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  1. #1
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    Is this what the NBA has come to?

    I know it's been going on for a few years, but how does a player like Durant drop 36 points on a 8-21 shooting, with 18-20 at the free throw line?

    Although I love Durant, but how did this happen with all these ticky-tack fouls and just shooting free throws?

    On the season, free throw attempt leaders:

    Durant - 399
    Howard - 380
    Blake Griffin - 316
    Cousins - 314
    Harden - 313

    I find this awfully annoying and sad that this is what the NBA has come down to.. who can win by shooting free throws.

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  3. #3
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    The NBA enjoyed a surge in popularity in the early 2000's.

    Since then things have changed so much.... I don't think I know exactly why.

    But as a result the NBA's popularity is sinking like a stone with sports like the NHL overtaking it.

    The bottomline is that small market owners are probably most to blame. The rules they imposed on the new collective bargaining agreement make it impossible for teams to get any better except through the draft.

    Thats why we have the god awful product that is on the floor today
    Proof that I'm Always Right: http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=756103
    and http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=773028



    New Prediction: LeBron will be Knicks



  4. #4
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    FT/FGA for teams since 1946-47:
    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...der_by=ft_rate
    Note that there are only two teams from this millennium in the top 100.


    FTA per 36minutes for players since 1946/47:
    http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._by=fta_per_mp
    Notice that a small minority of the top guys are current players.


    This is in your head, OP. Free throw rates aren't up, for teams or individuals. Durant is seriously great at drawing fouls and getting to the line, and Dwight is good at it too, with the addition of dozens of intentional fouls at the end of games. That's all that's happening here.

  5. #5
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    Its not the quantity of the fouls that are different, its the quality of the fouls. Fouls back in the day were real fouls. Real fouls now are flagrants and fines, players try to "back off" in those situations and get fouls called on them anyway.

    I don't care what any free throw rates tell you, the way players use the whistles to their advantage in today's NBA is drastically different than it used to be. Trying to get a bucket has taken a backseat to trying to get to the FT line. Fouls used to occur while making legitimate basketball plays, you didn't see guys run into someones shoulder on the drive and throw the ball at the backboard while "LeBroning" to the floor.

    I would love to see a highlight of Durants 20 FTs, or better yet a game where Harden gets 20 FTs, side by side to a game where MJ got to the line a ton against the Knicks and compare fouls.
    Last edited by D-Leethal; 01-17-2014 at 10:00 AM.

  6. #6
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    KD is a nightmare to defend and there's a new emphasis on "protecting the shooter" i.e. not hitting him on the elbow as he shoots or sliding into/ under him as he shoots. Dwight, Boogie, and Blake are so physical they're going to routinely get there.

    Only one on that list I take issue with is Harden. He flagrantly, blatantly acts to fool the the ref....

  7. #7
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    I was at that game last night. A lot of ticky tack fouls called. Just how it is. That has always been how it is for superstars, though. MJ had it like that.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by PraiseJesus View Post
    The NBA enjoyed a surge in popularity in the early 2000's.

    Since then things have changed so much.... I don't think I know exactly why.

    But as a result the NBA's popularity is sinking like a stone with sports like the NHL overtaking it.

    The bottomline is that small market owners are probably most to blame. The rules they imposed on the new collective bargaining agreement make it impossible for teams to get any better except through the draft.

    Thats why we have the god awful product that is on the floor today
    Please, don't make me laugh right now.

    Its Over.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamShaker View Post
    I was at that game last night. A lot of ticky tack fouls called. Just how it is. That has always been how it is for superstars, though. MJ had it like that.
    On MSG they show old school Knicks vs Bulls games all the time, MJ used to get his mother****ing *** whooped. The pampered divas of today would call for wheelchairs and beg the refs for flagrant 2s. MJ got up, took his FTs, and came back for more. He took the punishment with a smile. It was beautiful to watch.

  10. #10
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    Yeah, like bholly said, FT rates league-wide aren't up. I remember making a long post about that last year.

    Durant is a ton of fun to watch, but I have always been irked by his foul drawing moreso than anyone else. He's just so long and lanky, so much so that even the most ticky-tack fouls are going to look more than just that with frequency. He's tremendous at drawing contact and playing to that, but it has long annoyed me. I don't blame him for it or anything, it's just not fun to watch, stagnates things and is annoying.


    But, while the league has changed, free throw rates as a whole haven't much. That is a fact. We might have individuals who are better at drawing fouls, but league-wide we're not seeing higher free throw rates. We've had teams at historically low levels lately, and consistently so.


    Guys like Durant and Harden are drawing fouls at outrageous and annoying rates, again, big picture? League-wide? It's a non-story.
    [IMG]hi[/IMG]

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Leethal View Post
    Its not the quantity of the fouls that are different, its the quality of the fouls. Fouls back in the day were real fouls. Real fouls now are flagrants and fines, players try to "back off" in those situations and get fouls called on them anyway.

    I don't care what any free throw rates tell you, the way players use the whistles to their advantage in today's NBA is drastically different than it used to be. Trying to get a bucket has taken a backseat to trying to get to the FT line. Fouls used to occur while making legitimate basketball plays, you didn't see guys run into someones shoulder on the drive and throw the ball at the backboard while "LeBroning" to the floor.

    I would love to see a highlight of Durants 20 FTs, or better yet a game where Harden gets 20 FTs, side by side to a game where MJ got to the line a ton against the Knicks and compare fouls.
    Pretty much.

  12. #12
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    I have posted this before - but it is a prime example of what people mean when they say the leagues done gone soft. Its not about the foul shot totals - leave that **** at the door. Its the fouls that are getting whistled, not the quantity of them - the quality of them.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bM-Y4UoiAY

    40 stitches and not even deemed a flagrant. Malone might get suspended for the entire year for that in todays NBA.

    When players used to drive the lane and get to the line, the opposing team was allowed to make them regret it. They were awarded FTs yes, but teams were allowed to dissuade them from trying to do it again. Today they get the FTs and can keep coming back for more without any fear of repercussions. Its soft. NBA is BY FAR the softest league out there - in all other sports venting your frustrations with a little scuffle is accepted and part of the game. NBA you get suspended for freaking pushing! You know why? Its racially motivated and it sucks but its true.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Leethal View Post
    On MSG they show old school Knicks vs Bulls games all the time, MJ used to get his mother****ing *** whooped. The pampered divas of today would call for wheelchairs and beg the refs for flagrant 2s. MJ got up, took his FTs, and came back for more. He took the punishment with a smile. It was beautiful to watch.
    MJ's tough because while a lot of that certainly is true, I feel like the whole "star-treatment" thing started to come to a rise with him. I'm too young to really know that for sure, but that's the impression of the narrative I've gathered. You have guys like PJ and other Bulls-centric people complaining that he got fouled on literally every single play, and then a strong counter presence. He definitely got hit harder with more regularity than most people, and he didn't start getting calls in his career until he really became that relentless slasher (like KD and Harden). There was more leeway for harder fouls, for sure, but again, the game has changed. Defenses have adapted. Comparing these eras is apples to oranges.

    But again, we're not witnessing leagues where free throw rates are any higher than before. It seems annoying, but I think outside Durant and Harden we're not seeing really any outliers compared to the league's entire history. And those two are among the absolute best we've ever seen at drawing contact and using that as an advantage.
    [IMG]hi[/IMG]

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by PraiseJesus View Post
    The NBA enjoyed a surge in popularity in the early 2000's.

    Since then things have changed so much.... I don't think I know exactly why.

    But as a result the NBA's popularity is sinking like a stone with sports like the NHL overtaking it.

    The bottomline is that small market owners are probably most to blame. The rules they imposed on the new collective bargaining agreement make it impossible for teams to get any better except through the draft.

    Thats why we have the god awful product that is on the floor today
    I would love to see some source backing up your claim that the nhl is overtaking the nba in popularity.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Leethal View Post
    I have posted this before - but it is a prime example of what people mean when they say the leagues done gone soft. Its not about the foul shot totals - leave that **** at the door. Its the fouls that are getting whistled, not the quantity of them - the quality of them.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bM-Y4UoiAY

    40 stitches and not even deemed a flagrant. Malone might get suspended for the entire year for that in todays NBA.

    When players used to drive the lane and get to the line, the opposing team was allowed to make them regret it. They were awarded FTs yes, but teams were allowed to dissuade them from trying to do it again. Today they get the FTs and can keep coming back for more without any fear of repercussions. Its soft. NBA is BY FAR the softest league out there - in all other sports venting your frustrations with a little scuffle is accepted and part of the game. NBA you get suspended for freaking pushing! You know why? Its racially motivated and it sucks but its true.
    Yea that's crazy... Sort of reminds me of the Dr. J/Larry Bird fight.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4oF34p3-rQ

    I mean that was pretty crazy and here were the punishments-

    In the aftermath, the NBA Office handed out a grand total of $30,500 worth of fines. The two prime combatants, Bird and Erving were each assessed a pink slip of $7,500 each. M. L. Carr and Moses Malone each drew a $3,000 fine, Charles Barkley $1,000 for fighting and Bill Cunningham a $2,500 setback for post game comments. 12 other players (six from each team) each drew a fine of $500 for leaving their respective bench during the melee.
    Times have just changed though man. For the most part it seems the players have adjusted to it.The league tries to protect the players (for obvious reasons) more than before and maybe it's for the best in terms of guys longevity I don't know. It is a little annoying when they make such a big deal of out a "clean" hard foul, but it is what it is. I do miss how it was back in terms of allowing players to have emotion in the heat of the moment and refs not being so whistle happy.

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