Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 1 of 39 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 572
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bratislava
    Posts
    79,414
    vCash
    1500

    2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread (2)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lombardi24 View Post
    ~
    I agree hard hitting in the NFL leads to fines and penalties these days. We got to get a safety that is smart and has the abilities to cover and not be out of position all the time.
    It's not even about the fines and penalties. It's about what a safety who can actually play single high lets you do. Versus one who gets on ESPN's big hits show.

    It's so underestimated because we're so sad when GB doesn't get enough highlight hits that what we're really missing is a safety who you can trust to play single high, IMO.
    When I asked how a Manziel fan could bash Bridgewater's size.


    Quote Originally Posted by flgatorsandjags View Post
    Manziel is shorter than Teddy but he has size 15 feet
    Yeah...it's that bad.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Janesville, WI
    Posts
    5,948
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevolu View Post
    I think about 5 of us tell every1 else this every year though. Hard hitting shouldn't be the top quality in a Safety. I hate when people bring up a safety and say he is a hard hitter. Who cares. I'd rather have a good tackler, good coverage, good run support, good range, etc. etc.
    So basically you want the next Earl Thomas? They don't exactly grow on trees lol.

    ~ * ~ MINISTER OF DEFENSE ~*~

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Janesville, WI
    Posts
    5,948
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by NormSized View Post
    It's not even about the fines and penalties. It's about what a safety who can actually play single high lets you do. Versus one who gets on ESPN's big hits show.

    It's so underestimated because we're so sad when GB doesn't get enough highlight hits that what we're really missing is a safety who you can trust to play single high, IMO.
    Good post norm.

    ~ * ~ MINISTER OF DEFENSE ~*~

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    210
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevolu View Post
    I think about 5 of us tell every1 else this every year though. Hard hitting shouldn't be the top quality in a Safety. I hate when people bring up a safety and say he is a hard hitter. Who cares. I'd rather have a good tackler, good coverage, good run support, good range, etc. etc.
    Agree Completely!!! Range, speed, basically a good sized corner should be the perfect safety, the Ed Reid type, Nick Collins type, has anyone ever thought maybe they would transition Tramon there?? Kinda like they did with Wood? Just a thought, I don't care who it is, but the main physical trait he should have is ball hawking instincts. I don't give a rip about hits, tackle and then pick it off when you have the chance, hitters are just a bonus.

  5. #5
    Dcup's Avatar
    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ankeny, Iowa
    Posts
    6,260
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by NormSized View Post
    I don't believe in moar tuffniss. I believe in more coverage ability. Someone who has the potential for single high. Hitting hard doesn't let us play single high. This isn't MMA. I'ts the NFL in 2014.
    I believe in coverage ability too - however if we drafted Pryor I guarantee you that Burnett is our centerfielder not Pryor. TJ Ward and Jairus Byrd are the same type of player that Pryor is, but yet everyone wants to sign one of them?

    Agreed that Byrd is more multi-dimensional than just hard hitting, but he can lay the wood now too. Same with Ward. Who's to say Pryor wouldn't develop into that type of player?

    It's funny that everyone is bashing the Calvin Pryor pick because he is a "toughness" guy that likes to hit - but everyone also bashes AJ Hawk about how he doesn't hit hard enough or make impact plays from the ILB position. Well what's it going to be, either you want guys that hit or not.

    I don't think "toughness" is overrated at all - hell the Baltimore Ravens and the San Francisco 49ers - that is the first thing you think of when you talk about their defenses - throw in Carolina and Seattle too. They have tough guys that can cover, but will also come up and lay the smack down on you. Name one player on this defense that will do that...

    Just my opinion.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Berlin
    Posts
    5,420
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcup View Post
    I believe in coverage ability too - however if we drafted Pryor I guarantee you that Burnett is our centerfielder not Pryor. TJ Ward and Jairus Byrd are the same type of player that Pryor is, but yet everyone wants to sign one of them?

    Agreed that Byrd is more multi-dimensional than just hard hitting, but he can lay the wood now too. Same with Ward. Who's to say Pryor wouldn't develop into that type of player?

    It's funny that everyone is bashing the Calvin Pryor pick because he is a "toughness" guy that likes to hit - but everyone also bashes AJ Hawk about how he doesn't hit hard enough or make impact plays from the ILB position. Well what's it going to be, either you want guys that hit or not.

    I don't think "toughness" is overrated at all - hell the Baltimore Ravens and the San Francisco 49ers - that is the first thing you think of when you talk about their defenses - throw in Carolina and Seattle too. They have tough guys that can cover, but will also come up and lay the smack down on you. Name one player on this defense that will do that...

    Just my opinion.
    1. Ward and Byrd are different types of S. You can't just compare them with one another. Moreover, both Byrd and Ward are proven and Pryor is not. I don't have anything against Pryor but I don't want him in the first round TBH. The value is not good enough.

    2. ILB and S are different positions. The comparison is invalid.

    3. I think both Carolina and the 49ers to an extend don't have a great secondary. The Raven probably too. They have great front 7 who can pressure the QB which makes it easier for the secondary. Whitner for example isn't great in coverage but he is a hard hitter. And you know what happend when Whitner met Lacy? http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_...dieLacyBig.gif
    http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/b...acyWhitner.gif
    Last edited by Berliner; 02-18-2014 at 11:50 AM.

  7. #7
    Dcup's Avatar
    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ankeny, Iowa
    Posts
    6,260
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Berliner View Post
    1. Ward and Byrd are different types of S. You can't just compare them with one another. Moreover, both Byrd and Ward are proven and Pryor is not. I don't have anything against Pryor but I don't want him in the first round TBH. The value is not good enough.

    2. ILB and S are different positions. The comparison is invalid.

    3. I think both Carolina and the 49ers to an extend don't have a great secondary. The Raven probably too. They have great front 7 who can pressure the QB which makes it easier for the secondary. Whitner for example isn't great in coverage but he is a hard hitter. And you know what happend when Whitner met Lacy? http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_...dieLacyBig.gif
    http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/b...acyWhitner.gif
    Good points and fair. And to be clear, I don't like the guy because he is simply a hard hitter. I think that may have gotten people a bit misconstrued on the big picture.

    I'm not trying to compare ILB and S, but rather playmaking ability. And I also understand that Pryor is not proven and Ward and Byrd are - but doesn't that apply to every player in the draft? Dix isn't proven just as Pryor isn't proven.

    Bottom line is I like the guy and the attitude that he plays with on the field. I don't like him simply because he is a hard hitter, but he makes plays. He makes plays outside of the big hits, but the big hits obviously stand out more.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Berlin
    Posts
    5,420
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcup View Post
    Good points and fair. And to be clear, I don't like the guy because he is simply a hard hitter. I think that may have gotten people a bit misconstrued on the big picture.

    I'm not trying to compare ILB and S, but rather playmaking ability. And I also understand that Pryor is not proven and Ward and Byrd are - but doesn't that apply to every player in the draft? Dix isn't proven just as Pryor isn't proven.

    Bottom line is I like the guy and the attitude that he plays with on the field. I don't like him simply because he is a hard hitter, but he makes plays. He makes plays outside of the big hits, but the big hits obviously stand out more.
    I think Clinton-Dix is the better safety for us. He seems to know his assignements and doesn't allow too many big plays. That's exactly what we need. Somebody back there who can hold his own and knows what he is supposed to do.

    But ILB and S are different and so should be there playmaking ability. An ILB should hit hard, stuff the run and should at least not be liability in coverage. A safety has to cover first of all. He needs ball skills and should be a good tackle. This doesn't me he has to tackle hard but wrap up correctly and doesn't allow missed tackles because he is the last man of the defense.

    Clinto-Dix is IMO more talented than Pryor and better suited for us. He is probably a late 1st round pick but he will be reach because many teams desperately need a safety. Pryor is not a first round guy and I would like other safeties (eg. Ward) before him.

    Would you rather draft Pryor, Ward or Dix? And in which round should they be drafted?

  9. #9
    Dcup's Avatar
    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ankeny, Iowa
    Posts
    6,260
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Berliner View Post
    I think Clinton-Dix is the better safety for us. He seems to know his assignements and doesn't allow too many big plays. That's exactly what we need. Somebody back there who can hold his own and knows what he is supposed to do.

    But ILB and S are different and so should be there playmaking ability. An ILB should hit hard, stuff the run and should at least not be liability in coverage. A safety has to cover first of all. He needs ball skills and should be a good tackle. This doesn't me he has to tackle hard but wrap up correctly and doesn't allow missed tackles because he is the last man of the defense.

    Clinto-Dix is IMO more talented than Pryor and better suited for us. He is probably a late 1st round pick but he will be reach because many teams desperately need a safety. Pryor is not a first round guy and I would like other safeties (eg. Ward) before him.

    Would you rather draft Pryor, Ward or Dix? And in which round should they be drafted?
    From everything that I've seen or read on all three players - one of which (Ward) I have seen play in person twice, I agree Dix is definitely the guy I would want. But based on draft slot and other teams' needs in front and behind us I think it's Pryor for me.

    Ward is a nice player, but maybe I am too hung up on Pryor's highlight film.

    Dix should be top ten pick IMO - Pryor early second and Ward mid to late third. All of course my opinion.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

  10. #10
    Dcup's Avatar
    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ankeny, Iowa
    Posts
    6,260
    vCash
    1500
    With that being said - top ten picks of the second round and last ten picks of the first round don't have that much separation in value - again, IMO.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Berlin
    Posts
    5,420
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcup View Post
    From everything that I've seen or read on all three players - one of which (Ward) I have seen play in person twice, I agree Dix is definitely the guy I would want. But based on draft slot and other teams' needs in front and behind us I think it's Pryor for me.

    Ward is a nice player, but maybe I am too hung up on Pryor's highlight film.

    Dix should be top ten pick IMO - Pryor early second and Ward mid to late third. All of course my opinion.
    Do you think Dix is top 10 talent or just a top 10 player because of need? I've never seen him in any mock draft FWIW.

    What were your impression of Ward when you saw him if you can remember him?

    And I don't like highlight videos for any player. Players are never as good as their highlights and never as bad as their worst play

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Berlin
    Posts
    5,420
    vCash
    1500
    FWIW Mayock just called Pryor a bigger version of Bob Sanders and the draft is deeper than many years before. A top 20 pick is like a top 10 pick last year

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bratislava
    Posts
    79,414
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcup View Post
    I believe in coverage ability too - however if we drafted Pryor I guarantee you that Burnett is our centerfielder not Pryor. TJ Ward and Jairus Byrd are the same type of player that Pryor is, but yet everyone wants to sign one of them?

    Agreed that Byrd is more multi-dimensional than just hard hitting, but he can lay the wood now too. Same with Ward. Who's to say Pryor wouldn't develop into that type of player?

    It's funny that everyone is bashing the Calvin Pryor pick because he is a "toughness" guy that likes to hit - but everyone also bashes AJ Hawk about how he doesn't hit hard enough or make impact plays from the ILB position. Well what's it going to be, either you want guys that hit or not.

    I don't think "toughness" is overrated at all - hell the Baltimore Ravens and the San Francisco 49ers - that is the first thing you think of when you talk about their defenses - throw in Carolina and Seattle too. They have tough guys that can cover, but will also come up and lay the smack down on you. Name one player on this defense that will do that...

    Just my opinion.
    I don't think Burnett is a center fielder. That's the issue. Burnett is a good man cover safety. He can't play CF. That's pretty proven by now.

    I don't bash Hawk for that. I don't believe in it. It's why I've been post "moar tufniss!!!!" for what? 2 years? I think it's the most overrated flaw on the team.

    Those defenses you all named were great because they were great. Not because they all hit people super hard. Who's the big monster hitters on CAR btw? There really isn't any. People just all the sudden go TUFFFFFFFNISSSSSSSSSSSSS once a D gets great, no matter what.
    When I asked how a Manziel fan could bash Bridgewater's size.


    Quote Originally Posted by flgatorsandjags View Post
    Manziel is shorter than Teddy but he has size 15 feet
    Yeah...it's that bad.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bratislava
    Posts
    79,414
    vCash
    1500
    What I'm trying to say is, getting a bunch of hitters isn't going to make us a great defense. Those great defenders find places where they can play guys like Whitner or Pollard and they aren't liabilities because of all the damn talent they have everywhere else. It starts with things like being able to play single high, like I've been preaching, that's what allows that SS to roam. It's not the SS hitting people hard that makes your safeties be able to play single high lol
    When I asked how a Manziel fan could bash Bridgewater's size.


    Quote Originally Posted by flgatorsandjags View Post
    Manziel is shorter than Teddy but he has size 15 feet
    Yeah...it's that bad.

  15. #15
    Dcup's Avatar
    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ankeny, Iowa
    Posts
    6,260
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Berliner View Post
    FWIW Mayock just called Pryor a bigger version of Bob Sanders and the draft is deeper than many years before. A top 20 pick is like a top 10 pick last year
    They say that every year, but nobody really knows. Anyway, I saw Sanders play all the way through college. He might be a guy that I've seen play in person out of anybody in any sport the most.

    It's not that great of a comparison really. Granted, I haven't seen Pryor play in person, but I did stay at Holiday Inn last night. Again, just my opinion, I really like Pryor.

    Who do you think we draft in the first round? Or who do you want us to draft in the first round?
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

Page 1 of 39 12311 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •