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  1. #1
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    Doubront Headed to DL?

    Felix Doubront certainly didn’t help matters last night. The maddeningly inconsistent left-hander followed up his best start of the season by allowing five runs on five hits, including a pair of majestic homers, in four-plus innings against the Toronto Blue Jays.

    After throwing 12 consecutive pitches that failed to crack 88 mph, including a flat 83-mph cutter that Melky Cabrera lined for an RBI double in the fifth, Doubront was visited by manager John Farrell and trainer Rick Jameyson and departed with what the Sox termed “left shoulder fatigue.”

    Add it all up, and the Red Sox lost their fifth consecutive game, 7-4, in the opener of a three-game series. The Sox fell to 20-24 overall, 10-15 at Fenway Park.

    So while they hope to have taken measures to bolster the infield defense by signing Drew to a prorated one-year contract pending a physical exam today, the Red Sox have other problems to address, beginning with an MRI exam today for Doubront.

    “Right now I feel fine. During the game, I couldn’t feel my shoulder,” said Doubront, who noted he experienced numbness, not pain, as early as a walk to Dioner Navarro in the second inning. “Weird. It felt weird. I don’t know if my whip or the release point was there. My arm speed wasn’t there. Nothing. I felt nothing.”
    Boston Herald

    While it's not said directly this sounds like the perfect storm to find an "injury" that requires Doubront to shut down for a couple weeks and investigate the options from PAW. If this happens, who do you think the Sox bring up in Doubront's spot?

    The candidates:
    Ranaudo -- a fellow lefty who is on the same turn as Doubront in Pawtucket. Ranaudo's bb/9 (4.81) is a concern. He's allowed only 3HR in 52.1IP.

    Webster -- reportedly made adjustments to his delivery out of ST that has kept him in the strikezone much more often than in the past. As evidence he had five consecutive starts with 2BB or less. His 2.47ERA is obviously attractive as is his ground ball tendencies (5 GB outs to every 4 FB out). He's rarely gone beyond 6IP in PAW. He'd have an extra day's rest if he took Doubront's next turn.

    Workman -- His ERA is bit ugly at the point thanks in part to some early outings transitioning back to SP at the start of the season. Otherwise his peripherals look pretty good.

    RDLR -- Gave up a season-high 9 hits in his last start but also got his BB under control again (breaking a 4 game run that averaged 4BB/G). He's been hard to hit at AAA (47.1IP/38H).

    The biggest drawback to RDLR and Workman is that they're fairly out of synch with Doubront's spot in the rotation. They'd likely require either an abbreviated start or a relief appearance to get in some "regular" work and still have enough in the tank for the next start.

    While I'm not sure he'd be my first choice, the time seems right for Webster.

  2. #2
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    I think Ranaudo gets eaten alive by hitters in the majors. Bad control don't work up there, as Allen Webster show it doesn't matter if you toss 95, it gets knock around with bad location.

    I bring Workman up, he made 5 starts last year. Look fairly good in them.

  3. #3
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    Webster last 6 starts in PAW:

    34 2/3IP, 1.82 ERA, 28Ks 11BB, 0 HR allowed

    I'd go with Webster with the mindset that he will give you 5-6 innings max. Gotta like how he's been throwing lately though.

    While Workman hasn't had any control problems, hitters have made a lot of contact against him in AAA. Not sure if it's a velocity issue.
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  4. #4
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    Webster, as he is the most polished. I might have said Workman but I don't care how you spin it, having an ERA above 5 in AAA is abysmal, even with bad luck.

  5. #5
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    I don't think it's a made up injury with his decrease in velocity and the numbness in his shoulder. This is just a ridiculous explanation though

    ‏@alexspeier 1h
    Farrell: Doubront hit shoulder on car door. Sox found out after last night's start. Sox believe decreased strength was a byproduct

    Alex Speier ‏@alexspeier 1h
    No MRI yet for Doubront. Sox will see how he responds before deciding if he needs one


    Workman's getting hammered. Lots of homeruns, hard contact. Farrell probably wants him though

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Lavigne43- View Post
    I don't think it's a made up injury with his decrease in velocity and the numbness in his shoulder. This is just a ridiculous explanation though
    I'm sure that there was something affecting his performance on Tuesday. However, that does not necessarily mean an injury that requires a stint on the DL and that was the distinction that I was trying to make.

    Quote Originally Posted by -Lavigne43- View Post
    Workman's getting hammered. Lots of homeruns, hard contact. Farrell probably wants him though
    Not sure what's going on with Workman. It's pretty well known that Farrell has the most confidence in him of all the options. I could still see them bringing in Webster and giving him a shot. If he's not very successful in the short term -- and Doubront requires more than the minimum stay on the DL -- then they can say publicly that they only brought Webster in as a short-term replacement and they're changing course with the longer term needs. They can also say that they needed time to get Workman aligned with the schedule. If Webster has a great run then they can hold the line on the "he was lined up best" tack. Either way, they can spin it in a way that does minimal damage.

  7. #7
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    Making his second start in his return from a strained left shoulder, Felix Doubront allowed two runs on six hits and one walk in 42⁄3 innings for Triple-A Pawtucket. He’s scheduled to pitch six innings Sunday for Pawtucket before the Sox consider activating him from the disabled list.

    Doubront’s return might coincide with right-hander Brandon Workman serving a six-game suspension for throwing at Tampa Bay Rays third baseman Evan Longoria’s head May 30 at Fenway Park. Workman, who won his start last night, will have his appeal heard by Major League Baseball on Friday.
    Boston Herald

  8. #8
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    – Felix Doubront made his second rehab start (and first for Pawtucket), going 4 2/3 innings and allowing two runs on six hits and a walk while fanning three. Doubront threw 75 pitches with 44 going for strikes. Most of the six hits he allowed were struck well, with the Bats clubbing two doubles in the opening inning while scattering three line-drive singles and a ground ball single throughout the rest of Doubront’s outing.

    According to the Providence Journal’s Tim Britton, Doubront’s velocity, which had been a cause for concern prior to his injury, dipped considerably, with just four of his 75 pitches hitting 90 miles per hour or higher on the stadium gun, while his fastball sat around 87-88 mph.

    “It’s a process. It was nice and easy and trying to control my pitches,” Doubront told Britton. “I’m looking for strength and trying to get my fastball a little bit more velocity. Right now, I feel good where I am.”

    Despite the decline in velocity and the solid contact made off of the left-hander, Doubront insists that he is healthy and making progress towards a return.

    Health is first, and results I can fix later,” Doubront told Britton. “I don’t feel anything — no shooting soreness or shooting pain [in my shoulder]. It’s strong. Better than before.”
    http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bos...ini-goes-deep/

    Just curious as to why he hasn't fixed results in years past. Get tired of hearing this blah blah blah type ****.
    Last edited by RedSoxtober; 06-11-2014 at 03:24 PM.

  9. #9
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    ^^ I think he's in the Robby Cano camp -- nice tools but not the will to be the best. I'd challenge the idea that he's not fixed the results in years past a little bit though.

    May 12, 2012 - July 31, 2012: 8-4 (team 10-4), 4.11 ERA, 81IP/81K/31BB
    May 16, 2013 - End of season: 8-5 (team 14-9), 3.81ERA, 130IP/104K/55BB

    IMO he has made improvements in his results in seasons past and has done so for longer sustained runs. However, taking the first six weeks of the season to get settled into the season and capping your year around 160IP are no way to get beyond #5 starter status. I wonder when, if ever, we'll see him enjoy any prolonged success as a SP.

    My biggest concern is the regression in his k-rate. 9.3 => 7.7 => 6.1 is a very bad trend when things like h/9 and bb/9 have stayed relatively flat. It's not like he's striking out fewer guys as a tradeoff for walking fewer and/or getting more contact and pitching deeper into games as a result.

    FWIW I wish we could get him on another mid-season run and deal him while he seems cheap.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedSoxtober View Post
    ^^ I think he's in the Robby Cano camp -- nice tools but not the will to be the best. I'd challenge the idea that he's not fixed the results in years past a little bit though.

    May 12, 2012 - July 31, 2012: 8-4 (team 10-4), 4.11 ERA, 81IP/81K/31BB
    May 16, 2013 - End of season: 8-5 (team 14-9), 3.81ERA, 130IP/104K/55BB

    IMO he has made improvements in his results in seasons past and has done so for longer sustained runs. However, taking the first six weeks of the season to get settled into the season and capping your year around 160IP are no way to get beyond #5 starter status. I wonder when, if ever, we'll see him enjoy any prolonged success as a SP.

    My biggest concern is the regression in his k-rate. 9.3 => 7.7 => 6.1 is a very bad trend when things like h/9 and bb/9 have stayed relatively flat. It's not like he's striking out fewer guys as a tradeoff for walking fewer and/or getting more contact and pitching deeper into games as a result.

    FWIW I wish we could get him on another mid-season run and deal him while he seems cheap.
    I remember those streaks that he went on and last year he was a serviceable pitcher and I agree with you that it would be nice to trade him after one of his hot streaks.

    I don't like the fact that in year(s) past he's come into camp out of shape, I get irritated with the average Doubront start (5IP and 100 pitches), he seems to have regressed, etc.

    His velocity is down, 87-88MPH average fastball scares me (especially when he should be entering his prime as a 26 year old), and I don't know about you but I get so damn tired of the, "I feel the best I've ever felt" and I'm finally healthy schtick. Maybe I'm overreacting. I just get irritated with players who more or less seem to make excuses as far as their stats are concerned.

    There is some verity to the Robby Cano comparison. Which leads me to get more irritated with the guy haha. So much talent, but are satisfied with not becoming more.

    Now, when healthy, he's due to replace Workman in the rotation...I'd much rather Workman every 5th day honestly, and I'm not merely basing it off of 1-hitting the O's.

  11. #11
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    I am too lazy to look it up but was Workman 1 that we got from Dodgers?

    Thank you K.G. JR!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by cocossox View Post
    I am too lazy to look it up but was Workman 1 that we got from Dodgers?
    Nah, he was a second round draft pick out of Texas (college) in 2010.

    You're thinking of Webster.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by goshhhjosh View Post
    I remember those streaks that he went on and last year he was a serviceable pitcher and I agree with you that it would be nice to trade him after one of his hot streaks.

    I don't like the fact that in year(s) past he's come into camp out of shape, I get irritated with the average Doubront start (5IP and 100 pitches), he seems to have regressed, etc.

    His velocity is down, 87-88MPH average fastball scares me (especially when he should be entering his prime as a 26 year old), and I don't know about you but I get so damn tired of the, "I feel the best I've ever felt" and I'm finally healthy schtick. Maybe I'm overreacting. I just get irritated with players who more or less seem to make excuses as far as their stats are concerned.

    There is some verity to the Robby Cano comparison. Which leads me to get more irritated with the guy haha. So much talent, but are satisfied with not becoming more.

    Now, when healthy, he's due to replace Workman in the rotation...I'd much rather Workman every 5th day honestly, and I'm not merely basing it off of 1-hitting the O's.
    I completely agree with all of this. In 2012 when he was racking up Ks (something like the 3rd or 4th best k-rate among LHP) he looked like he was going to be an anchor to the rotation in the future. His slow-out-of-the-gate routine is tiresome to say the least and his inefficiency is infuriating. He may be best served moving to the BP where he can throw gas and try to strike guys out... rather than follow the Bard route of SP progression to lasting longer in games.

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