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  1. #256
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    Don Jr. story backfiring.
    Bachelors III . . . In the Inn. . . Lanas Garage 4/18/75 . . . lpswitch with Snake, Hards and Mendy . . .B.D.W.B. . . Ambition: I want Dooleys Job . . . Saturday Night Live . . . Bathroom Brawls . . . Living at Snakes . . . WHERE IS MUSKY. - John Tortorella

  2. #257
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    One wonders why the Russians so desperately want this compounds back.

  3. #258
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    Lots of liberals (I know FNK is going to love this) are being hypocritical with the Peter Smith suicide. Just like with Seth Rich, sometimes a death is just a death and not a massive conspiracy.

  4. #259
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Yea it's not that they're conservative. I am a big fan of the WSJ and they're just as conservative. But the difference is that they hire better writers and don't chase down looney tune stories.
    the difference is WSJ is yet another media that is anti Trump, of course you like them.






    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Lots of liberals (I know FNK is going to love this) are being hypocritical with the Peter Smith suicide. Just like with Seth Rich, sometimes a death is just a death and not a massive conspiracy.
    anytime anyone like this connected to politics has died it's worth being investigated. if it turns out to be nothing then it's nothing, but don't automatically conclude it's nothing just because some said it was.






    breaking news, and this is where I will again say details are important.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...t-donald-trum/

    Former Soviet intel officer present at Donald Trump Jr. meeting with Russian lawyer: Report
    A former Soviet Union counter intelligence officer was also at the meeting with Donald Trump Jr. and other members of the Trump team when they met with a Russian lawyer last summer, NBC News reported Friday.

    The former intelligence officer is now a Russia-American lobbyist and denies any current ties to the Russian government. The report did not name the lobbyist, but did say he holds dual citizenship with the United States and Russia.

    The president’s eldest son and other members of the Trump campaign met with Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya last summer after learning she may have compromising information about Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton. The meeting did not yield any such information, according to Mr. Trump Jr.
    this has been having people on the left exploding on social media, OMG an actual connection to Russian government. no it's not. this former intelligence officer is now a Russia-American lobbyist and the entire reason he was there was to do with this Magnitsky Act, which is what this Russian lawyer has confirmed and has done more than just this one meeting.



  5. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManRam View Post
    If it's not clear, I am a little conflicted. Because I do think this all matters. I just think there's so much else that matters too, if not more. It mostly comes down to this: the only angle I'm looking at this from is from a pragmatic view. All I'm concerned about is Democrats, the party I must support by default, winning in 2018 and 2020. That's how we overcome Trump, stop his agenda and get things moving back in the right direction. I think there's a twofold problem with all the focus on Russia. First, I think a lot of people latch onto it because it provides an explanation as to how we ended up here, something that people can't come to terms with. "It was Russia! That's how Trump won!" Problem is, it wasn't. Moreover, it really has a whole lot more to do with the terrible brand the Democrats have been putting forth for a while now. And even if you don't want to admit and come to terms with that truth, I'd argue that focusing on voter suppression (why don't we consider that political corruption?), gerrymandering, and voter rights and so on are more of a long-term threat to our democracy that this temporary and specific threat that is Trump/his gaggle of idiots and Russia.

    Secondly, it's not going to solve anything. Say we find a smoking gun, Trump's ousted and Pence steps in, well, little changes. The Democrats still are who they are and rather than spending however many months really and truly fighting for the average person over health care, jobs, education, drug epidemics, the economy, etc., they've just been coasting on RUSSIA! What's their message? "Hey, we didn't collude! Vote for us!". They'll run with that, but ideally also in conjunction with a lot more of "hey, look what we actually stand for and have been fighting for...YOU!". Hillary basically on two things: America is great already and Trump is bad. Let's be a party more than just that, eh?


    In terms of corruption, I don't want to downplay the significance of getting to the bottom of this, because it absolutely needs to be figured out. My concern is more pragmatic. Busting Trump isn't going to stop corruption, it will just punish him.
    Cool, just saying busting Trump for corruption and for dealing with the Russians to undermine our election is a damn good start. Plus, no one single act of justice ever solve the whole problem but it does send a message. It is about what society will and will not tolerant from it's citizens and leaders.

    Aren't you tired of the big boys skating around the justice system?

    The democrats are the same as the republicans except they have a uncanny habits of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory and standing around while the republicans rams something down the public's throats for the good of big business . They aren't blameless for the mess we are in. So they are pretty much useless and have been since the Slick Willie Clinton sold us out with NAFTA and signing the Glass-Seagull repeal. Even Obama was pushing for another lousy foreign treaty, TTP, with the republican controlled congress help. With the Clinton's crowd, Wall Street democrats, in control of the party, I don't expect to much from them.

    The American political system haven't cater to the America public's interest for a very long time. When it comes to foreign adventurism and big business flavor policies, they are both the same.

    Sorry, my friend, I have give up on these two parties along time ago. Let's just clean up this Trump/Russian's mess since it is foremost on our plate and then move on down the line. They, Trump, the republicans and russians are hopeing that the American's public get tired of this and move on to another political outrage. Odds are they will skate from under their corruption, others have before.

  6. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialFNK View Post
    the difference is WSJ is yet another media that is anti Trump, of course you like them.








    anytime anyone like this connected to politics has died it's worth being investigated. if it turns out to be nothing then it's nothing, but don't automatically conclude it's nothing just because some said it was.
    What evidence do you have that the WSJ is anti-Trump? I would ask you to back that up with facts. Are all their editors fans? Probably not. Do some of their opinion folks like him? Probably not. But their straight news is just slightly right of center and their politics section is a mix of stories that paint Trump in a good or bad light and that's the same for their opinion section. Just because they don't felate him like Fox News does, absolutely doesn't evidence anti-Trump bias.

    You are right that it should be investigated, but not because of their stature in politics. The assumption should not be grandiose like they always are.

  7. #262
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    Damn another Russian is reported to have been in the meeting. How many more updates do we need before we find out Putin was really there?

  8. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by fingerbang View Post
    Don Jr. story backfiring.
    Speak on this. Nothing probably comes from it because Congress still won't care, but it's driving Trump buts and he just hit an all time low approval on right-skewed Rasmussen today. Petty as those two things may be, they're great things for opposition. I'm skeptical that Russia is the thing the left should be banking on for elections, but it certainly isn't making new fans for Trump.

    Also, more smoke keeps coming.



    WES, I'll respond when I'm on a computer.

  9. #264
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    Trump being removed from office is unlikely to happen given GOP control of the House and Senate. So that aspect is extremely unlikely but he's definitely been a neutered president due to it and faces incredibly low odds of re-election in 2020. I definitely don't think it's impossible for him to win given the partisan nature of the elections. Him having an (R) behind his name is good enough for a vast swath of the electorate just like the (D) is enough for many Democrats.

  10. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManRam View Post
    Speak on this. Nothing probably comes from it because Congress still won't care, but it's driving Trump buts and he just hit an all time low approval on right-skewed Rasmussen today. Petty as those two things may be, they're great things for opposition. I'm skeptical that Russia is the thing the left should be banking on for elections, but it certainly isn't making new fans for Trump.

    Also, more smoke keeps coming.



    WES, I'll respond when I'm on a computer.
    Will he tweet about Rasmussen today?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    What evidence do you have that the WSJ is anti-Trump? I would ask you to back that up with facts. Are all their editors fans? Probably not. Do some of their opinion folks like him? Probably not. But their straight news is just slightly right of center and their politics section is a mix of stories that paint Trump in a good or bad light and that's the same for their opinion section. Just because they don't felate him like Fox News does, absolutely doesn't evidence anti-Trump bias.

    You are right that it should be investigated, but not because of their stature in politics. The assumption should not be grandiose like they always are.
    is everything at WSJ anti Trump? no. but when they like many other similar media continually run anti Trump trash stories they're going to get that label.

    I read one article that went over the bias in an anti Trump WSJ article.
    I've read people complaining about anti Trump stories from WSJ, but I can't post who they are.

    it's the reason any media decide to have anti Trump stories. media's number one goal is not journalism or to inform the public about news, the number one goal is profit and ratings/hits. some media have decided that anti Trump stories whether they can be proven accurate or not get them more ratings/hits.





    more on this Russian meeting.

    http://thehill.com/homenews/administ...moscow-figures

    Russian lobbying that touched Trump tied to Moscow figures
    The Russian lobbying effort that pierced President Donald Trump’s inner circle and touched Democratic and Republican lawmakers was directly connected to three Moscow businessmen, according to lobbying registration records and interviews.

    The lobbying campaign was led by Russian-American lobbyist Rinat Akhmetshin and his lobbying partner Robert Arakelian, but also involved a former Democratic congressman and a former Export-Import Bank official, lobbying disclosure forms show.

    Akhmetshin and Arakelian filed a series of lobbying disclosure reports in 2016 and 2017 detailing their work for a group called The Human Rights Accountability Global Initiative Foundation. They reported lobbying on adoption issues related to the Magnitsky Act, a U.S. law reviled by Vladimir Putin that sanctioned Russia for human rights abuses in the death of a Russian whistleblower named Sergei Magnitsky.

    The reports indicated at least $50,000 was spent on the group’s lobbying effort and that three Russian businessmen — Denis Katsyv, Mikhail Ponomarev and Albert Nasibulin of Moscow — had a direct interest in the outcome of the lobbying results.

    “Mikhail Ponomarev, Albert Nasibulin and Denis Katsyv support policies that would reinstate the ability for U.S. citizens to adopt Russian children,” several of the lobbying reports state in a section requesting the disclosure of foreign entities that were interested or directed the lobbying campaign.

    The report indicated the Russian businessmen, however, did not contribute money to the lobbying effort or own a piece of the lobbying group Akhmetshin registered.

    Katsyv is most known in the West of the three Moscow businessmen because he owned a Cyprus-based company, Prevezon Group, that in 2013 was pursued by the U.S. Justice Department for a multimillion dollar civil asset forfeiture proceeding tied to the Magnitsky case. His company recently settled the civil proceeding with the U.S. government for about $6 million.

    In late 2015, Natalia Veselnitskaya, the Russian lawyer at the center of controversy for meeting with Donald Trump Jr., received a special waiver to come to the U.S. to represent Prevezon in the case.

    One congressional aide with knowledge of the effort described the anti-Magnitsky push as “extremely expensive, well-resourced and aggressive.”

    “It didn’t succeed but it was far more sophisticated and tenacious than their prior efforts,” the source said.

    Lawmakers and congressional staff said they sometimes were approached out of the blue by lobbyists like Akhmetshin in congressional hallways or offices for a pitch on why the Magnitsky Act should be repealed.

    Rep. Gregory Meeks, a Democrat from New York, was one of the targets.

    Those close to Meeks say the congressman was solidly supportive of the Magnitsky Act and had long intended to back the effort. Meeks met frequently with Bill Browder, the investment fund manager who was close with Magnitsky and is furious over the attempts to sink the measure.

    But former Congressman Ron Dellums, a California Democrat, and Akhmetshin sought meetings with Meeks nonetheless. The efforts were facilitated by Paul Behrends, a staffer for Rep. Dana Rohrabacher (R-Calif.), sources said.

    After several unsuccessful attempts to get an audience with Meeks, Dellums and Akhmetshin buttonholed him in the hallways of Congress to give their anti-Magnitsky pitch.

    This was typical of the approach, Capitol Hill staffers say. Stories of the two hanging around to chase lawmakers circulated among chiefs of staff and lawmakers on Capitol Hill.

    “They were stalking the halls to find folks,” one Capitol Hill staffer said. “They would hang around the hallways for hours.”

    “It was desperate,” said another staffer. “If they couldn’t get meetings they’d walk into people’s offices unannounced or tag folks in the hallway or around the floor.”

    In addition to Meeks, the lobbyist duo also tried to get meetings with Rep. Eliot Engel (D-N.Y.), but never cornered him. They also sought out Reps. French Hill (R-Ark.) and Jim McGovern (D-Mass.), who introduced the 2012 bill. Hill’s office did not respond to a request for comment and McGovern’s office said it had no records of a meeting with Dellums or Akhmetshin.

    All of the congressmen who were targeted by the lobbyists voted in favor of the Magnitsky Act.

    The lobbying forms did not provide more detail about the other two Russian businessmen, but they do list a handful of American officials who also registered to support The Human Rights Accountability Global Initiative Foundation in its lobbying effort.

    Among them were Dellums and former Export-Import Bank General Counsel Howard Schweitzer. Dellums reported less than $5,000 in lobbying income, while Schweitzer’s firm reported about $70,000 in lobbying income from the campaign, the reports state.

    Dellums’ lobbying report disclosed he understood the lobbying work was connected to the three Russian businessmen, the records show.

    Akhmetshin acknowledged to The Associated Press on Friday that he joined Veselnitskaya at a meeting in June 2016 with Trump Jr., President Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner and former Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort at Trump Tower.

    Those who reported getting contacted by the lobbying effort, including Trump Jr., said it focused predominantly on repealing the Magnitsky Act against Russia and opening the door for Putin to restore Russian adoptions for American parents.

    The two issues were inextricably linked since the U.S. law was passed by a bipartisan majority in Congress in 2012 and signed by former President Obama.

    The lobbying effort also included an anti-Magnitsky movie at the Newseum.

    Top staffers for Engel and Rohrabacher, representing opposing sides of the issue, attended the viewing, as did two State Department employees.

    The screening was emceed by legendary journalist Seymour Hersh. Hersh told The Hill that he did not accept any money for the appearance.

    Hersh said he agreed to participate because the adoption issue is important to him.

    “The only motive I had was to work this adoption stuff out and end this impasse,” he said. “People are forgetting it was very tragic for a lot of people.”

    He said he has known Akhmetshin for years and pushed back at the characterization of him in the press.

    “Rinat is not a gangster or a mobster and he’s not a spy,” Hersh said. “He was on a military base at one point but these characterizations of him are getting out of control.”
    from everything I have read, everyone involved in this meeting was about the Magnitsky Act and nothing to do with Hillary Clinton.
    everything and everyone about this meeting should just be put out there. I'm fine with it all being investigated. but right now based on everything I have read there isn't anything wrong that happened in this meeting that amounted to nothing.
    I have also said that I don't think DTJ should have taken this meeting. he should have saw that it was someone that was Russian and done more research into her and whether it was worth it/appropriate to take the meeting. I think he was influenced by wanting dirt on Hillary so bad it impaired his judgement.

    I have also read just some where people have been saying this was a set up against Donald Trump and people connected to him by the left. I didn't read much into that. if any of that is true I'm sure it will come out.



  12. #267
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    I really have no clue what happened. Maybe he had the meeting because he's in cahoots with Russia but there's also a real good reason to believe he was set up. The Russian lawyer has ties to the democratic party and the DOJ granted her access when she didn't get a visa. Then Lynch had Manofort (attended meeting) wiretapped.
    Bachelors III . . . In the Inn. . . Lanas Garage 4/18/75 . . . lpswitch with Snake, Hards and Mendy . . .B.D.W.B. . . Ambition: I want Dooleys Job . . . Saturday Night Live . . . Bathroom Brawls . . . Living at Snakes . . . WHERE IS MUSKY. - John Tortorella

  13. #268
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    That or the Trump's big liaison with the Ruskies was the beauty pageant guy which is kinda hard to believe, lol.
    Bachelors III . . . In the Inn. . . Lanas Garage 4/18/75 . . . lpswitch with Snake, Hards and Mendy . . .B.D.W.B. . . Ambition: I want Dooleys Job . . . Saturday Night Live . . . Bathroom Brawls . . . Living at Snakes . . . WHERE IS MUSKY. - John Tortorella

  14. #269
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    Did the DOJ agent authority over the visa process under Obama and then immediately give that authority back to the State Department while I was in my coma? Damn wild times. Covfefe is a hell of a drug...

  15. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Did the DOJ agent authority over the visa process under Obama and then immediately give that authority back to the State Department while I was in my coma? Damn wild times. Covfefe is a hell of a drug...
    It's amazing how Trump and his cohorts continue to blame Obama, like a 5 year old trying to deflect the blame for what he did on his three year old sibling.

    They even lie like a 5 year old when they said stuff that can easily be and quickly disproved with a internet search

    To top it all off, I had to watch Trump play alpha dog hand shaker with the French PM. It was like watching a old Marx Brothers' movie. What next for this childish president, Indian leg wrestling on the Senate floor to prove he is a alpha male at seventy? His need to appear dominate is troublesome.

    Watching these guys is like reliving my child rearing years

    By the way, Groucho Marx playing a government leader in Duck Soup is prophetic "Who are you going to believe? me or your lying eyes?" should be Trump's motto.
    Last edited by WES445; 07-17-2017 at 10:39 AM.

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