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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    Dustin Penner being compared to Beleskey is laughable. Penner was a much better player than beleksey will ever be, he jsut got plagued by injuries year in and year out. Still was a player that they expected to be there and produce on a high level(4 times at least 20 goals, one time 30 goals, beleskey is far from that)



    Other guys lesser value for sure, but they filled out smaller roles on the team, but when they got injured they had to bring up even worse players to fill their spots.

    Bruins do not even come close to losing a Jeff Carter, Jack Johnson, or even a Penner for long period of time this season. AND the injured kings were on pace with the healthy bruins
    Dustin Penner has had 1 good season since he left Edmonton... he was not a "good" player for LAK. Injuries or not he had 37 in 117GP... that is a very minimal impact especially while being a pretty average player defensively... the only laughable thing is you thinking it's laughable that he basically had the same impact in LA as Beleskey has in Boston.... as a matter of fact Beleskey is the better player defensively and last year had the same amount of production in 80 games as Penner had in his 117 over 3 years on a MUCH better LAK team....

    Again I will reiterate... a third liner who got some production under his belt come playoff time.... basically the equivalent of what Beleskey did his last year in Anaheim...


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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    Sorry let me rephrase that JJ sucked defensively, but he was very important to that team from a minutes perspective. didnt know if you already responded to it so I didnt go back and edit.
    Different argument here... but you literally sound like the biggest hypocrite I have ever seen....


    Jack Johnson doesn't hold a candle to Krug defensively (please don't give me advanced stats... I REALLY don't care...) yet Jack Johnson was an "important player" because it supports your argument and Krug is a 3rd pairing PP specialist....


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  3. #78
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    Boston Bruins Standing Watch

    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    Regardless, losing Carter, Johnson, JJ, Doughty(small amont of time missed) and Gange(who they expected to produce and had 40 points with TBL and PHI previously), for a handful of games was worse than what the Bruins have dealt with for sure.
    Know who else had close to 40 pts last year?.... Matt Beleskey... know who the Bruins didn't really miss when he was injured?..... Matt Beleskey.... losing players like that doesn't derail your season and throw you to the 8 seed.... even losing a player like Carter doesn't really do that when you have the team they had....

    They simply underperformed and got hot at the right time, while getting exceptional playoff goaltending... why is that so hard to believe that it could happen to the Bruins?

    I'm not even saying it will but your argument just doesn't work for this situation ... sometimes there are just some things that the stats can't show...

    I honestly think this is what frustrates a lot of people about you. You really know your stuff and some of the stuff with those advanced stats is very interesting... however you are way too analytical and it makes you way too stubborn to admit you're wrong sometimes "bekuz statzzz". Then you take shots at people when they don't agree with the stats


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    Last edited by homie564; 03-18-2017 at 12:45 AM.


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  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie564 View Post
    Know who else had close to 40 pts last year?.... Matt Beleskey... know who the Bruins didn't really miss when he was injured?..... Matt Beleskey.... losing players like that doesn't derail your season and throw you to the 8 seed.... even losing a player like Carter doesn't really do that when you have the team they had....

    They simply underperformed and got hot at the right time, while getting exceptional playoff goaltending... why is that so hard to believe that it could happen to the Bruins?

    I'm not even saying it will but your argument just doesn't work for this situation ... sometimes there are just some things that the stats can't show...

    I honestly think this is what frustrates a lot of people about you. You really know your stuff and some of the stuff with those advanced stats is very interesting... however you are way too analytical and it makes you way too stubborn to admit you're wrong sometimes "bekuz statzzz". Then you take shots at people when they don't agree with the stats


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    I'll try to keep it as unanalytical as possible for you guys then.

    Dustin Penner top 5 scoring seasons:

    29 goals/16 assists/45 points
    23 goals/24 assists/47 points
    17 goals/20 assists/ 37 points
    32 goals/ 31 assists/ 63 points
    21 goals/18 assists/ 39 points

    Matt Beleskey top 5 scoring seasons:

    22 goals/ 10 assists/ 32 points
    15 goals/ 22 assists/ 37 points
    9 goals/ 15 assists/ 24 points
    11 goals/ 7 assists/ 18 points
    4 goals/11 assists/ 15 points

    Beleskey's highest points total is Penner's 5th highest total in any season. Penner is by far the superior player and its actually really not even close in comparison.
    "Talent sets the floor, character sets the ceiling." - Bill Belichick

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    I'll try to keep it as unanalytical as possible for you guys then.

    Dustin Penner top 5 scoring seasons:

    29 goals/16 assists/45 points
    23 goals/24 assists/47 points
    17 goals/20 assists/ 37 points
    32 goals/ 31 assists/ 63 points
    21 goals/18 assists/ 39 points

    Matt Beleskey top 5 scoring seasons:

    22 goals/ 10 assists/ 32 points
    15 goals/ 22 assists/ 37 points
    9 goals/ 15 assists/ 24 points
    11 goals/ 7 assists/ 18 points
    4 goals/11 assists/ 15 points

    Beleskey's highest points total is Penner's 5th highest total in any season. Penner is by far the superior player and its actually really not even close in comparison.
    But we're talking about 2 different things here.... those were his first 5 years in the league.... all of which were either with Anaheim or Edmonton.... he wasn't any more to LAK than what Beleskey is to us... actually he was less to LAK than what Beleskey has been to us...talking about the player he was before LAK and the player he was in LAK are very different topics of conversation.... also fwiw... right now I would also take Beleskey... Penner is no more than a roster flier at this point.


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  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie564 View Post
    But we're talking about 2 different things here.... those were his first 5 years in the league.... all of which were either with Anaheim or Edmonton.... he wasn't any more to LAK than what Beleskey is to us... actually he was less to LAK than what Beleskey has been to us...talking about the player he was before LAK and the player he was in LAK are very different topics of conversation.... also fwiw... right now I would also take Beleskey... Penner is no more than a roster flier at this point.


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    Penner was nothing but a roster filler? The year the Kings won the cup, Penner came back from injury in the playoffs to score 3 goals/ 8 assists/11 points in 20 games.

    - .55 points per game in that playoff run is much more than a roster filler.
    - .41 PPG over 3 seasons with LA Kings in the playoffs.


    And of course you would take Beleskey now, Penner isnt even in the league anymore because he is old/ his body is so banged up.
    "Talent sets the floor, character sets the ceiling." - Bill Belichick

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    Penner was nothing but a roster filler? The year the Kings won the cup, Penner came back from injury in the playoffs to score 3 goals/ 8 assists/11 points in 20 games.

    - .55 points per game in that playoff run is much more than a roster filler.
    - .41 PPG over 3 seasons with LA Kings in the playoffs.


    And of course you would take Beleskey now, Penner isnt even in the league anymore because he is old/ his body is so banged up.
    What homie is saying is that Penner was a shell of his former self when he arrived in LA, which is true. His body was breaking down and he obviously wasn't as consistent. He had a great playoffs, but him missing 17 games (not to mention sporadically) during the regular season probably didn't affect the Kings' position as an 8th seed. And he didn't come back from injury in the playoffs. He played all 20 games.

    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    LA Kings players missing games during 2012 regular season
    : Jack Johnson (21 games missed), Slava Voynov (28 games missed), Drew Doughty (missed 5 games), Jeff carter (missed 66 games), Dustin Penner ( missed 17 games), Simon Gange (missed 48 games), mike richards( missed 8 games)

    They had a majority of these guys back for the playoff run, they just missed a ton of games during the regular season. Bruins have been relatively healthy this season.
    Now you keep on saying that all these players missed time with injuries, but you're making it up. I mean a simple research could tell you that they were traded/etc that year.

    Jeff Carter was traded from CBJ for Jack Johnson. Jeff Carter didn't miss 66 games. He missed 5 after he was traded. So you're reading his stats wrong pretty much.

    Jack Johnson was traded, so yeah he missed 21 games because HE WASN'T ON THE TEAM.

    Voynov was going back and forth between the NHL/AHL that season - so again, no, he didn't "miss" 28 games. They just didn't think he was good enough to be in the NHL earlier in the season.

    Gagne missing those games is pretty much the only "significant" injury. But then again, if the you are team that was relying on an injury prone forward to stay in the playoff spot, then you probably weren't a good team - further proving that the Kings' run was nothing short of amazing.

    I understand using stats to back stuff up, but you gotta do your research, especially if you are making it up at that point. The truth is, the Kings got super hot heading into the playoffs and destroyed everyone in their path that they weren't "supposed" to beat. Everyone in the NHL was surprised.


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  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaiza View Post
    What homie is saying is that Penner was a shell of his former self when he arrived in LA, which is true. His body was breaking down and he obviously wasn't as consistent. He had a great playoffs, but him missing 17 games (not to mention sporadically) during the regular season probably didn't affect the Kings' position as an 8th seed. And he didn't come back from injury in the playoffs. He played all 20 games.



    Now you keep on saying that all these players missed time with injuries, but you're making it up. I mean a simple research could tell you that they were traded/etc that year.

    Jeff Carter was traded from CBJ for Jack Johnson. Jeff Carter didn't miss 66 games. He missed 5 after he was traded. So you're reading his stats wrong pretty much.

    Jack Johnson was traded, so yeah he missed 21 games because HE WASN'T ON THE TEAM.

    Voynov was going back and forth between the NHL/AHL that season - so again, no, he didn't "miss" 28 games. They just didn't think he was good enough to be in the NHL earlier in the season.

    Gagne missing those games is pretty much the only "significant" injury. But then again, if the you are team that was relying on an injury prone forward to stay in the playoff spot, then you probably weren't a good team - further proving that the Kings' run was nothing short of amazing.

    I understand using stats to back stuff up, but you gotta do your research, especially if you are making it up at that point. The truth is, the Kings got super hot heading into the playoffs and destroyed everyone in their path that they weren't "supposed" to beat. Everyone in the NHL was surprised.

    No where did I say they missed time due to only injury. I just said notable players that missed games for the kings.

    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    LA Kings players missing games during 2012 regular season
    : Jack Johnson (21 games missed), Slava Voynov (28 games missed), Drew Doughty (missed 5 games), Jeff carter (missed 66 games), Dustin Penner ( missed 17 games), Simon Gange (missed 48 games), mike richards( missed 8 games)

    They had a majority of these guys back for the playoff run, they just missed a ton of games during the regular season. Bruins have been relatively healthy this season.
    Specifically didnt say missed games due to injury, just missed games. Games they didnt play for the team. However, a good portion of the players that did miss games, did so due to injury, which is included in missed games. Which is why I compared their relative health to the Bruins health this season.
    "Talent sets the floor, character sets the ceiling." - Bill Belichick

  9. #84
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    My underlying point here is the team that LA Kings had in the 2011-2012 regular season was much different than the one they featured in the playoffs. So its hard to compare the Kings winning the cup from the 8th seed, to the bruins winning it from a low seed, when the Bruins team is pretty much the same one as it has been all season with the addition to Stafford and a few rotating pieces at the bottom of the lineup.
    "Talent sets the floor, character sets the ceiling." - Bill Belichick

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoSox47 View Post
    No where did I say they missed time due to only injury. I just said notable players that missed games for the kings.

    Specifically didnt say missed games due to injury, just missed games. Games they didnt play for the team. However, a good portion of the players that did miss games, did so due to injury, which is included in missed games. Which is why I compared their relative health to the Bruins health this season.
    How can you claim Jeff Carter missed 66 games for the Kings when he wasn't on the team? Is this how you usually present arguments? You clearly said they MISSED games for the Kings. It's a horrible way to make an argument. Own up to the mistake if you made it.


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  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaiza View Post
    How can you claim Jeff Carter missed 66 games for the Kings when he wasn't on the team? Is this how you usually present arguments? You clearly said they MISSED games for the Kings. It's a horrible way to make an argument. Own up to the mistake if you made it.
    Shame on me for not even catching that lol all I did was simply look at hockeydb... this just became hysterical


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  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaiza View Post
    How can you claim Jeff Carter missed 66 games for the Kings when he wasn't on the team? Is this how you usually present arguments? You clearly said they MISSED games for the Kings. It's a horrible way to make an argument. Own up to the mistake if you made it.
    Word your right I made a mistake with JC, but at the same time underlying concept here is that the Bruins aren't in the same position as the LA kings of having people who were not available/with the team, that came back/in for the playoffs and performed well for them.

    - Voynov and Martinez both played all 20 playoff games, but only played 51 and 54 games during the regular season
    - Penner dealing with back spasm during the year was healthy for playoffs and produced .55 ppg
    - Carter played 16 games in the regular season for them, huge playoff addition
    - Mike Richards missed 8 games
    - Drew Doughty missed 5 games
    - Willie mitchell missed 5 games

    I was wong about JC, he still didnt play for them for much of the season and represents a huge addition to their team. Something the Bruins dont have.
    Last edited by BoSox47; 03-18-2017 at 04:45 PM.
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  13. #88
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    Who knows, maybe Stafford pulls a Penner and dials back the clock a season or two and Tuukka catches a Tim Thomas hot streak and this team magically wins a cup. Not saying it 100% wont happen but I just dont see us getting past Washington or The NY Rangers specifically. If we draw ottawa, Toronto, montreal I think its a toss up who wins the series. I actually think we would do better against montreal and Toronto. Just dont see us getting through the top 3-4 teams in the east and whatever team comes out of the west.
    "Talent sets the floor, character sets the ceiling." - Bill Belichick

  14. #89
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    As far as the standings watch, some of the teams going against us in the standings are playing some rather tough opponents tonight:

    CHI @ Toronto
    WAS @ Tampa
    Montreal @ Ottawa (someones gotta lose)

    and NYI lost in OT today.
    Last edited by BoSox47; 03-18-2017 at 06:05 PM.
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  15. #90
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    Sorry for the delay everyone, standing are updated and its not good. Currently Boston is the only team with a plus goal differential that isn't in the playoffs.

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