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View Poll Results: #4 All-Time player

Voters
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  • Magic Johnson

    1 4.55%
  • Wilt Chamberlain

    9 40.91%
  • Larry Bird

    1 4.55%
  • Kobe Bryant

    1 4.55%
  • Bill Russell

    2 9.09%
  • Oscar Robertson

    0 0%
  • Shaquille O'Neal

    4 18.18%
  • Jerry West

    0 0%
  • Tim Duncan

    2 9.09%
  • Hakeem Olajuwon

    2 9.09%
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  1. #1
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    PSD NBA All-Time Player Power Rankings: #4

    Take into account careers (Accolades/Rings/Awards/Accomplishments/Peak/Longevity) of each of the available players and take your pick

    1.) Michael Jordan
    2.) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
    3.) Lebron James
    4.)
    Last edited by HandsOnTheWheel; 09-25-2017 at 02:16 AM. Reason: Added Peak/Longevity

  2. #2
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    I think its wilt here.

  3. #3
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    This is where things get really tough for me. You could make a really strong case for a handful of guys here. For me, it's probably between Wilt and Duncan. Although the homer in me wants to take Hakeem here, I know he's probably not top 5. I'll weigh my options before voting, but I'm probably leaning slightly toward Wilt as of right now.


  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    This is where things get really tough for me. You could make a really strong case for a handful of guys here. For me, it's probably between Wilt and Duncan. Although the homer in me wants to take Hakeem here, I know he's probably not top 5. I'll weigh my options before voting, but I'm probably leaning slightly toward Wilt as of right now.
    Yea.. I got Wilt here, then TD.

  5. #5
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    Just curious, why is everyone so enamored with Wilt? His stats? By that measure, why isn't Russell Westbrook a legitimate Top 10 candidate as he also has outstanding advanced stats? If your argument is Westbrook's stats were somewhat hollow and didn't contribute as much to winning as they indicate, that is the exact argument people said about Wilt back when he was playing.

    Just bizarre we give Wilt a pass for things we hold players' feet over the fire for today.

  6. #6
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    Fun fact: Wilt's TS% for seasons he averaged over 30 PPG is .529. Russell Westbrook's career TS% is .533.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Fun fact: Wilt's TS% for seasons he averaged over 30 PPG is .529. Russell Westbrook's career TS% is .533.
    yeah, but what was the league average for those years? he lead the league in fg% four of those years and was second two of the other years so that leaves just his rookie year where I think you can give him a break. He was also top 5 in TS% 3 times.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Fun fact: Wilt's TS% for seasons he averaged over 30 PPG is .529. Russell Westbrook's career TS% is .533.
    When comparing era's with different rules/styles/players, etc I think it's more effective to measure stats by their deviation (+ or -) from the mean at the time. He led the league in FG% for the majority of his career and was almost always top-10 in TS% despite the poor foul shooting. Bill Russell in the ~44% FG range was top 5 there quite a few times as well. Consequently the leading rebounder in today's time wouldn't crack the top-5 in rpg then. It's all relative. It's tough to argue between era's due to all the changes in the game (rules wise and strategy wise specifically), which is why - imo - it's much important to focus on how much a player dominated their own era, and then continue the debate from there. Russell was considered to have the most on-court impact of that era by many if not most accounts, followed by Wilt and then Oscar. Then came Kareem in his crossover era (with Wilt and Oscar), followed by Dr. J then Bird and Magic, next MJ followed by Hakeem/Barkley, etc, followed by Shaq, then Kobe/Duncan, and now Lebron followed by KD/Curry.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Just curious, why is everyone so enamored with Wilt? His stats? By that measure, why isn't Russell Westbrook a legitimate Top 10 candidate as he also has outstanding advanced stats? If your argument is Westbrook's stats were somewhat hollow and didn't contribute as much to winning as they indicate, that is the exact argument people said about Wilt back when he was playing.

    Just bizarre we give Wilt a pass for things we hold players' feet over the fire for today.
    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Fun fact: Wilt's TS% for seasons he averaged over 30 PPG is .529. Russell Westbrook's career TS% is .533.
    Yes, but Wilt has the Finals appearances and titles, which is why his ridiculous numbers don't feel as hollow as someone like Westbrook. Also, I don't take TS% nearly as seriously for players in the 60s. All-time greats in that era had some truly atrocious stats from an efficiency standpoint. Russell posted a 50+ TS% one time in his entire career.

    But this is why these debates are so much fun—there isn't a a clear cut answer. I see Jordan, Lebron and Kareem as the clear top three in whatever order you want to put them in. But after those guys, there is no clear cut No. 4. I could feasibly see a solid case for five guys and a halfway decent argument for probably another 2-3 guys if you were so inclined to do so.

    And depending on what barometers I was using to judge a player or how I felt on a random day, my 4-8 might look totally different.


  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Just curious, why is everyone so enamored with Wilt? His stats? By that measure, why isn't Russell Westbrook a legitimate Top 10 candidate as he also has outstanding advanced stats? If your argument is Westbrook's stats were somewhat hollow and didn't contribute as much to winning as they indicate, that is the exact argument people said about Wilt back when he was playing.

    Just bizarre we give Wilt a pass for things we hold players' feet over the fire for today.
    If I like Westy more than other people then I can legit have Wilt here right? Haha. Honestly it does come down to how much he dominated on an individual level aka stats to an extent.

    I will wait to vote till Im back later this weekend but Wilt/Shaq/Duncan are probably my next 3.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by tredigs View Post
    When comparing era's with different rules/styles/players, etc I think it's more effective to measure stats by their deviation (+ or -) from the mean at the time. He led the league in FG% for the majority of his career and was almost always top-10 in TS% despite the poor foul shooting. Bill Russell in the ~44% FG range was top 5 there quite a few times as well. Consequently the leading rebounder in today's time wouldn't crack the top-5 in rpg then. It's all relative. It's tough to argue between era's due to all the changes in the game (rules wise and strategy wise specifically), which is why - imo - it's much important to focus on how much a player dominated their own era, and then continue the debate from there. Russell was considered to have the most on-court impact of that era by many if not most accounts, followed by Wilt and then Oscar. Then came Kareem in his crossover era (with Wilt and Oscar), followed by Dr. J then Bird and Magic, next MJ followed by Hakeem/Barkley, etc, followed by Shaq, then Kobe/Duncan, and now Lebron followed by KD/Curry.
    That doesn't necessarily work because even by that measurement, Westbrook is historically good based on stats such as BPM and VORP.

    My point is, why do we use Wilt's stats to put him Top 5 and then dismiss the arguments for other such dominant stats because of reasons that equally apply to Wilt. Westbrook grabbed a lot of uncontested rebounds because he was chasing the triple double. Many said Wilt scored a ton of points because he was more interested in padding his stats than winning.

    Why do we accept Wilt's impact at face value from his stats?

  12. #12
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    It's MAGIC JOHNSON you youngsters! Lol

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by GREATNESS ONE View Post
    It's MAGIC JOHNSON you youngsters! Lol
    this is the excuse you are using but they are voting WILT who played before magic thus making that comment moronic.... Id probably have magic right here or next if we are being honest.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Just curious, why is everyone so enamored with Wilt? His stats? By that measure, why isn't Russell Westbrook a legitimate Top 10 candidate as he also has outstanding advanced stats? If your argument is Westbrook's stats were somewhat hollow and didn't contribute as much to winning as they indicate, that is the exact argument people said about Wilt back when he was playing.

    Just bizarre we give Wilt a pass for things we hold players' feet over the fire for today.
    The thing with Wilt is he had legitimate physical attributes that would allow him to dominate in any generation. His physical feats is right up there with everyone but behind LeBron, IMO. The advanced stats may be a bit misleading. Wilt's TS% is low due to how the game was being played back then. Everything was pretty much chuck up as many shots as you could as close to the basket as you can. Often times, they meant random shots such as guys chucking threes up in today's game. His accomplishments stretches far past stats, though. Just what he was able to do physically is just too imposing to ignore and that's where I think Wilt has a step above most guys in. Could you imagine Wilt in today's league? Dude would be a horror story. Not as inflated as the numbers back then but 30/15 would be his stature.

    Quote Originally Posted by GREATNESS ONE View Post
    It's MAGIC JOHNSON you youngsters! Lol
    One of my fave players but Magic would be lucky to be in anyone's top five at this point.. Duncan/Kobe/Shaq are ahead of him quite easily.

  15. #15
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    I just feel watching him change the game and put the NBA on the world map is just unmatched. MJ carried that torch in the 90's, Shaq/Kobe, Duncan, Lebron, the NBA blew up because of Magic/Bird.

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