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  1. #1
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    Are we stunting the growth of our skilled players?

    I do like Torts as our Head Coach but I'm beginning to wonder if his style of play is hindering our skilled players offensively. Thoughts?

  2. #2
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    Who are our skilled players outside of Nash, Richards, Gaborik, Stepan, Callahan,DelZotto and McDonagh? Kreider has potential but he's young yet so any talk of Torts spoiling his growth isn't relevant as he's had a bad year overall without Torts. Hagelin is a fast forechecking forward with limited shooting or passing abilities, so I'd say he's actually overachieving with where he plays. I personally think Torts has done a great job with DelZotto and Hagelin especially, as well as Anisimov, Stepan, Boyle, Girardi and McDonagh. I'm not able to name someone who Torts didn't help in NY really, trying to think of players who have succeeded since they left here but can't think of any really.

    Realistically we have only Gaborik, Nash, Richards, Callahan, Stepan and DelZotto who are offensively skilled. Kreider is skilled but he's young and just making his way. I'm just wondering who you think is being stunted by Torts?

  3. #3
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    This is like an arguement the Jets fans used to make for Sanchez. "The Jets need to open up the offense for Mark, blah, blah, blah."

    I was not always on board with Torts. My problem is that sometimes he doesn't get the players to do what he preaches. However, there is no doubt that this system works.

    The power play is another story.

    *Outside of our first line, which is maybe the most skilled line in hockey, this team doesn't have that much skill. We have good speed, defensive defenseman, and goaltending.
    Last edited by fingerbang; 02-01-2013 at 06:44 PM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by fingerbang View Post
    This is like an arguement the Jets fans used to make for Sanchez. "The Jets need to open up the offense for Mark, blah, blah, blah."

    I was not always on board with Torts. My problem is that sometimes he doesn't get the players to do what he preaches. However, there is no doubt that this system works.

    The power play is another story.

    *Outside of our first line, which is may be the most skilled line in hockey, this team doesn't have that much skill. We have good speed, defensive defenseman, and goaltending.
    I agree totally with this. Especially your last statement.

  5. #5
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    In my opinion we do. We play overly conservatively in a phone booth where guys seem to fear being creative or turning the puck over by making a pass that is not up the side boards. We have a lot of firepower. I would add Mcdonnah and Girardi to that list of players who have some offensive skill. Even Staal started showing some in the past. I remember watching the finals in shock at some of the crazy passes the Kings defense were making. It was turnover city BUT it showed me that their guys did not live in fear of making a mistake. We have one of the best goalies in the world. We have a very good group of dmen. We have experienced and young offensive players. For gosh sake we may have 3 of the fastest 10 players in the NHL. Why play to the lowest common denominator? Its like when people used to say Dean Smith was the only guy capable of keeping Micheal Jordan under 20 points per game. We are a Ferrari with a governor on it that only lets it drive up to 60MPH. Take the governor off. Lets put the gas pedal to the floor more often. I'm not saying we have to get crazy. Just some balance and moderation. How many analysts said we would be in the cup before the season. There is good reason for that. We have very strong talent from goal to defense to forwards.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsi View Post
    I'm not able to name someone who Torts didn't help in NY really, trying to think of players who have succeeded since they left here but can't think of any really.
    PA Parenteau. The guy that supposedly was too small, too slow, did not play enough defense, did not play the boards enough. PA had 67 points last season and has 7 points in 7 games this season .

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsi View Post
    I agree totally with this. Especially your last statement.
    Last sentence you already said, shoulda quoted you.

  8. #8
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    PA is off to an incredible start this year but I don't expect a guy that only takes 160 shots a season to continue scoring goals. Just because he's productive in a losing system doesn't mean we could utilize him the right way. I don't think playing the the Islanders of last year or the Avalanche is our ticket to success.

  9. #9
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    I like Torts a a person. I like when Torts puts Brooks in his place. I just dislike Torts system. I think it limits our ceiling as a team and is as exciting as watching paint dry. If you like Torts system I'm happy for you. Ironically years ago Torts would have hated aspects of this system. So would have Slats.

    We have become the Devils. I hated watching the Devils style of play with them winning cups. We have the same lack of excitement and that is without the cups to make up for it. Its like having a baseball team that always tries to win games 2-1 or 1-0 or a basketball team that loves 85-79 wins.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SLY WILLIAMS View Post
    In my opinion we do. We play overly conservatively in a phone booth where guys seem to fear being creative or turning the puck over by making a pass that is not up the side boards. We have a lot of firepower. I would add Mcdonnah and Girardi to that list of players who have some offensive skill. Even Staal started showing some in the past. I remember watching the finals in shock at some of the crazy passes the Kings defense were making. It was turnover city BUT it showed me that their guys did not live in fear of making a mistake. We have one of the best goalies in the world. We have a very good group of dmen. We have experienced and young offensive players. For gosh sake we may have 3 of the fastest 10 players in the NHL. Why play to the lowest common denominator? Its like when people used to say Dean Smith was the only guy capable of keeping Micheal Jordan under 20 points per game. We are a Ferrari with a governor on it that only lets it drive up to 60MPH. Take the governor off. Lets put the gas pedal to the floor more often. I'm not saying we have to get crazy. Just some balance and moderation. How many analysts said we would be in the cup before the season. There is good reason for that. We have very strong talent from goal to defense to forwards.
    Part of the reason people are picking us for the cup this year is our coach and our system. Our system got us one game away from a stanley cup final last year, win that game and it's us against the Kings. Everyone loves it when we're winning, but as soon as you lose a couple games the blame birds come out and everyone wants to fire the coaches. I really don't know what anyone is talking about there being a govenor on, Gaborik has had 2 40 goal seasons under this system. If you are a good player on this team you can go ahead and score as much as you want, but the problem is that we have two goal scorers, one set up guy and a bunch of 10-20 goal scorers.

    Parenteau is the only guy you can think of? Parenteau's last year here was 2009-10 and Torts was hired in 09, the only time he got any NHL games with the Rangers was with Tortorella and he got 22 of them and managed 3 goals. I admit he may have slipped through the cracks but he had 3 years in Hartford where he wasn't used Tom Renney either so it might not all be on Tortorella. Guys like Ansimov, Dubinsky, Stepan, DelZotto, Hagelin, Girardi, McDonagh, Prust, Lundqvist, Staal etc have all succeeded under Torts...that's not a bad record for a guy who was hired in Feb of 09 and basically has coached here for 3 seasons.

  11. #11
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    I don't really care what it looks like, I just want them to win. Getting the puck in deep and grinding away is a recipe for success and I'll take it. Although, we haven't done it well this year.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsi View Post
    Everyone loves it when we're winning, but as soon as you lose a couple games the blame birds come out and everyone wants to fire the coaches.
    That is not entirely accurate. I know more than a few long time Rangers fans that no longer even watch the games. It has nothing to do with winning or losing. They find the games boring as heck. I do not love this when we are winning anymore than I loved watching the Devils boring games. I'm glad you like Torts and his system so much. I like Torts the man. I just find his system boring as heck and it takes the joy out of watching games at times.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by fingerbang View Post
    I don't really care what it looks like, I just want them to win. Getting the puck in deep and grinding away is a recipe for success and I'll take it. Although, we haven't done it well this year.
    If you do not care what it looks like than I'm happy for you. I wish I could say the same. I love the game. I played it for decades. I coached. I reffed. It is just sad to me when I find other teams more fun to watch than the Rangers. That has never been the case before and I have watched a lot of teams and a lot of coaches over the years.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by SLY WILLIAMS View Post
    If you do not care what it looks like than I'm happy for you. I wish I could say the same. I love the game. I played it for decades. I coached. I reffed. It is just sad to me when I find other teams more fun to watch than the Rangers. That has never been the case before and I have watched a lot of teams and a lot of coaches over the years.
    Would you trade a championship caliber team for let's say, last year's lightning? Exciting goals but no playoffs.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by fingerbang View Post
    Would you trade a championship caliber team for let's say, last year's lightning? Exciting goals but no playoffs.
    Not many people on this planet loves the NY Rangers more than I do. That is why I'm so passionate and get a bit riled up never mind disappointed. We have not won a cup with this kind of boring system so it is hard for me to say but it would be sad to me to have to choose between winning a cup by playing a system where the games are boring or not winning a cup. Redwings fans did not have to choose. Penguins fans did not have to choose. Nor did Kings fans. I want to love watching the games again. We did not have to play this system in 1994 and we won the cup. Ironically both Torts and Slats spoke out against boring safe systems in the past.

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