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  1. #1
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    How has this player escaped the "chucker" label?

    his career FG% seems pretty solid at 49.0%, which places him just below a pair of certain HOF's in Bosh (50.4%) and Garnett (49.7%). but look a little closer.

    due to a lack of 3 point shot and relatively low free throw rates, his shot attempts produce an average of just 1.15 points per shot, sitting him in the bottom 15% of all qualified players in the NBA, placing him squarely in the company of well known "chuckers" Al Jefferson and Zach Randolph.

    this is not new for him. he has compiled a 1.19 points per shot rate spanning his 8 seasons in the NBA, routinely sitting in the bottom 15-25%. except this season he has taken it to an entirely new level.

    if you are not familiar with points per shot (PPS), it is exactly as it sounds. it tells us essentially how good an investment a shot attempt from a player is for his teams offense.

    there are only so many offensive possession in a game, although the exact number obviously varies. the average usually falls within the range of 90-100. if a player consumes 15-20 of them per game with a very low PPS he is putting a very large burden on his teammates to make up the difference with efficient offensive play.

    with that in mind let's consider what our two previous examples, Bosh and Garnett did in their seasons up to this players current age while they were the clear undisputed best offensive players on their team. again using PPS as our measure.

    Bosh: 1.38
    Garnett: 1.21

    this is interesting. for a moment i almost reconsidered this entire post when i turned up that number on Garnett.

    if Kevin Garnett was barely producing more per field goal attempt than 'player X' than maybe i've got this all wrong. but then i thought, who exactly did Garnett have to help him offensively? did it make a difference? as you might expect, it did.

    his highest PPS while he was with those dreadful TWolves teams was 1.33 in his age 28 season when he had help from Szczerbiak, Cassell and Sprewell. that seems logical, the more help you get the easier your job should theoretically be on the offensive end.

    so Garnett fits the description of a guy who struggled to carry an offense because he wasn't a great scorer. hard to call a guy a chucker under those circumstances.

    but enough about Garnett. does our mystery player fit that description as well? not really.

    the player in question is shooting more often, and less efficiently, the more talent he has around him, or so it seems.

    so that brings me back to the original question: how has this player managed to escape the dreaded label of chucker?

    Al Jefferson, despite very similar offensive numbers and efficiency didn't. Carmelo Anthony can't go 2 days in this forum without being called a chucker (for good reason) despite being much more efficient that this player. Monta Ellis did not, despite a career PPS that is exactly 0.01 lower than this player.

    and a new one arises: how on earth is this guy, who leads the NBA in field goal attempts despite very poor efficiency (and numerous teammates who are much more efficient weapons) 3rd on NBA.com's MVP Ladder? Shoot, i gave it away didn't i.

    shame on you NBA.com. shame on you.
    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 02-02-2014 at 05:35 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  2. #2
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    I've always thought he was a rather inefficient player.

    Hence why I never wanted to deal Noah for him when rumors of his availability came out.

  3. #3
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    I'm guessing LA?

    I didnt cheat.

    Quote Originally Posted by NYSpirit1 View Post
    The Knicks were never this bad of a team. They always have been a 48-50 win team stuck in what was a 21-40 team's body.

  4. #4
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    and his ORtg this year is below his career average.

  5. #5
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    It's funny how the word "chucker" wasn't even applicable to the game of basketball until like maybe 5-6 yrs ago.

    Next thing you'll know, we'll be using the word "HOARDERS" for guys who have a tendency to dribble the ball just a little more than other guys. They'll probably average 12+ assists per game, but if they are the guys who constantly dribble the ball to set up other guys, and take up most of the 24 second shot clock, I wouldn't be surprised if ESPN started this movement of calling them HOARDERS, which then idiots on this sports forum will start overusing, like they have with the word CHUCKER.

    It's comical how the mind of a basketball fan continues to de-evolve into dumb crap.

  6. #6
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    That exactly what I was bringing up before. Bosh in Toronto averaged 24 ppg shooting only 16 something times per game, LA needs 21 shots per game to average that. Kind of crazy.

  7. #7
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    always thought what was so special about this guy.

    he has always taken a lot of shots to score a lot of points.

    Takes a lot of long 2 point shots, average rebounder. doesnt get to the line often.

    Quote Originally Posted by NYSpirit1 View Post
    The Knicks were never this bad of a team. They always have been a 48-50 win team stuck in what was a 21-40 team's body.

  8. #8
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    The numbers I see have him at 1.15 this year and 1.17 for his career - avge for PFs is 1.21 and the league is at 1.21 this season too. It's not like he's awful.

    I'd say it's partly because he's a big, and 'chucker' is applied to them much less often than it is to guards and wings; partly because 'chucker' is a loose term that usually applies to guys with a low FG% and high volume - ie it's a guy perception thing rather than taking into things like threes and free throws like PPS does, and his FG% hasn't been that bad; and mostly because 'chucker' is largely reputational and his volume hasn't been that high until recently - he hadn't even been in the top 20 in usage rate until this season, despite being a bona fide star.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by P&GRealist View Post
    It's funny how the word "chucker" wasn't even applicable to the game of basketball until like maybe 5-6 yrs ago.

    Next thing you'll know, we'll be using the word "HOARDERS" for guys who have a tendency to dribble the ball just a little more than other guys. They'll probably average 12+ assists per game, but if they are the guys who constantly dribble the ball to set up other guys, and take up most of the 24 second shot clock, I wouldn't be surprised if ESPN started this movement of calling them HOARDERS, which then idiots on this sports forum will start overusing, like they have with the word CHUCKER.

    It's comical how the mind of a basketball fan continues to de-evolve into dumb crap.
    let me guess.. laker fan?

  10. #10
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    He is pretty inefficient for a big but I think the MVP ladder has some to do with the really good interior defense, very good rebounding and great FT shoot for a big.

  11. #11
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    hes good but not as good as people make him out to be. he takes some pretty ill advised shots
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  12. #12
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    Never liked the 'poor LA being so underappreciated'. He's so boring and like this thread states, a chucker.

    But slow down on the Bosh a certain HOFer... just because he rides the Heat overly stacked roster doesn't make him hof worthy. At least not in my eyes

  13. #13
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    I still wouldn't call him a chucker, it's not a significant enough difference from the average.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Bird
    It doesn't matter who scores the points, it's who can get the ball to the scorer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Jordan
    Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThuglifeJ View Post
    Never liked the 'poor LA being so underappreciated'. He's so boring and like this thread states, a chucker.

    But slow down on the Bosh a certain HOFer... just because he rides the Heat overly stacked roster doesn't make him hof worthy. At least not in my eyes
    hes probaby going to finish his career with like 19/8 2-4 titles. probably 14 all star games.. yeah. thats HOF
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goose17 View Post
    I still wouldn't call him a chucker, it's not a significant enough difference from the average.
    if he's not a chucker though, why is anybody called a chucker? to me it's for below average efficiency and high volume and he certainly meets both those criteria.

    Melo has the stigma of chucker.
    Jefferson who has similar numbers is definitely labeled by most a chucker.

    again, he's a very good player. but the biggest difference between Portland this year is the play of Lillard, Matthews and Batum. because other than the nice jump in rebounding Aldridge is doing the same as always.
    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 02-02-2014 at 02:52 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

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