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  1. #106
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    There is literally no way to even approach an argument whose primary thesis is that Randy Moss is the best WR to ever play. I don't even think he was the greatest deep threat of all time, I mean who cares about how good you are at the lowest percentage throw in the game? I mean the success rate of fly patterns without a defensive break down are very very low, and guess who knew that? The 49ers offensive coordinators of Jerry's era. I mean, Jerry could take a 5 yard slant to the house in his prime so why throw low percentage when you don't need to? I mean his nickname was Flash 80 because it was earned. That meant every play Jerry was involved in he was a deep threat, not just the ones where he was streaking down field. People in here make it sound like Randy is his prime is really that much more of a specimen than Jerry in his prime, that leads me to believe that they are either 24 years old or fans of an AFC team. Jerry was a beast.

    Also I can't remember Moss really catching a lot of passes over the middle or even being willing to. I don't remember anyone ever saying Moss was a great route runner or that he was the hardest worker. The final point makes him the antithesis of Rice, who no one worked harder than. That is why Jerry was putting up 1,000 yard seasons at age 40 after tearing up his knee and Moss is putting up 1/3 of that at age 35 with healthy legs.

    WR is literally the only position in the NFL where you cannot have a serious argument about who was the GOAT because that has been permanently and irrefutably settled. Jerry Rice is head and shoulders above everyone.

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandIcedZ View Post
    He could have been.

    But he's not.
    Bingo

  3. #108
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    He could have been if he didnt quit on the Raiders, 2nd term with Vikings and if he stayed with the Patriots.

  4. #109
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    It really just depends on whether or not you rank them based on production or ability. Moss had all the talent in the world but didn't have the attitude or the QBs needed to take over the all-time list. He definitely could have been though.

    As a defender, I would much rather have gone up against Jerry than Randy, but that doesn't really matter in this conversation and neither does my opinion.

  5. #110
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    I think he is.
    Eat Lobster

  6. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by natelpete View Post
    It really just depends on whether or not you rank them based on production or ability. Moss had all the talent in the world but didn't have the attitude or the QBs needed to take over the all-time list. He definitely could have been though.

    As a defender, I would much rather have gone up against Jerry than Randy, but that doesn't really matter in this conversation and neither does my opinion.
    No way would any defender rather line up against Jerry. First of all he could beat you 1,000 different ways where Randy could only beat you on the deep route. Jerry wouldn't go down easily as far as tackles were concerned where Randy would fall on his own to avoid contact. Jerry was also in freakish condition and by the end of the game when you are gassed he still has a full tank.

    Sorry, Jerry was a nightmare to defend, that is why his numbers are what they are. Steve and Joe wouldn't have thrown to him as often if he wasn't routinely open. And to only judge Jerry based on his production is shortsighted, he was the perfect blend of physically gifted, work ethic, and drive.
    Last edited by dulcetpine; 01-30-2013 at 10:21 AM.

  7. #112
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    Not true. Calvin Johnson is even better than Moss.
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justinnum1
    Wade will be a lot better next season now that he got knee surgery. Hate on. - 7/31/2012

  8. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by dulcetpine View Post
    No way would any defender rather line up against Jerry. First of all he could beat you 1,000 different ways where Randy could only beat you on the deep route. Jerry wouldn't go down easily as far as tackles were concerned where Randy would fall on his own to avoid contact. Jerry was also in freakish condition and by the end of the game when you are gassed he still has a full tank.

    Sorry, Jerry was a nightmare to defend, that is why his numbers are what they are. Steve and Joe wouldn't have thrown to him as often if he wasn't routinely open. And to only judge Jerry based on his production is shortsighted, he was the perfect blend of physically gifted, work ethic, and drive.
    I gave my opinion on what I would rather do. You can't speak for every defender and say that because I'm sure some of them would agree with me. I'm not saying Jerry was easier to defend, I'm saying that as far as me not getting embarrassed as a defender, I'd choose to not go against Randy.

  9. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by homestarunner93 View Post
    Calvin Johnson doesn't have near the sample size that Randy Moss has/had. His counting stats don't come close to approaching Moss. Calvin Johnson has the ability and the current production to be qualify as one of the best ever if he continues to play for several more years, but he's not an all-time great right now. He could tear his knee up week 1 next season, never be the same again, and he wouldn't even sniff the HoF. Moss is a bonafide Hall of Famer right now, probably a guy who gets in on the first or second ballot, and Calvin Johnson wouldn't even come close to getting in if his career ended without him putting up any more meaningful numbers. It is absurd to call Johnson better than Moss in an all-time sense right now.
    Obviously Calvin can't compete with Moss's all time stats. That's not what Im arguing. I'm saying that Calvin at the beginning of his prime is better than Randy Moss in his prime, and the record books agree with me. And Calvin will end up with a better career than Moss baring injury, but the Madden curse couldn't even stop Calvin.

    Quote Originally Posted by pedrofan45 View Post
    Calvin Johnson has always been the whole offense. He's the only guy that's an actual threat and they give the ball to him every time. No doubt the guy is an amazing receiver (huge CJ fan) but you can't really define a receiver just by how much he gets the ball.
    You can define a receiver when the other team knows he is the whole offense and they have to put 2-3 guys on him every single play and he still breaks receiving records.

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandIcedZ View Post
    He could have been.

    But he's not.
    This.

    He's second best ever in my eyes and he could have been the best had he had a decent quarterback situation during the end of his reign as a Viking and right through his time with the Raiders.

  11. #116
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    The kids saying CJ is better because he has the record....

    Wait a couple years before you say things
    Gustav Nyquist is Jesus

    didn't even hit the goalie doo



    Ya, we're spoiled.


  12. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by natelpete View Post
    I gave my opinion on what I would rather do. You can't speak for every defender and say that because I'm sure some of them would agree with me. I'm not saying Jerry was easier to defend, I'm saying that as far as me not getting embarrassed as a defender, I'd choose to not go against Randy.
    I appreciate your opinion, I just don't agree with it.

    Speaking of embarrassing a defensive back, let me ask you a question: What do you think the Bengals' DB's would consider is more embarrassing, getting beat on one deep ball or 11 catches for 215 yards 1 TD (Jerry's stats from Super Bowl 23)?

  13. #118
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    Let me put it this way. Jerry Rice had a better career than Moss. That's without question. But if my life were on the line and I had to decide between Rice at his peak and Moss at his peak to be my top WR I'd probably take Moss. Randy Moss at his best is probably the greatest player in NFL history. Problem is we saw his best so rarely. If he had Rice's character, work ethic and longevity (not to mention quarterbacks) he would have shattered every one of Rice's records.
    We're better than you
    And we know it


  14. #119
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    Give me rice in his prime any day. He was more a multi threat than moss which allowed ocs to be more innovative with him. Guy could go over the middle unlike moss and excelled at getting yards after contact. Plus his field vision allowed ocs to call more screen plays to rice, allows them to call more slants to rice. You could call those plays with moss but he was never elite at running those routes. Defenses HAD to account for rice on those routes because he could easily break one tackle and take it the distance. This made him much more of a threat for defenses to defend against and ocs werent limited by anything in terms of what they could call.

    Rice was a far superior downfield blocker and at the Los so tosses, sweeps had a greater chance of success. Rice was the more complete football player which allows the offense to be more of a multi varied threat than moss. Finally, rice wasn't as good as a deep threat as moss, but he could consistently beat Cbs down the field enough so that defenses had to double him even on a simple go route. Take rice in his prime any day over moss.

    Randy moss be more athletic, and was more prone to making big plays but rice made his offense literally impossible to defend.


    This could be seen as a homer post but that's what I believe.
    Last edited by sfbayareafan; 01-30-2013 at 11:23 AM.
    warriors, sharks, 49ers, giants, cal, CU


  15. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by dulcetpine View Post
    I appreciate your opinion, I just don't agree with it.

    Speaking of embarrassing a defensive back, let me ask you a question: What do you think the Bengals' DB's would consider is more embarrassing, getting beat on one deep ball or 11 catches for 215 yards 1 TD (Jerry's stats from Super Bowl 23)?
    Or how about this...Whats more embarrassing: Someone who is just flat out faster than you and runs by you, or someone who is slower than you and runs right by you?
    Quote Originally Posted by heimdog8 View Post
    I didn't want to throw this information out here. I was a 3 year varsity starter at QB in high school. I played quarterback in junior college as well. I was considering playing division 1 football as well but chose to pursue my career in business instead. However, currently I am helping train with Derek Carr from Fresno State get ready for his pro day and the draft. I am also working with Cody Kessler, the USC quarterback.

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