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Thread: De minimis

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coupon View Post
    Thanks.



    The pitching wouldn't have been as lousy if he'd signed some good bullpen help. The starters were overextended because going to the bullpen meant automatic defeat. This led to a cascade effect in which the pitching staff imploded. The poor defense from the left side of the infield played a role.

    If Rosario was here in April, like he should have been, it would have saved a lot of unnecessary pitches and maybe the starters could have gone longer and the bullpen wouldn't have burned out by May.

    Horrible injury management played a role, too, but the Maverick's responsibility for that is questionable.

    Look, I'm trying to give Alderson the benefit of the doubt. He just said maybe the dumbest thing I've ever heard from a ML GM. I could just chalk it up as further evidence of his unfitness for his job. Instead I'm attributing responsibility to a cheap boss.

    One thing I can't figure out, though. If Alderson thinks defense is "de minimus", why was he so eager to push Daniel Murphy out the door? After slashing .347/.390/.585 last season, he's up to .348/.400/.595 this season after a 3 hit, 2 HR, 5 RBI day today. Some "net negative".

    My guess is Fred was probably adamant about not dishing out a multi-year market rate contract and the rationale was tailored to fit the situation. Either the Maverick has completely changed his tune about defense, or much of what he says is meant to cover up the pathological cheapness of the organization. There's no common thread of logic.

    That was the question Kernan should have followed up with. Too bad. I'm sure the genius would have come up with an interesting way to deflect it. It would have made a fun read.
    It probably had a lot to do with not believing in Murphy's new found hitting prowess. A .280 hitter with 10 home runs and **** defense isn't valuable as evidence by what Murphy fWAR and rWAR totals were from 2008 through the first half of 2015. His point is that he'd rather have bats who can provide run production from areas usually not traditional to said run production. Positions that are conservativelydictated by defensive play (SS, 2nd base, CF, C). That doesn't mean all of those guys will be elite run producers because its a matter of availability of talent but he'd rather have a 125 wRC+ bat at 2nd with below average defense than a 100 wRC+ bat with average defense.

    And its not like he's behind the times in that regard. You can't be Mike Bordick and play SS anymore. If you don't hit well for the position, you better be Dave Concepcion at SS otherwise you don't play. That's why they signed Rosario in the first place. That said, you have to be confident in whether his offensive ability translates yet.

    Either way, I already addressed your point to Paulie. You can't assume a guy starts off like a firecracker and even if he saves 10 runs over the course of a 162 game season, its not significantly consequential. Dug gave you Rosario's adjusted stats in the IL (which is why no one should fall in love or grade players progress offensively in the PCL) and the fact that his plate discipline is still somewhat suspect. There are probably things they would still like to see him do in the minors but the Mets will have him up here after the deadline.

    Whatever the case is, Rosario is just one piece in a puzzle that is doing well without him at the moment ironically but it doesnt change the fact that the bullpen Alderson put together wasn't good enough and the rotation has been completely inconsistent and sometimes ****. That's been the main cause of this team's failure.
    Last edited by metswon69; 07-17-2017 at 02:06 AM.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    It probably had a lot to do with not believing in Murphy's new found hitting prowess. A .280 hitter with 10 home runs and **** defense isn't valuable as evidence by what Murphy fWAR and rWAR totals were from 2008 through the first half of 2015. His point is that he'd rather have bats who can provide run production from areas usually not traditional to said run production. Positions that are conservativelydictated by defensive play (SS, 2nd base, CF, C). That doesn't mean all of those guys will be elite run producers because its a matter of availability of talent but he'd rather have a 125 wRC+ bat at 2nd with below average defense than a 100 wRC+ bat with average defense.

    And its not like he's behind the times in that regard. You can't be Mike Bordick and play SS anymore. If you don't hit well for the position, you better be Dave Concepcion at SS otherwise you don't play. That's why they signed Rosario in the first place. That said, you have to be confident in whether his offensive ability translates yet.

    Either way, I already addressed your point to Paulie. You can't assume a guy starts off like a firecracker and even if he saves 10 runs over the course of a 162 game season, its not significantly consequential. Dug gave you Rosario's adjusted stats in the IL (which is why no one should fall in love or grade players progress offensively in the PCL) and the fact that his plate discipline is still somewhat suspect. There are probably things they would still like to see him do in the minors but the Mets will have him up here after the deadline.

    Whatever the case is, Rosario is just one piece in a puzzle that is doing well without him at the moment ironically but it doesnt change the fact that the bullpen Alderson put together wasn't good enough and the rotation has been completely inconsistent and sometimes ****. That's been the main cause of this team's failure.
    The key metrics for Murphy were his batted ball numbers. He hit .281 in 2015... with a .278 BABIP! With reasonable luck he should have hit well over .300. And, post-season included, he hit 21 HR in less than a full season of AB. If Alderson was just looking at Murphy's baseball card stats, it was a case of malpractice.

    As for Rosario, the Mets have the worst infield defense in baseball. As of the writing of this article the Mets infield had -32 Defensive Runs Saved:

    https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/mets-ha...ball/241561556

    Here's another recent article:


    Metsí infield defensive miscues are 'killing their pitchers'

    Updated: Friday, July 7, 2017, 1:30 AM

    The errors are bad enough. Booted balls and wild throws will drive anyone in baseball crazy. But the defensive miscues due to lack of range and poor instinctive reaction to the ball are what have been most frustrating for the Mets.

    ďYou watch their infielders, the ball is hit and you donít see the immediate instinct to move, they donít flinch,Ē said one scout who was watching the Mets this week. ďI donít know if itís age and the range is now limited, or youíve got guys playing out of position, but they arenít even making the right break on balls.

    ďItís killing their pitchers.Ē...
    When you go into a season with an inadequate bullpen and most of your starters coming off surgery, there's no excuse for this when you have an elite defensive shortstop buried at AAA. -32 DRS! 10 runs worse than the Padres. 76 runs worse than the Cubs. And that doesn't measure the toll all the extra pitches took on an already depleted staff.

    It wasn't like they had to go out of the organization to acquire a solution. He was, and is, just a plane ticket away.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeGamer81 View Post
    Yeah that blew me away. What a ridiculous statement. Defense is the reason we lost the WS in 2015.
    And the reason for that Murphy guy to be wearing a gnats uniform.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coupon View Post
    The key metrics for Murphy were his batted ball numbers. He hit .281 in 2015... with a .278 BABIP! With reasonable luck he should have hit well over .300. And, post-season included, he hit 21 HR in less than a full season of AB. If Alderson was just looking at Murphy's baseball card stats, it was a case of malpractice.

    As for Rosario, the Mets have the worst infield defense in baseball. As of the writing of this article the Mets infield had -32 Defensive Runs Saved:

    https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/mets-ha...ball/241561556

    Here's another recent article:




    When you go into a season with an inadequate bullpen and most of your starters coming off surgery, there's no excuse for this when you have an elite defensive shortstop buried at AAA. -32 DRS! 10 runs worse than the Padres. 76 runs worse than the Cubs. And that doesn't measure the toll all the extra pitches took on an already depleted staff.

    It wasn't like they had to go out of the organization to acquire a solution. He was, and is, just a plane ticket away.
    I referenced how bad their infield defense was before. Again, even if that's the case, what's a reasonable assumption for Rosario defensively? +3 or 4 DRS over the rest of the season? Is he going to hit better than Reyes has over the last month as well? This isn't about defense, its about fans wanting to see him.

    I dont think anyone would have thought when the season started that Cabrera would have **** the bed the way he has defensively either and with no legit everyday 3rd baseman, that left side of the infield has hurt them.

    Walker and Duda aren't terrible defenders but they've both spent significant time on the DL.

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