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Thread: Bold Moves

  1. #1
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    Bold Moves

    There has been a lot of debate lately about the talent level on this roster. Personally I agree we need an upgrade but I feel like that move isn't coming just yet.

    But let's say it is, it is happening this off season. What would your bold move(s) be to upgrade the talent level of the team? Going after Wiggins? Trading for Love?

    Here are my bold moves I would love to see happen. It seems like an insane amount of work to put into one draft but I think this team would be competitive right away and could turn into a powerhouse.

    1. Start with helping Chicago get Melo... by taking Taj Gibson off their hands.

    Gibson, Dunleavy and 19th pick for Salmons, Buycks, Stone and 59th pick

    Chicago can now sign Melo and Mirotic this offseason while still adding the 16th pick in the draft. Seems like a win for both sides. Dunleavy seems expendable with Snell and Butler pairing up with Melo on the wings.

    2. Sacramento wants to add a solid vet presence in the locker room. I give you Amir Johnson. I love the guy. He has so much heart and hustle. But if he can be a main piece of a trade that gets us a lottery pick in this draft I do it no problem. Especially now that Gibson just made him expendable!

    Outlaw, Thompson and 8th pick for Johnson, Novak and 37th pick

    Take on a longterm contract Sacramento probably doesn't really want anymore. Outlaw for Novak swap makes sense from a roster management perspective for Sacramento. We are landing the 8th pick after all we should expect to take on some 'junk'.

    3. I really believe the Cavs take Embiid #1. If they are serious about bringing back Lebron at any point in time they draft Embiid. He make so much sense on that roster. I don't see Milwaukee picking either Parker or Wiggins. I think they could be convinced to swap an all star and some depth at the 4 while still keeping a draft pick for their pick and a bust for them so far, Mayo.

    Mayo and 2nd pick for Derozan, Hansbrough and 20th pick.

    I would be open to adding a lottery protected future pick to this trade but I think an all star and a pick while taking back Mayo can get this done.

    That leaves us with the 2nd, 8th and 19th picks in this year's draft.

    I would draft Wiggins, Vonleh and Payton (possibly LaVine)

    Re sign Lowry and Vasquez
    Sign Carter
    Waive Outlaw
    Sign a back up C (I like the energy Jordan Hill would bring doubt he comes cheap enough though)

    Our roster would be:

    Valanciunas/back up(Hill maybe)/Hayes
    Gibson/Vonleh/Thompson
    Wiggins/Dunleavy/Fields
    Ross/Carter/Mayo
    Lowry/Vasquez/Payton

    Obviously the chances of all that coming together are slim. But I don't think that any of those deals are outrageous. I feel like both teams in each trade fulfill a goal in some way. The first two trades especially.

    What other major makeover ideas are out there?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by albertajaysfan View Post
    There has been a lot of debate lately about the talent level on this roster. Personally I agree we need an upgrade but I feel like that move isn't coming just yet.

    But let's say it is, it is happening this off season. What would your bold move(s) be to upgrade the talent level of the team? Going after Wiggins? Trading for Love?

    Here are my bold moves I would love to see happen. It seems like an insane amount of work to put into one draft but I think this team would be competitive right away and could turn into a powerhouse.

    1. Start with helping Chicago get Melo... by taking Taj Gibson off their hands.

    Gibson, Dunleavy and 19th pick for Salmons, Buycks, Stone and 59th pick

    Chicago can now sign Melo and Mirotic this offseason while still adding the 16th pick in the draft. Seems like a win for both sides. Dunleavy seems expendable with Snell and Butler pairing up with Melo on the wings.

    2. Sacramento wants to add a solid vet presence in the locker room. I give you Amir Johnson. I love the guy. He has so much heart and hustle. But if he can be a main piece of a trade that gets us a lottery pick in this draft I do it no problem. Especially now that Gibson just made him expendable!

    Outlaw, Thompson and 8th pick for Johnson, Novak and 37th pick

    Take on a longterm contract Sacramento probably doesn't really want anymore. Outlaw for Novak swap makes sense from a roster management perspective for Sacramento. We are landing the 8th pick after all we should expect to take on some 'junk'.

    3. I really believe the Cavs take Embiid #1. If they are serious about bringing back Lebron at any point in time they draft Embiid. He make so much sense on that roster. I don't see Milwaukee picking either Parker or Wiggins. I think they could be convinced to swap an all star and some depth at the 4 while still keeping a draft pick for their pick and a bust for them so far, Mayo.

    Mayo and 2nd pick for Derozan, Hansbrough and 20th pick.

    I would be open to adding a lottery protected future pick to this trade but I think an all star and a pick while taking back Mayo can get this done.

    That leaves us with the 2nd, 8th and 19th picks in this year's draft.

    I would draft Wiggins, Vonleh and Payton (possibly LaVine)

    Re sign Lowry and Vasquez
    Sign Carter
    Waive Outlaw
    Sign a back up C (I like the energy Jordan Hill would bring doubt he comes cheap enough though)

    Our roster would be:

    Valanciunas/back up(Hill maybe)/Hayes
    Gibson/Vonleh/Thompson
    Wiggins/Dunleavy/Fields
    Ross/Carter/Mayo
    Lowry/Vasquez/Payton

    Obviously the chances of all that coming together are slim. But I don't think that any of those deals are outrageous. I feel like both teams in each trade fulfill a goal in some way. The first two trades especially.

    What other major makeover ideas are out there?
    I like the idea of the first trade. Theres definitely some team that will be willing to trade for Salmons so they can waive him for cap space and we should be able to get something for him (a la Bynum for Deng, Dampier for Chandler a few years back).

    I wouldn't make that Derozan trade though and would be iffy on the Amir one too, but at the same time, it would hard to turn that one down if we get Sacs pick.

    If we were to get Sacs pick, instead of trading Demar for 2, I would rather try to package 8 with Ross/ a 2016 pick for 2 + bad contract or something like that. We could also maybe flip Gibson to Sac instead of Amir but not sure if salaries would match.

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    These bold moves are ALL contingent if we sign Lowry or not lol.

    if we don't sign Lowry, I can see him upheaving the roster cept Ross and JVal (which makes sense because trading Ross in his rookie contract - a player who has shown he can play in the NBA - would go against youth and rebuilding process)

    #3 is not going to happen, thats just being unrealistic. If I was the GM for the bucks, I would not be trading my first rounder in a loaded draft full of potential franchise players like Wiggins/Embiid/Parker for a non franchise player in Derozan (because he's not a franchise player).



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    You have some really bold moves for sure and I love them all. But I don't see them happening. MU has indicated he is going to take it slow and the man really hides his cards well. So not sure how our off season is going to go. I personally think raptors will draft a defensive player with their 20th pick. They will resign lowry, GV and patman. They may sign another veteran. That's all I see for this off season. I hope I am wrong and I hope raptors do something bold!

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    I don't see why people still want to trade Demar. He is still progressing and scored 22.7 ppg last season, while improving both his rebounding, passing and outside shooting. With his team friendly contract, there is absolutely no reason to trade him right now. Even if you take him out of the starting 5 and bring him off the bench for consistent scoring his contract still is reasonable. If you want to attract more stars, you don't get rid of the ones you have. We have one that actually loves playing in Toronto, don't push another one away..


    The great thing about our current roster, is that we are young enough right now that we could keep a core of JV, Derozan, Ross, Amir, Patterson and Lowry together for 4 or 5 more years, and they would all still be in their primes.

    I say we start a trend of Toronto going to the playoffs, and make minor tweaks over the next few years to see how they can become. I really think Lowry, Derozan and JV could be a special trio in 3 years when JV's body fully matures and he starts entering his prime.

    The only bold move I like from the above would be bringing back Carter as the new 6th man instead of Salmons. He has played the last 3 seasons in Dallas for around 3M/yr. He can still shoot the 3 and spread the floor. If we can get him for 3M, I think he would be a steal for our bench.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I don't see why people still want to trade Demar. He is still progressing and scored 22.7 ppg last season, while improving both his rebounding, passing and outside shooting. With his team friendly contract, there is absolutely no reason to trade him right now. Even if you take him out of the starting 5 and bring him off the bench for consistent scoring his contract still is reasonable. If you want to attract more stars, you don't get rid of the ones you have. We have one that actually loves playing in Toronto, don't push another one away..


    The great thing about our current roster, is that we are young enough right now that we could keep a core of JV, Derozan, Ross, Amir, Patterson and Lowry together for 4 or 5 more years, and they would all still be in their primes.

    I say we start a trend of Toronto going to the playoffs, and make minor tweaks over the next few years to see how they can become. I really think Lowry, Derozan and JV could be a special trio in 3 years when JV's body fully matures and he starts entering his prime.

    The only bold move I like from the above would be bringing back Carter as the new 6th man instead of Salmons. He has played the last 3 seasons in Dallas for around 3M/yr. He can still shoot the 3 and spread the floor. If we can get him for 3M, I think he would be a steal for our bench.
    I would have been okay with that plan 5 years ago. My patience has gone thin. Making the playoffs is fine. But I want to see the team making strides in the playoffs. I don't want the raptors to be a team like the Denver nuggets of past 10 years.

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    Building on AlbertaJaysFan's Ideas, how does this sound for a bold potential draft day trade:

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=pwps3uj

    *All salary figures are per year*

    To Toronto:
    OJ Mayo (2yr/8mill per)
    Mike Dunleavy (1Yr/3.3mill)
    Carl Landry (3yr/6.5mill per)
    Jason Thompson (2yr/~6.4 per)
    #2 Pick (Bucks)

    To Chicago:
    John Salmons (1yr/1mill buyout)
    Buycks (1yr/0.7mill) (Team Option)

    To Sacramento:
    Taj Gibson (3yr/~8.5mill per)
    Steve Novak (2yr/~3.6mill per)
    #20 Pick (Raptors)

    To Milwaukee:
    Terrence Ross (2yr/~3.2mill per)
    Tyler Hansbrough (1yr/3.3 mill) (Can be waived for 1mill)
    Julyan Stone (1yr/1mill) (Team Option)
    #8 Pick (Sacramento)
    2016 First Round Pick (Knicks)
    2016 First Round Pick (Raptors)

    Why Chicago Does It:
    -Salary Cap is expected to be ~63 mill
    -After cutting Salmons and Buycks they are about 10 mill below this number
    -This gives them the money to bring Mirotic over from Europe given the restrictions with his buyout
    -Also gives them enough space below the cap to have the option of amnestying Boozer to create enough room to sign a max free agent (Melo?)

    Why Sacramento Does It:
    -After missing the playoffs for like 6 years and getting tired of trying to develop rookies, they are reportedly shopping their pick for a veteran impact player
    -Taj Gibson brings those traits and gives them a huge upgrade at PF
    -They also cut a tiny bit of salary and unload 2 bad contracts in Jason Thompson and Carl Landry which should give them a bit more flexibility going forward
    -The trade-off is they drop down from 8 to 20 in the draft

    Why Milwaukee Does It:
    -They unload one of their bad contracts in OJ Mayo, cutting costs for during their rebuild
    -They add a young player with some upside on a rookie contract in Ross
    -They add a decent veteran guy in Hansbrough off the bench (with an option to waive him to save money if they decide to go that route)
    -In a deep draft like this they can still get a potential star player at 8 (Wiggins, Embid, Parker, Exum, Smart, Randle, Gordon, Vonleh - Someone good, likely one of Randle/Gordon/Vonleh imo is still going to be there at that spot)
    -They get another couple first rounders in 2016 (probably one in the mid teens and one in the 20s)

    Why Toronto Does It:
    -We move up into the high lottery to grab either Wiggins or Parker
    -We take a bench redundancy at pf with Patterson and Hanbrough and turn it into a bit of an upgrade on the wing with Dunleavy
    -The trade-off is we take on some bad contracts which will probably thrust us into the lottery tax for this season, but with Fields, Amir, and Hayes all expiring following this upcoming season we should be ok long term
    -Factoring in Lowry resigning for 12mill per we would at ~69 mill
    -The luxury tax is expected to be about 77 mill so we would have about 8 mill of room under it to resign Vasquez/Patterson and maybe add another low end piece (Carter?)

    Potential 2014-2015 Roster:

    Val/Hayes/Thompson
    Amir/Patterson/Landry
    Wiggins/Dunleavy/Fields
    Derozan/Carter/Mayo
    Lowry/Vasquez/2nd Rounder

    Assuming Carter signs for ~3 mill and Vasquez/Patterson take around 3-4 each we would be just slightly over the luxury tax by a couple million and leaves us with a fairly deep team with a good mix of veterans and room to grow with Wiggins/Val/Demar all still very young
    Last edited by Six-8-TheWizard; 05-23-2014 at 12:04 PM.

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    Wow overrating every player on the Raptors a little bit XD. Does bold mean laughable nowadays?
    ]I may be acting like a Kidd, switch from team to team, now I'm getting Bucks and all I see is green. Call me what you want, image don't mean a thing to me, sign me for 5 or 6 mill and worry about my legacy. - Me

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    I would trade everybody on this roster except Jonas and Ross. One reason I keep Ross is because he's a two way player. Jonas is also becoming a two way player. Demar is an offensive player. Not sure what his value would be to other franchises.

    Just an opinion but looking at Wiggins and Parker I don't like either of them paired with Derozan. Not that we would ever get any of those guys this year. Just saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by I Rock Shaqs View Post
    Wow overrating every player on the Raptors a little bit XD. Does bold mean laughable nowadays?
    I'm with you on this one.

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    JV is probably worth a top 10 pick in this draft, up to maybe 6 or 7, there's no way a team is going to trade a top 5 pick away without getting any franchise changing talent or another pick in the top 10, plus a great young player and the other team taking back a bad contract.
    ]I may be acting like a Kidd, switch from team to team, now I'm getting Bucks and all I see is green. Call me what you want, image don't mean a thing to me, sign me for 5 or 6 mill and worry about my legacy. - Me

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    Quote Originally Posted by I Rock Shaqs View Post
    JV is probably worth a top 10 pick in this draft, up to maybe 6 or 7, there's no way a team is going to trade a top 5 pick away without getting any franchise changing talent or another pick in the top 10, plus a great young player and the other team taking back a bad contract.
    Why don't you try and actually add something to the conversation. You march around acting like an expert but never go out on a limb. Do you have any ideas on how to make this team better? Are you satisfied with this team as is? Or is the only reason you are here is to borderline harass people?

    I think I made it pretty clear the last trade is the least likely. I also said I would be willing to add an additional pick. On top of all of that I also said I doubt these moves are likely. Although the first one I would really like to see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Six-8-TheWizard View Post
    I like the idea of the first trade. Theres definitely some team that will be willing to trade for Salmons so they can waive him for cap space and we should be able to get something for him (a la Bynum for Deng, Dampier for Chandler a few years back).

    I wouldn't make that Derozan trade though and would be iffy on the Amir one too, but at the same time, it would hard to turn that one down if we get Sacs pick.

    If we were to get Sacs pick, instead of trading Demar for 2, I would rather try to package 8 with Ross/ a 2016 pick for 2 + bad contract or something like that. We could also maybe flip Gibson to Sac instead of Amir but not sure if salaries would match.
    I really hope we use Salmons to get an extra pick somehow as well. I think Chicago and Boston are the best targets for such a thing.

    I prefer Gibson over Amir to be honest that is why I chose to send him to Sacramento.

    I also think Ross and Wiggins are a better combo over Demar and Wiggins. I like Demar in terms of heart and hustle. I love that he keeps improving but I just don't see him taking us past the second round being such a main piece.

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    Quote Originally Posted by killersweet View Post
    You have some really bold moves for sure and I love them all. But I don't see them happening. MU has indicated he is going to take it slow and the man really hides his cards well. So not sure how our off season is going to go. I personally think raptors will draft a defensive player with their 20th pick. They will resign lowry, GV and patman. They may sign another veteran. That's all I see for this off season. I hope I am wrong and I hope raptors do something bold!
    Unfortunately I don't see them happening either. The first one I think is the most realistic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by koreancabbage View Post
    These bold moves are ALL contingent if we sign Lowry or not lol.

    if we don't sign Lowry, I can see him upheaving the roster cept Ross and JVal (which makes sense because trading Ross in his rookie contract - a player who has shown he can play in the NBA - would go against youth and rebuilding process)

    #3 is not going to happen, thats just being unrealistic. If I was the GM for the bucks, I would not be trading my first rounder in a loaded draft full of potential franchise players like Wiggins/Embiid/Parker for a non franchise player in Derozan (because he's not a franchise player).
    If Lowry walks I think the team is actually better off in this scenario then if we just add our picks we currently have and he walks.

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