I can't have an opinion without being a "homer" or a "hater". It used to be that dialogue had merit independent of accusations.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    Based on what?
    Based on TS% using a constant of .44 as the value of a free throw attempt. It's an estimated value applied to all players equally for FTs attempted on regular fouls and and 1 attempts. By playing with hypothetical numbers you can get some strange results. It's fine, it's just not the be all and end all of shooting stats. Daryl Morey supposedly created TS% and even he said it's got issues.
    MacLean's Law: Everywhere you go there will be a jerk. Corrolary: If you go somewhere by yourself you become a jerk.

    I don't care where anyone chooses to go in free agency. I really don't. Yes, KD "broke" the NBA for a year or two, but I can't blame him for going to the team that fit what he wanted.

    The worst part about the Warriors winning is that now I can't have an opinion without being a "homer" or a "hater". It used to be that dialogue had merit independent of accusations.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Based on TS% using a constant of .44 as the value of a free throw attempt. It's an estimated value applied to all players equally for FTs attempted on regular fouls and and 1 attempts. By playing with hypothetical numbers you can get some strange results. It's fine, it's just not the be all and end all of shooting stats. Daryl Morey supposedly created TS% and even he said it's got issues.
    But poor free throw shooters like Shaq and Deandre have multiple seasons with lower TS% than eFG% because of their low ft%.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I'm unwilling to say that any stat should never be used. All stats have a context and if everybody in the discussion doesn't understand any of the stats being used it all falls apart. I too use 2FG%, 3FG%, and eFG%.
    FG% has not said anything useful since the 3pt line was implemented. It literally obfuscates the data.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Based on TS% using a constant of .44 as the value of a free throw attempt. It's an estimated value applied to all players equally for FTs attempted on regular fouls and and 1 attempts. By playing with hypothetical numbers you can get some strange results. It's fine, it's just not the be all and end all of shooting stats. Daryl Morey supposedly created TS% and even he said it's got issues.
    TS% also doesn't differentiate between made or missed baskets, which tends to have an impact on the game. For example:

    Player A: 3/5 from 2-point range for 6 points
    Player B: 2/5 from 3-point range for 6 points

    Both players have the same TS% - their output being 6 points in 5 possessions. However, Player B has 1 more missed field goal. That means 1 more opportunity the opposing team has at initiating a fast break (especially if it's a long rebound from the 3-point shot). That means less momentum which tends to affect morale for both teams.

    Sometimes efficiency can be a little overrated in the sense that it doesn't necessarily impact the game as much as we might believe. One of the reasons why Jordan's scoring was so freaking incredible was not because he was the most efficient player (his best single season tops at .614TS%), but because HE MADE BASKETS. He just put the doubt of stopping him into his opponents minds.

    Sometimes making more baskets (vs. just making 3's and living at the free throw line for high TS%) has a bit more of a dominant impact. That's why I don't look ONLY at TS% even if it's the best single stat we have to measure efficiency.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vee-Rex View Post
    TS% also doesn't differentiate between made or missed baskets, which tends to have an impact on the game. For example:

    Player A: 3/5 from 2-point range for 6 points
    Player B: 2/5 from 3-point range for 6 points

    Both players have the same TS% - their output being 6 points in 5 possessions. However, Player B has 1 more missed field goal. That means 1 more opportunity the opposing team has at initiating a fast break (especially if it's a long rebound from the 3-point shot). That means less momentum which tends to affect morale for both teams.

    Sometimes efficiency can be a little overrated in the sense that it doesn't necessarily impact the game as much as we might believe. One of the reasons why Jordan's scoring was so freaking incredible was not because he was the most efficient player (his best single season tops at .614TS%), but because HE MADE BASKETS. He just put the doubt of stopping him into his opponents minds.

    Sometimes making more baskets (vs. just making 3's and living at the free throw line for high TS%) has a bit more of a dominant impact. That's why I don't look ONLY at TS% even if it's the best single stat we have to measure efficiency.
    Great point. It also ignores the overall scoring ability of a player in causing threats elsewhere offensively. I hope we can move away from stats just for a bit these days. It's getting a tad-bit repetitive and takes away from actually enjoying the game.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyRealist View Post
    FG% has not said anything useful since the 3pt line was implemented. It literally obfuscates the data.
    Well, it tells you how many times the ball goes through the hoop out of 100 shots during regular play by that player.
    MacLean's Law: Everywhere you go there will be a jerk. Corrolary: If you go somewhere by yourself you become a jerk.

    I don't care where anyone chooses to go in free agency. I really don't. Yes, KD "broke" the NBA for a year or two, but I can't blame him for going to the team that fit what he wanted.

    The worst part about the Warriors winning is that now I can't have an opinion without being a "homer" or a "hater". It used to be that dialogue had merit independent of accusations.

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