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  1. #256
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasperX22 View Post
    Lord. I'm willing to bet Weal never in his life scores 20 goals in a NHL season. Anyone remember when Brandon Porto scored 22 goals a couple seasons ago in half a season? Same ordeal. Perfect set of circumstances led to a 22 goal 2 assist season in 49 games. Followed that with 14 and 8. If you are hoping Weal is skilled enough to be a 20 goal scorer, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. 10 would be a solid season. 15 would be great. Depth scoring is important, but he's not a player that any tears should be shed over if he is lost.
    That's what Calgary said about St. Louis.

    That's what we thought about Bobrovsky.

    That's what they thought about Kris Draper.

    Markus Naslund, chara, this list continues by the way.

    Just because he HASN'T done it, doesn't mean he can't. It takes opportunity to succeed.

    He's already out produced raffl in less than half the games. And raffls most common linemates were G, jake and couts.

    I don't see how a known bottom six forward, is more valuable than a younger, more skilled, forward who has more upside.

    Unless you only concern yourself with the players floor, it doesn't make any sense. And if that's how you're building, you won't win a cup any time soon.

  2. #257
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    South Jersey
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    13,849
    Don't list players like that in this situation; there are players like that, yes; there are FAR more players that absolutely **** the bed.


    It's really not so much about value as it is about circumstance. Weal doesn't HAVE to be protected, because he's not under contract. As I've said multiple times, IMO, if I'm Hextall, I'm agreeing "in principle" to a deal with Jordan Weal, behind closed doors, to sign him on July 1st. I then protect Raffl and sign Weal on July 1st.

    LV can decide to take Weal anyway - they are allowed I believe up to 10 free agents on their roster (UFA or RFA). But the risk there is obvious: Weal as a UFA can decide not to sign there even after being selected. So my assumption is LV will be taking mostly RFAs because they would have their rights and would therefore be much easier to sign.

    Could Weal decide to sign with LV in that situation if they promised him a prominent role? Sure. But given the landscape of players available, I find it unlikely they would promise a 25 year old with 37 NHL games under his belt a prominent role on their team.


    If the Flyers sign Weal, yeah, you probably have to protect him. But to me, it doesn't make that much sense to sign him before July 1st. Like I said, come to some sort of handshake agreement to bring him back; he wants to be back, Hextall wants him back. Do it in such a way that you don't have to lose Raffl, too.

    Raffl is still a valuable player and Weal is still a relative unknown given his small sample size. He's 25; there's not a lot of upside left there. To expect him to become a 20 goal scorer really isn't fair to Weal or the Flyers. If he does, great; but to expect that is getting caught up in a nice run.

  3. #258
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    Jul 2008
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    5,232
    I also want to add that Leier and Laberge are going to be challenging for a spot over the next two years, and I love both of their games in a bottom 6 role. Laberge can score, skate, and is 6'1" ... he does virtually all the same things Weal does well too. Don't sleep on our forward prospect pool, sure there isn't a a clear 1st line wing outside of Lindblom and TK, but we have high end talent for the bottom 9 of our lineup and we have plenty of 1st line players. We need to stop acting like this team has 0 scoring using this year as the barometer ... ive watched Lindblom a lot, been posting about him for nearly 2 years, he is the real deal and a 1st LW talent ... one player addition can make the rest of the team play by giving the lineup better structure and clearly defined roles.

  4. #259
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
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    55
    Quote Originally Posted by txravis12 View Post
    That's what Calgary said about St. Louis.

    That's what we thought about Bobrovsky.

    That's what they thought about Kris Draper.

    Markus Naslund, chara, this list continues by the way.

    Just because he HASN'T done it, doesn't mean he can't. It takes opportunity to succeed.

    He's already out produced raffl in less than half the games. And raffls most common linemates were G, jake and couts.

    I don't see how a known bottom six forward, is more valuable than a younger, more skilled, forward who has more upside.

    Unless you only concern yourself with the players floor, it doesn't make any sense. And if that's how you're building, you won't win a cup any time soon.
    Vile Leino had a fantastic stretch with us for our cup run. Briere, Hartnell, and Leino tore other teams to absolute SHREDS. He looked as can't miss as could be. For Olli Tollefsson? Win....

    But, he couldn't keep that performance up consistently, teams learned how to play him, and he went to Buffalo on a monster deal and ended up getting bought out.

    Weal is a nice player, he's not someone I'd cry over if we lost him. I'm more interested in signing Spencer Foo to pair with Vecchione. That's a more proven commodity (at a less significant level), all you need to do to make that line productive would be stick another body out there. They know how to play together, Foo gets dirty, and he's a bigger body. If Hak wants to play that high low game, having chemistry with the forwards knowing where there linemates are after they collect a rebound is huge.

  5. #260
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    Feb 2009
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    2,331
    I love how some of you are changing it into a 'shedding tears' discussion. The point of the matter is that our forward pool is too thin to just say, "Oh you probably just had a strong stretch there, so MAYBE we will give you a contract..."

    I know what you are saying PEM, but LV can sign him prior to the expansion draft. If we sign him and say that we are protecting him, we are good. Maybe I am missing something, but what is stopping them from signing Weal in the case that we don't sign him? I honestly don't see Raffl as a piece in our puzzle 2 years from now. With Lindblom, Konecny, Rubstov, and probably a FA acquisition being mainstays at that point, where is the room for Raffl in a team that looks like....

    TK - G - Jake
    Schenn - Couts - Simmonds
    Lindblom - Rubstov - Laberge/Vorobyov/Weal
    Vecchionne - Voro - Laberge

    Yeah you can plug him in that 3rd line, but I think Weal is better fitted there. That team has the ability to be downright nasty.

    BTW...I don't know if anyone saw, but we signed Voro to a waiver exempt 785k per contract yesterday.

  6. #261
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    Feb 2009
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    2,331
    I just like Weal...I say give the kid a shot. My question was serious though: Does anything stop LV from signing Weal if we wait until July 1st? I thought they could sign him prior to the ED.

  7. #262
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    Jul 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by LLMunchie619 View Post
    I just like Weal...I say give the kid a shot. My question was serious though: Does anything stop LV from signing Weal if we wait until July 1st? I thought they could sign him prior to the ED.
    Vegas gets a 24-48 hour window before giving their list into to the league office to negotiate with pending UFAs.

    Once again, when the flyers best asset available is Nick cousins or Scott laughton. I find it hard to believe they won't offer weal a fairly large over payment on a short deal.


    The players they have to pick from will mostly be either aging, bad contracts or bottom.six guys at best.


    I understand he's 25. The upside isn't in development, the upside is in what he can do in a full season. He scored at a 30 goal pace for half the season. If you are a new team, with 0 nhl players you have zero reason not to take him and find out what he is.

    The Ville leino comparison Is a really nice one. But even the flyers got a good full season out of him before allowing buffalo to overpay him.

    This is exactly the same conversation we had this past preseason. The kids produced everywhere. The kid looks like he belongs in a small sample size. There Is no way to convince me he doesn't deserve a chance to stick.

    However you guys read this like I'm saying he's an all-star. And that hexy should bebe fired if he's allowed to leave. I was right in preseason about him being able to play at this level, and I'm fairly sure I'm right again. I haven't seen enough to tell you how good he actually is. But I've seen enough to know he should be in Orange and black next season.

  8. #263
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    Feb 2009
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    2,331
    Quote Originally Posted by txravis12 View Post
    Vegas gets a 24-48 hour window before giving their list into to the league office to negotiate with pending UFAs.

    Once again, when the flyers best asset available is Nick cousins or Scott laughton. I find it hard to believe they won't offer weal a fairly large over payment on a short deal.


    The players they have to pick from will mostly be either aging, bad contracts or bottom.six guys at best.


    I understand he's 25. The upside isn't in development, the upside is in what he can do in a full season. He scored at a 30 goal pace for half the season. If you are a new team, with 0 nhl players you have zero reason not to take him and find out what he is.

    The Ville leino comparison Is a really nice one. But even the flyers got a good full season out of him before allowing buffalo to overpay him.

    This is exactly the same conversation we had this past preseason. The kids produced everywhere. The kid looks like he belongs in a small sample size. There Is no way to convince me he doesn't deserve a chance to stick.

    However you guys read this like I'm saying he's an all-star. And that hexy should bebe fired if he's allowed to leave. I was right in preseason about him being able to play at this level, and I'm fairly sure I'm right again. I haven't seen enough to tell you how good he actually is. But I've seen enough to know he should be in Orange and black next season.

    I agree with this (and I usually don't agree with tx haha). When the kid has literally excelled at every level, why should we not give him a full season (or two) to prove it? We keep letting these guys go before they get a chance to show...

  9. #264
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    Jul 2010
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    6,338
    Quote Originally Posted by LLMunchie619 View Post
    I agree with this (and I usually don't agree with tx haha). When the kid has literally excelled at every level, why should we not give him a full season (or two) to prove it? We keep letting these guys go before they get a chance to show...
    Honestly, I tend to agree. Weal is still an unknown, to be sure. But he was impressive down the stretch (especially in games that mattered, and ones that our "stars" decided to mail in), and he is young with a solid track-record of production.

    Do I want him to get a Leino-esque deal? Hell no. But one year, $1.5M or 2/$3M? Yeah, I'm down with that. If we're willing to give PEB 2/$2.8M, I think it's a bit ridiculous to not (at least) offer a similar deal to a guy who produced more (from a volume standpoint) in 1/4 of a season than Bellemare did in a full one.

    If Weal is the real deal, then awesome. If not, he's still better than Bellemare. And as much as it sucks to judge by that standard, such is life in Philadelphia sports right now.

  10. #265
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,779
    Definitely doable to bring back Weal on a 1 or 2 year deal for 1.1....1.25 per. something in that neighborhood. Doesn't obligate to the long term and doesn't cost much at all as far as roster maneuverability. He played a small sample so it's not enough to have to pay real money and term. He wants to prove he's an NHL caliber player so he's gonna be anxious to fit in somewhere. Even though he wasn't up much he still has some talent and skill that is lacking on this current roster. I'd gamble on him at this point.

    Lindblom
    Konecny
    Weal
    Raffl

    If those are your starting 4 on the left side heading into next season I'd say that's worth some optimism. That works just fine.

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