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Thread: Next Season

  1. #1
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    Next Season

    So this is just a thread for after the FA and draft craze and talk about next season including what out line-up will look like barring any other moves...for full transparency I am just placing wingers on a wing not necessarily their most played at/correct wing.

    Zetterberg-Larkin-Mantha
    Tatar-Nielson-AA
    Abby-Helm-Nyquist
    Bert/Witkowski-Glen-Sheahan

    DDK-Green
    Daley-Jensen
    Big E-Kronwall/XO

    Howard
    Mrazek

    On paper, not horrible besides our third pair. I think Abby can play a net front role like Vanek did (granted with much less skill) on a line that was very successful at the start of last year with Helm and Nyquist. I think Daley and Jensen could play really well together with giving Jensen a chance to jump up in the rush more. Larkin will need to play like he did at worlds, Mantha and AA will both need to take huge steps forward and DDK needs a bounce back year.

    In saying all of that I do not think we are a playoff team unless all of those things happen and our power play is not a ghost for 2/3 the season and whoever the number 1 goalie is steps up in a big way.

    What I would like to see is us pretty much where we were last year, with those young guys taking steps forward. Then at the deadline Green, Sheahan and Helm (granted he can stay healthy) should all have value and probably one of our two goalies. Some teams were sniffing around Nyquist too last year at the deadline, and if we are in the same spot we are not I would be fine moving him out. We already have an extra second rounder next year I would love to add another first round pick and potentially a couple more thirds. Next years draft right now looks to be better in the fact that there could be a real franchise changing D at the top of the draft.

  2. #2
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    This is so bad lol. Z still likes to play like a C even on the wing which is ****** for Larkin's development. I'd do

    Zetterberg-Nielsen-Nyquist
    Tatar-Larkin-Mantha
    AA-Sheahan-Abby

  3. #3
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    Zetterberg - Nielson - Mantha
    Tatar - Larkin - Nyquist
    AA - Helm - Evgeny Svechnikov
    Abdelkader - Sheahan - Glendenning

    Luke Witkowski

    Mike Green - Niklas Kronwall
    Nick Jensen - Trevor Daley
    Xavier Ouellett - Danny DeKeyser

    Dylan McIlrath

    Ericsson * Injury
    Sproul * Injury
    Last edited by jruGGes; 07-02-2017 at 11:51 PM.

  4. #4
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    Also it's hard for Mantha to hit that next step when Blashill never has trust in him, going back to Grand Rapids. Same thing with AA though in the NHL he has been super poor defensively 5 on 5. I can't get over the playoffs in 15/16 where that AA-Andy-Tatar line was the only thing creating yet were getting benched for Z doing nothing and Dats being dragged down by Richards and Helm.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by BranWingss View Post

    Zetterberg-Nielsen-Nyquist
    Tatar-Larkin-Mantha
    AA-Sheahan-Abby
    I don't really have a problem with this although I thought AA had some good production with Nielsen and Helm as his centers last year so I would like to see him with one of those two. Otherwise I like that second line, maybe switch Sheahan for Helm?

    I also agree I don't know how AA or Mantha develops unless they take the training wheels off and let them make mistakes playing 19ish minutes a game. Yeah his defensive game needs work, but how can he work on it playing 12-14 mins all in offensive zone starts?

    Just like in the business world, the greatest was to succeed is through failure and then learning from that failure. I think we need to employ something like that.

    Also I may have to eat crow, read an article today that said there is a chance Kronwall is a LTIR and that was the driving force between Daley.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    I also agree I don't know how AA or Mantha develops unless they take the training wheels off and let them make mistakes playing 19ish minutes a game.
    Personally, I think we are going to see a lot of Mantha this season. I have a hard time seeing AA getting way more time barring injury. Regardless of what we see from either of them, the biggest issue in my mind (besides the defense) is whether or not Larkin has a bounce back year. The kids only 20 but coming off a -28 in the plus/minus department hurts a little bit.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    I don't really have a problem with this although I thought AA had some good production with Nielsen and Helm as his centers last year so I would like to see him with one of those two. Otherwise I like that second line, maybe switch Sheahan for Helm?

    I also agree I don't know how AA or Mantha develops unless they take the training wheels off and let them make mistakes playing 19ish minutes a game. Yeah his defensive game needs work, but how can he work on it playing 12-14 mins all in offensive zone starts?

    Just like in the business world, the greatest was to succeed is through failure and then learning from that failure. I think we need to employ something like that.

    Also I may have to eat crow, read an article today that said there is a chance Kronwall is a LTIR and that was the driving force between Daley.
    Wasn't the success with Helm like a 6 game stint to start the season with Vanek? I think the majority of that success has to do with Vanek who found chemistry everywhere.

    I am still completely against that Darren Helm deal.

  8. #8
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    Oh hate the Darren Helm deal yes...and yes it was for a short stint with Vanek, but he played with Helm and Nyqvist I believe again later in the year and found success as well. I mean tit for tat, you're right it probably had a lot to do with Vanek, but I think Helm could at least make up the difference in defensive competency that lacks with AA.

  9. #9
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    If I remember right I was really excited when he hit FA because I knew a team would pick him up for a contract like ours...but then Kenny panicked last minute and gave it to him. I was really really upset.

  10. #10
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    Couple updates:

    Tatar stated in an interview if he is awarded a 1 year contract in arbitration and a long term deal with the Red Wings isn't signed the 1 year contract will be his last with the RW. I previously was 100% against trading him because he is probably one of my top favorite players on our team, but there is no question I think he is looking for around 6m in a long term contract. If he is awarded a 1 year, and we don't trade him it will be the single biggest blow to our long term plan (barring getting hosed in another trade like the Cole trade). What can Tatar land us as a defensive piece? One of Anaheim's young guys? Trouba?

    For development camp I feel like there has been less video published this year than past so I can't really watch a lot. Some stuff I have noticed:

    -Rasmussen's skating being a knock on him is showing to be pretty ridiculous, he is beating smaller players like Sadowy down the ice on rushes. He skates like Mantha does, long strides so it doesn't really look like he is moving fast but his glide covers a lot of ground. He is still recovering from his wrist injury, so its tough to really knock him on what appears to be a weaker shot right in the middle of every goalies chest piece, but he drives the net and hacks away at rebonds. Drives the middle of the ice super well and with good speed.

    -BW your guess on Smith is looking to be more and more true come this camp. His skill set is not showing like it was a year ago. Personality through the roof and he is gritty, but I don't think we have the next Wayne Simmonds here.

    - Vili Saarijarvi I think will be the real deal out of this current crop of defensive prospects (I include him, Hicketts, Russo, Renouf and Hronek as the next crop). His speed, IQ, shot are a class above every other defender at this camp and I really think he will be sweet come grand rapids next year.

    -Sulak looks....bad? I read in one of the reports he will play in NA next year (even though his contract is play for Red Wings or be returned to Euro) but I have no idea how he makes the Red Wings. He has had a lot of time off, and just looks like he thinks he is too good to be at a camp like that and out of touch.

    - Cholowski's skating is unreal and you almost never catch him with his head down. Wont be much of a goal scorer from the back end, but will be a good puck mover. If he bulks up and sharpens his passing and can either get power on his shot of figure out how to get it through traffic, he could be a #2 D in the long term.

    -KK looks good. I really can't wait to see him play against older opponents in college.

    -Setkov will be my next favorite D prospect. The skating he has for his size is way above average, I am hoping his offensive game starts to come around and he can grow into his body. I have to agree with what everyone has been saying is he could be a real hidden gem we got.

    -Sadowy's puck skills are off the map, but he was terrible in GR last season after he had an amazing development and prospect tourney last year. I wonder if he puts it together this year?

    -Jack Adams has a laser of a shot, but is choppy and slow. He will need all 4 years of college to work on that to see if he can be a late bloomer that surprises us all.

    - Our big Petr (It will take me a while to spell Keiths full name right every time) covers up a lot of net and has good-great athleticism but heard his glove hand is very weak as his holds it low for his big frame.

    -No one is really standing out on the forward front besides Rasmussen looking good.

    I don't think there will be a Hicketts in this group. Couple of the forwards I like, like Castleman, but I don't know if he or any of the other invite forwards have it to earn a contract.

    Edit: I do take it back, Elfstrom has stood out in the forward group to me. Strong good shot and he seems to be able to keep a good pace to his game and mechanics. I wonder if he gets bumped to a higher league or signed and brought over this year to help from the loss of Nosek and Frk from GR.
    Last edited by pidg88; 07-09-2017 at 03:23 AM.

  11. #11
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    As I've said before I don't really scout goalies, but boy is KP standing out in this camp even over Matej who has pro experience. Just put up a blank in a 25 min 4-4 scrimmage then stopped 6/6 I think if I counted right penalty shots. Very fluid for a big guy and there is absolutely no room to shoot low on him. Really happy right now that we drafted him and he is going to a good college to develop.

  12. #12
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    Thanks for the update pidg, I like the KP pick a lot, probably my favorite pick in regards to position from the draft. He definitely could be a great goalie in this league. Good to hear the confirmed reports about Cholo's skating this weekend, if he can be a top pair puck mover that's solid in his own end I'd be ecstatic.
    Anthony Mantha Breakout 16-17



    Larkin is back


  13. #13
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    Yeah I think he is closer to a number 3 than a 2...but his ceiling is a 2. Has a ways to go in his own end, although he uses his stick very well, and has a ways to go offensively but again he is a good heads up IQ passer...Work on his shot and put on weight to use his body in his own end and he could reach that 2 maybe.

    KP and KK were our highest value pick. I am just extremely impressed with his movement for a guy who is 6'6

  14. #14
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    I don't want to quote all of that. I post on HF once in awhile and mentioned the Tatar situation. Tatar asking for 6M AAV is fine. You don't go in asking for 5.15 AAV or whatever. You ask for a bit more. With guys making 13M AAV a 25/25 guy at 26 is worth 5.5 AAV over 5 years. I think he's more consistent and better than Nyquist personally. I'm not sure if you can do 5.25-5.5 AAV with these deals that Kenny has handed out to Helm and Abdelkader. Why both were re-signed is beyond me. Why Abdelkader is being treated like one of our best players bothers me.

    Tatar's not just going to take it. He wants to be paid and deserves to be paid. He's led the team in goals 2 of the last 3 seasons. Kenny won't like this similar to Petr's situation. Tommy getting a one year deal is awful. We're not competing, he's coming off surgery and you just lost so much value on a one year UFA deal. No way you're getting anything from the Ducks or Trouba. Poor management brought this into play.

    Not even sure Anaheim would be all that interested in a winger right now. They've been trading and developing well with their top six having Eaves, Rackell, Ritchie, Silfverberg and Perry as legit options with Cogs on line 3.

    Scouting report is interesting. Smith seems to be a guy they like I think. He's running the DRW snapchat for the second year in a row, not that means much. I just don't think he has that ability to produce. Bertuzzi had injury problems and was pushed down the line-up due to a stacked team. Smith just seems all grit.

    I saw Ras icing his wrist so I'm sure that's still a thing. VS is faster than Hronek?

    Sulak's one puck drill video is going around Has he been that bad? ECHL? I don't get it. There's so much depth in Grand Rapids.

    First year for Sadowy. That's fine. Nice to hear he's doing well. Watched a video on Setkov. He looks 12. Any chance he plays pro hockey in the top tier in Sweden this year? 6'6 and mobile. I think Cholo could play in GR this season if you didn't have so much on the backend. I'm hoping for a Ryan McDonagh, poor man. 20+ minutes, top pairing, 30 points.

    Why are you so sure Frk is gone from Grand Rapids?

  15. #15
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    If Tatar can come back in November and have a 20-25 goal year on a shortened year, I think he has plenty of value to land us someone from the Ducks. Now probably not Fowler or Lindholm, but there are a few of their prospects I would take. He is a very big upgrade over Eaves, and I think they are going to regret signing Eaves like they did Bieksa and Stoner pretty soon here. I don't want to say poor management has brought this into play yet, because the situation isn't over, but if we lose Tats for essentially nothing then the I family needs to step up and move on from Kenny.

    Yes Rasmussen's wrist won't be 100% until probably around training camp. I think VS is markably faster than Hronek. His small stature may make it look like he is a little faster, but I think he is heads above the rest (besides Cholo) skating wise.

    Hah to be fair I know what video you are talking about and it was his very first go on the very first day and I believe he was the second person to go through at that point. He got better as time went on. I think he has to go back to Euro, because there is no way he makes the NHL imo.

    GR D is going to be jam packed this year, Cholo will probably be forced to WHL (I think thats who owns his rights) not because he is worse than them, but I would rather have him play in that league and develop his offensive game there. He can make mistakes, learn from them and what works and what doesn't, and still recover with his speed. I think that would be best for his development and for GR stacked line. I think you made a pretty perfect comparison for him though, 30 points, 20+ minutes with great stick work but won't be much of a pusher in front of the net and can recover with his speed.

    No I don't think Setkov can play in the top tier right away, but if he starts the way he ended last year I could see him getting some time after December. He's a bean stock, but 6'6 and gifted skater that can move the puck could be really big part of our future. Remember many scouts were jealous we got him where we did.

    If people were impressed enough with Nosek from the playoff run to take him as our expansion player, I think Frk either makes our team or a team that lost a young winger (Rangers, Wild) will take a chance on him. I just don't see a way he is back in GR next year.

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