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  1. #856
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    the G-league will have to develop new set of rules and regulations for this to come close to happening.

    The argument young players have is you can't stop a 18 year old from jumping college to the business world and making millions at an early age. Add the fact that college players now will jump to Europe to help support their families. Sadly we have a St John's player hurt this year and he just accepted a contract for 500K to go to Europe to help his family out.

    Would be nice to sign these type players to the G-league for similar money instead of 600.00 per.
    For sure. First step is getting to 30 teams so every team is operating and paying for their own club. There are currently 26 teams with 1 being added in 2018-19, so they're getting there. The two-way contract is in it's baby phase but the concept is right.

    Idk, maybe 2022-23 it only be for it to get to that next phase where it's a semi-legit minor league system and then the following CBA will be the homerun. The team infrastructure may be the most difficult part. Getting a legit coaching staff who teams trust enough to develop top prospects when those coaches can get paid by the NCAA is a tough hurdle.

  2. #857
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Uh, when 2 of the three guys in your study haven't spent any time on the court with KP thus affecting their +/- while playing with the Knicks, don't you think that leads to too many variables for this study to hold any weight?

    I mean you guys really need to stop with all the stats and excuses and look at what's going on on the court. Frank just isn't ready to play PG in the NBA. His best play is the pick and roll, meanwhile he's next to no threat at all going to the basket. I don't care how tall you are or how long your arms are, if you're not a threat going to the hoop, you aint a pg in todays NBA.... with the exception of guys that have other exceptional qualities, and even then, it's very difficult to be in the upper echelon.
    Trey Burke suffers from Isaiah Thomas syndrome, where he is just too small to make an impact on D no matter how hard he tries, and Mudiay has been one of the worst defenders in the NBA from day 1. While playing with KP obviously helps, he is not a magician either. For example, Jack and Kanter have predictably bad numbers there despite playing almost all of their minutes with KP. Why? Because they are arguably the worst defensive starting PG and C in the NBA.

    Frank is not ready to play PG in the NBA at age 19, I agree. I think this was always the case so the disappointment factor depends on the persons expectations. The less you knew about Frank going in the worse it is, I'm sure. Having said that, trying to judge him by the PG norms when he is not the PG norm is faulty logic. The Knicks should not be trying to develop Frank Ntilikina to be Kemba Walker or whoever, they should develop him to be Frank Ntilikina.

  3. #858
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    I just genuinely hope Frank comes back in October a substantially improved player and makes some fans eat crow. Not saying it will happen cause I honestly don't know but personally I still have hope for the kid.

  4. #859
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    Feb 2018
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    26

    Who says your PG has to be flashy? He can sure as hell be crafty!

    Frank's confidence on defense is noticeable and that I'm sure is well known around the league. You don't take on (Irving) one of the league's best PG's with arguably the best handle with a lack of confidence. He had his hand all in that dude's dribble space without fouling him.

    He doesn't have to be flashy either on offense with a bunch of crossovers and in & out moves but he can be crafty. He can use the high IQ he has on "D" to use screens on "O" to free himself for open jumpers. Use the opposing PG's lack of strength to fight through screens to be a threat mid-range or from 3-point range. When the defense starts to check him closer as his jumper falls consistently he can utilize the pump-fake and escape dribble to free himself.

    In the off-season these are necessary for him to work on and be crafty. The kid is smart & has quick feet on "D" so it's hard to see it not translate on the other end without confidence. If this kid watches Sam Cassell videos and apply his crafty mid-range game to his own he'll be just fine throughout his NBA career.

  5. #860
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    I just genuinely hope Frank comes back in October a substantially improved player and makes some fans eat crow. Not saying it will happen cause I honestly don't know but personally I still have hope for the kid.
    if your not guaranteeing it how is everyone else eating crow

    We all want Frank to come back improved I don't think there is any doubt there. I also feel he can improve his handle, but I do not believe it will ever be to NBA PG level.

  6. #861
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    if your not guaranteeing it how is everyone else eating crow

    We all want Frank to come back improved I don't think there is any doubt there. I also feel he can improve his handle, but I do not believe it will ever be to NBA PG level.
    Fair enough, I don't guarantee anything, ever. I'm not a prophet or a psychic, I can only go off of what I see.

    We disagree with our projection of him, that's fine. "Eating crow" just means having been wrong about something and having to admit it basically later. So if you're "wrong" about him being an average to above average PG in this league on offense, and realized it later, you would "eat crow." Unless I have no idea what the phrase means but pretty sure that't it.

  7. #862
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    What it basically comes down to with Frank though is decision making.. His future success in this league will depend on if he can begin to see what is going on in front of him and make the correct decision in a decisive manner.. I think a lot of it comes down to inexperience with him.

    When he figures out the correct time to put the shot up, the correct time take the ball to the hole, the correct time to make the pass is when Frank will break out.. He's an incredibly intelligent kid so my instinct tells me that he will start to figure it out, a kid that's 19 hasn't fully developed their motor skills and brain function yet so you aren't seeing a finished product.

    In my eyes I can see the great form on his jumper, a handle that is far tighter than given credit for, ability to keep his head up and see the floor, a fantastic feel for the defensive side of the ball, a great work ethic and an athletic ability that is very underrated.. That to me is enough to hold some optimism for his future..

  8. #863
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleBuckFaston View Post
    What it basically comes down to with Frank though is decision making.. His future success in this league will depend on if he can begin to see what is going on in front of him and make the correct decision in a decisive manner.. I think a lot of it comes down to inexperience with him.

    When he figures out the correct time to put the shot up, the correct time take the ball to the hole, the correct time to make the pass is when Frank will break out.. He's an incredibly intelligent kid so my instinct tells me that he will start to figure it out, a kid that's 19 hasn't fully developed their motor skills and brain function yet so you aren't seeing a finished product.

    In my eyes I can see the great form on his jumper, a handle that is far tighter than given credit for, ability to keep his head up and see the floor, a fantastic feel for the defensive side of the ball, a great work ethic and an athletic ability that is very underrated.. That to me is enough to hold some optimism for his future..
    We're on the same page. He's been very inconsistent this year, with some bad offensive outings, but that's also to be expected a bit.

    His main thing in my eyes is to become more aggressive, keep his dribble, and get into the paint more. I think if he can improve in those areas the game will open up for him.

  9. #864
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    I'm still rooting Frank and not ready to give up on the kid at all but there were some pretty brash fans earlier in this thread making it sound like "If you can't see that Frank is gonna be a player then you don't know basketball".

    After seeing enough players get super hyped you eventually take a bit more of a wait and see attitude and drop the Sith Lord certainty (Remember when Shumpert was Wade-Lite?). I'm gonna remain hopeful and will wait an I'm ready to just call this a lost year and hope he turns it around next year but lets me serious, this has not been an encouraging season. Anyone saying they are encouraged by what he showed this season is lying

    I keep going back to Dunn. He looked awful last season. He was playing incredible for a month or so before the injury and looks like he will be a league average PG

  10. #865
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    Quote Originally Posted by MetsKnicks View Post
    I'm still rooting Frank and not ready to give up on the kid at all but there were some pretty brash fans earlier in this thread making it sound like "If you can't see that Frank is gonna be a player then you don't know basketball".

    After seeing enough players get super hyped you eventually take a bit more of a wait and see attitude and drop the Sith Lord certainty (Remember when Shumpert was Wade-Lite?). I'm gonna remain hopeful and will wait an I'm ready to just call this a lost year and hope he turns it around next year but lets me serious, this has not been an encouraging season. Anyone saying they are encouraged by what he showed this season is lying

    I keep going back to Dunn. He looked awful last season. He was playing incredible for a month or so before the injury and looks like he will be a league average PG
    It's been encouraging from a defensive standpoint; if you only look at one side of the court then you might not be impressed but Frank is one of the best defensive players of this draft at this point.

    I feel like one or 2 people were calling Shump "Wade-lite" or whatever - most fans realized he was nothing special relatively quickly. He was also 21 when he was drafted, not 19.

    Frank again has been inconsistent. He's also had games where he's had 8 assists, 10 assists, 11 assists, came pretty close to a triple double, and, when he gets minutes, can often put up 8-12 points in about 25 minutes a game, which really isn't that bad, considering he'll likely never average much more than 10-12 ppg. His 3 point shooting is better than a lot of people thought it would be...

    He needs to grow alot as a player, needs serious work on offense in a few areas, but the relatively high ceiling is still there.

    I also don't know that many posters who were saying "if you don't think he's a player then you don't know basketball"... it's more about many fans seeming to not understand or value defense, which, without defense, you ain't winning ****.

  11. #866
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    Here's a good question. What if he comes back and there's no change or improvement next season.... How will you all feel...

  12. #867
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Here's a good question. What if he comes back and there's no change or improvement next season.... How will you all feel...
    Not good. Year to year improvement matters big time. It shows a player has work ethic #1 (which I believe Frank has), and #2 that his upside is attainable.

    That said, he doesn't need to come back in October shooting 50% from the field and 40% from 3 while averaging 15 ppg and 9 assists or anything, but you want to see improvement.

    It's always a cause for concern when guys don't improve from year to year. But to reiterate Frank at 20 isn't a finished product either, just like we're hoping Mudiay can improve on things at 21...

  13. #868
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    id be shocked if Frank didnt show significant improvement next year...

    lets keep in mind this kid didn't even have a training camp with us or even a preseason. He literally went from France finals to thrown into the NBA having just turned 19 and coming off an injury... I dont think many people can really appreciate how difficult that would be for most people. this isn't some kid who's been in the US his entire life.

  14. #869
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    I don't think Frank's handle is an issue. He just lacks confidence when it comes to running the offense. This also affects his offensive creativity. Jack gets the ball and he basically does what he do, he knows how to run the point on the NBA level which helps solidify our offense. You just can't throw Frank out their and expect him to command our offense without a solid "offensive system", like Horny does with Jack. I just don't think Horny is the coach to develop our youngn's. Honry needs to go back out west.

  15. #870
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    Quote Originally Posted by S.L.ugger View Post
    I don't think Frank's handle is an issue. He just lacks confidence when it comes to running the offense. This also affects his offensive creativity. Jack gets the ball and he basically does what he do, he knows how to run the point on the NBA level which helps solidify our offense. You just can't throw Frank out their and expect him to command our offense without a solid "offensive system", like Horny does with Jack. I just don't think Horny is the coach to develop our youngn's. Honry needs to go back out west.
    I mean... this train is one I'm pretty much on as well. I genuinely think a Hornacek upgrade would help big time if we can land the right coach. Just not a huge Jeff fan personally.

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