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  1. #16
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    actually this lists all the options for hayward https://www.ksl.com/?sid=42729511&nid=304 . He would only cost 16 million if he makes an all nba team this year and he trusts the jazz to give him a super max called a Designated Player Extension. he would take his player option and then wait for the Jazz to give him the extension next year. he could also do your idea if he thinks he could make an all NBA team.

    As for him leaving I can see only one team that makes much sense and it's the Celtics. They are already a 51 win team and have a familiar coach plus assets to get better.

  2. #17
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    the main thing i took from that whole article is that he makes more guaranteed money by staying. i can see the draw of indiana (his hometown) or boston (college coach reunion), but he got married here, started his family here, by all reports he really likes it here, and he's taking pride in what he's helped build here, and here is where the biggest, longterm money is.

    i know what i'd pick, but i'm a homer. if he leaves, he has to go down as a jazz great and i'm sure 90% of fans will cheer him every time he comes back. can't help the knucklehead 10% (probably zoob fans) who persist in idiocy. i'm not a betting man, but i think he stays.
    HAWKS '13 ,'1 4, & '15 PREMIERS


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  3. #18
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    The 1 + 1 contract seems like it may be the best bet for Heyward. Gives Utah a chance to show that we are contenders, while staying with the same team keeps him eligible for that special contract. After reading through it, I feel Heyward really has to stay. Once he switches teams, he is leaving ALOT of money on the table.

    I was reading about how we are 13 million under cap and we can use that cap space until July 1. Basically, we can make a trade prior to July 1 to help make a better case to keep Heyward. I have been hearing Dragic would be a good target. Rubio would be another descent target, though his lack of 3PT shooting might heard us a little bit. What about Bledsoe from the Suns? We could trade Bledsoe for Favors... they were interested in Favors already and the Sunds have other PG options. Gallinari could be a good target to play PF.

    Basically, it sounds like we need to make a trade prior to July 1 to show Heyward we are serious about improving, so any other thoughts?

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raupie View Post
    The 1 + 1 contract seems like it may be the best bet for Heyward. Gives Utah a chance to show that we are contenders, while staying with the same team keeps him eligible for that special contract. After reading through it, I feel Heyward really has to stay. Once he switches teams, he is leaving ALOT of money on the table.

    I was reading about how we are 13 million under cap and we can use that cap space until July 1. Basically, we can make a trade prior to July 1 to help make a better case to keep Heyward. I have been hearing Dragic would be a good target. Rubio would be another descent target, though his lack of 3PT shooting might heard us a little bit. What about Bledsoe from the Suns? We could trade Bledsoe for Favors... they were interested in Favors already and the Sunds have other PG options. Gallinari could be a good target to play PF.

    Basically, it sounds like we need to make a trade prior to July 1 to show Heyward we are serious about improving, so any other thoughts?
    Dragic is a great option if Hill wants too much money.

    Bledsoe and Rubio would also be great defensively but their inability to shoot would get exposed. I agree Favors for Bledsoe is a possibility. I really like Bledsoe's toughness.

    Gallinari would be great but it will be difficult to afford him. Even if we pass on Diaw's option, trade Favors, and pay someone to take Alec Burks we still would have trouble. We know who Favors and Burks are by now. It's not like they are oozing with potential and are going to become all-stars soon. Favors is a very tradable player and contract. I'm confident someone would take Alec Burks if we throw in our GS 1st.

  5. #20
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    Due to the circumstances this offseason's best results may be just to keep the team together. If you resign Hayward, Hill, and Ingles you will not have money to sign any other exciting free agent like a Millsap or Gallinari. Even if we unload Favors and Burks. If we can't add to our roster then let's not trade Favors to keep the Miller Trust from having to pay a little luxury tax.

    Besides I'm very confident we are going to see some good improvement out of Hood and Exum. These two are on the last year of their deal and are perfectly aware of the huge dollars that await them if they can step it up. How hard would you train this summer knowing it could cost you $100 million?

  6. #21
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    The locked on jazz podcast does a good job talking about what our options are to sign guys. There are some options, but it gets very complicated and most of it hinges on Heyward. If he does not opt out, and instead plays another year to become elgible for the 35% of cap deal, he would only cost us 16 million this year, almost half of what he would cost us if he opts out and we sign him to a max contract. We can also decline the option on Diaw which saves us 7 million. If we can trade away Burks, that gains us another 11 million dollars. So we can afford a big name free agenst if Heyward does not opt out. If he opts out and we sign him to an extension, then we will not have much money for free agents.

    We do have alot of free cap space this year though, so we could trade for a big name. If we trade Diaw and his expiring contract and use our available cap space, we can afford most big contract players. Granted, that will put us in luxury tax, but it is our best option to add big talent if we are serious about contending this year. Then we can fill in some smaller holes using our midlevel exception.

    So we have options without having to trade Burks this year. The Luxury Tax can be avoided if we get under the cap after the start of the season. I am not sure exactly when you have to be there by, but basically, we could add talent through trade before July 1, then resign all our guys. Which would put us in luxury tax, but we can see how things go in the year, and if we are doing great, then maybe it is worth it. If things start going south, we can clear up some of that by trading away Burks and / or Favors. Who knows, by then Burks may be healthy and playing well and we don't have to use a 1st to get someone to take him.

    So I believe I have my facts right on how things work with the luxury tax and cap situation. We have lots of options, it just gets complicated.

  7. #22
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    So one of our best options to add talent is through trade prior to July 1. We have salary cap space, 2 1st round picks, some expiring contracts, to deal with. We probably don't want to trade away real talen (like exum or hood) if we are trying to make a serious run at a championship.

    So basically, our best option to add someone without having to trade away one of our young talents or core players is to take advantage of a salary capped team who would be open to trade talent for cap space and draft picks. Portland is one such team. Not sure if we want any of their mediocre talent though with bad contracts. But teams looking to dump salary are where we have our best chance to pry away talent for picks and cap space.

  8. #23
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    I feel like we can't have a bad offseason if we keep Hayward and I don't think we can have a good one if we lose him. The Celtics are such a scary team out there that can give him a max and a good situation. I would be so bummed if we lost Hayward. This is a .500 team without him and would honestly have no way to get any better. our picks won't be good for a while and most of your prospects are just about developed.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhopisthename View Post
    I feel like we can't have a bad offseason if we keep Hayward and I don't think we can have a good one if we lose him. The Celtics are such a scary team out there that can give him a max and a good situation. I would be so bummed if we lost Hayward. This is a .500 team without him and would honestly have no way to get any better. our picks won't be good for a while and most of your prospects are just about developed.
    I don't think that most of our prospects are developed. Exum still has all-star potential, just need to see if he can find his outside stroke and become a better decision maker. But he had some wow moments second half of the season with how easily he can get into the paint with his size and athleticism. Lyles looked like crap this year, but looked amazing over the summer. He has the skills, just need to get some confident and figure out his role. Hood scores at ease sometimes, but lacks consistency. That could be who he is... or it could be unlucky due to injuries, hopefully we find that out this year. But in general, I think we have some young prospects that haven't hit their ceiling.

    I agree that the Celtics should be an enticing destination for Heyward, but i think our team, with everyone returning, can compete with the Celtics. For one, they do not rebound well. They lack any dominant inside game, offensively or defensively. Their team in general lacks size and length. On the other hand, they dominate on the perimeter with their defense and scoring ability. But the Jazz (if healthy and everyone stays) is a very balanced team. We have interrior dominance with Gobert and Favors. We are also very good on the perimeter with our 3 point shooting. We have a good combination of veterans and youth. We have outstanding size and length, which I think has helped our defense. I think we would have beaten any Eastern Team in the playoffs other than the Cavs with this years team.

    But I do agree if Heyward leaves and we get nothing in return, we are starting the rebuilding process over and thus will not be a very successful summer.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raupie View Post
    I don't think that most of our prospects are developed. Exum still has all-star potential, just need to see if he can find his outside stroke and become a better decision maker. But he had some wow moments second half of the season with how easily he can get into the paint with his size and athleticism. Lyles looked like crap this year, but looked amazing over the summer. He has the skills, just need to get some confident and figure out his role. Hood scores at ease sometimes, but lacks consistency. That could be who he is... or it could be unlucky due to injuries, hopefully we find that out this year. But in general, I think we have some young prospects that haven't hit their ceiling.

    I agree that the Celtics should be an enticing destination for Heyward, but i think our team, with everyone returning, can compete with the Celtics. For one, they do not rebound well. They lack any dominant inside game, offensively or defensively. Their team in general lacks size and length. On the other hand, they dominate on the perimeter with their defense and scoring ability. But the Jazz (if healthy and everyone stays) is a very balanced team. We have interrior dominance with Gobert and Favors. We are also very good on the perimeter with our 3 point shooting. We have a good combination of veterans and youth. We have outstanding size and length, which I think has helped our defense. I think we would have beaten any Eastern Team in the playoffs other than the Cavs with this years team.

    But I do agree if Heyward leaves and we get nothing in return, we are starting the rebuilding process over and thus will not be a very successful summer.
    You're kind of making the argument for why BOS is a better spot for him to win. You're saying that Utah with Hayward is roughly as good (maybe a little better or worse) as Boston without Hayward. The only significant contributor BOS needs to let go of to make room for a max is Olynyk and they have some highly though of foreign guys coming over as well as this year's BRK pick and next - to go with flexibility for trades.

    I think you guys have an awesome team at the same time. I think everything you said about your team with Hayward is true though. It's an awesome situation and at the end of the day, there's real financial incentive for him to stay. At the end of the day I think BOS offers him the best chance to win of his realistic options based on what I said above but I don't think it outweighs the familiarity and financial side of staying in Utah. I'm hoping like hell tho haha


    NE Patriots Forum HOF (Class of 2011)

  11. #26
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    Hayward has been on Ainge's list since we drafted him. And honestly every move seems to me like Ainge has done them specifically with the mindset of grabbing Hayward. That being said, rumors have him leaning towards staying in Utah right now.

    patsfan is probably ecstatic they won last night, Jazz fans are super bummed because we knew if they lost there's more incentive for Hayward to stay.

    Now we are hoping Hayward makes an All-NBA team, if he does than there's very little chance Hayward leaves.

    Another rumor that popped up yesterday was Hayward is interested in San Antonio, they will be able to sign him to a max deal, and Kahwi and Hayward would make a pretty solid 2-3 combo.

    If Hayward leaves though, our best bet is probably Gallinari, who was reportedly interested in playing in Utah years ago. He's not Hayward, but maybe we could pick up Millsap for max instead. He would certainly come back to Utah if we paid him. And he's a very clutch player. Gallinary + Millsap is a pretty good combo I think.

    Also, saw this thought I would share it.

    http://www.netsdaily.com/2017/5/16/1...ays-david-pick

    He's already been rumored to being with Utah. Seems he is very interested in coming to Utah.
    Last edited by Firefistus; 05-16-2017 at 08:19 PM.

  12. #27
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    Celtics are in a good position financially in large part due to IT's 6 million dollar salary. However next year is the final year of that deal and then he will get maxed out. With the #1 pick in a guard heavy draft they can draft a stud like Fultz and play him with IT or they can trade the pick for a more established player like Paul George or Jimmy Butler. If your Indiana or Chicago and your going nowhere you probably take that deal if offered. That said Boston could keep the pick for financial reasons. This is where it gets good for the Jazz, Boston has Amir Johnson, Kelly Olinyk, and Jonas Jerebko all on the final year of their deals. With only Al Horford and an overpaid Tyler Zeller (8 million they will try to unload) the Celtics will be extremely thin in the frontcourt and their biggest problem is rebounding. Wouldn't Boston be better served signing a PF like Blake Griffin or even Millsap way before Hayward? I guess they could try to unload Avery Bradley for a big man but they will have zero depth unless they invest in the position. Under the scenario where they trade for a player like Paul George or Jimmy Butler the money may work out for one year, but once Thomas gets his big payday they could be way in the luxury tax if you include 30 million a year for Hayward. Bottom line, no team will have the cap space to sign 4 near max players. It's true. Even the Warriors will eventually have to choose to let someone (probably Klay Thompson) walk for a bigger pay day somewhere else. The only reason the Warriors were able to pull this off was due to Curry only getting 12 million this season. That said Boston could have 3 near max players plus the #1 pick and the Nets 2018 draft pick. That is about as good as it is going to get. In my opinion if Boston trades the #1 pick for a star then they won't get Hayward. Lucky for Jazz fans this is a good draft for guards. Lucky for Jazz fans Blake Griffin is likely getting out of LA. Lucky for Jazz fans I don't really think Hayward will shine like he wants to in Boston with a ball dominant PG in Thomas, a hot shot #1 draft pick with a lot to prove, or a volume shooter in Butler or George. He would rather be the alpha on an up and coming team with more money and a defensive dominant low volume shooter.

  13. #28
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    So Boston is in a GREAT situation, but honestly I wouldn't take Hayward as I would still be in rebuild mode, they could be REALLY good in a few years and here's my thinking regarding this.

    They already have had a couple draft and stash people in Europe, they could bring them over.

    They have the number 1 pick, and they know the L.A. wants to draft Ball. I would draft Ball at the number 1 pick and make L.A. Give up every player they own for him + the second pick. You know they'll pay it because of all the hype that's been going through this player.

    They aren't going to need De'Angelo Russel, take him, take Ingram, take Randle, and take the second pick. I PROMISE you Lakers will take that deal. (maybe not Ingram, but take the rest).

    or, you can opt to give LA the second pick as well and take Ingram, if that's what it takes.

    They're salary is going to be so low with all these talented rookies that they'll still be able to sign someone, but they won't need a SF, they'll not need a PF, they'll need a SG. See if you can swing a trade of some sort for Jimmy Butler.

    I think though, the Lakers will do anything it takes to get Ball. You know it, I know it, the world knows it. And we also know that Ball is worth 1 billion dollars (according to his father). So if the Lakers REALLY want him they can pay for it. And with that roster, the future is definitely bright.

    I honestly think that those trades would be fairly lateral moves NOW. But Randle is loaded with potential, and so is Ingram, and the C's are in the perfect position to take advantage of the Lakers. And with Magic Johnson being brand new, he's going to go all in with Ball, he has to.
    Last edited by Firefistus; 05-17-2017 at 04:05 PM.

  14. #29
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    Who do people like for the draft?

    I really like Kennard. He reminds me of a Joe Ingles. A pure shooter with a work ethic. our team likes to stretch the floor and I think he would be a good fit on the team.

    Terrance Ferguson from Australia would be another good fit. Less of a shooter but a better defender. We already have two Australians on the team, so might be a good fit from that perspective.

    Hamidou Diallo I like for our second first round pick. He is a high risk high reward type player.

    For our second rounders, I think we are best off trying to get some European draft and stash.

    If Heyward does leave for Boston, I think we should use our cap room to help a team unload a contract, giving us another first rounder.

  15. #30
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    I was looking at Jonathan Jeane from France. He has an extremely similar body to Rudy Gobert, but being 19 he barely weighs 200 pounds. He has an incredible wingspan and great timing for shot blocking and rebounding. I think he would be our draft and stash euro pick.

    It would be cool if we had a Gobert as a starting Center, then a Gobertesc player behind him, to give Rudy some breaks. (he's a second rounder because 1 he's a euro player and 2 he's as light as Gobert was when Gobert was 19.

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