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  1. #1
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    Shumpert or Jimmy Butler?

    If Jimmy eventually starts @ the 2, who would you rather have? Shumpert or Butler?

    (Why compare these two? I consider both with similar games/experience/potential).

  2. #2
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    Jesus Christ, it's not even actually close. Shumpert is God awful offensively. Absolutely God ****ing awful.

    And then. He made them pancakes.

  3. #3
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    Jimmy

    If he was a Knick, they'd dubbed him as the second coming of Michael Jordan.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by BullsFTW View Post
    Jimmy

    If he was a Knick, they'd dubbed him as the second coming of Michael Jordan.
    They do tend to get a tad overzealous with their talent evaluations.

  5. #5
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    I'd take Butler personally. Shumpert is a hell of a defender too tho.

  6. #6
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    i dont get the hype around shumpert(i mean i get knick's fans love,any decent player they draft is said to be an all time great,but why others go along with it)

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by abe_froman View Post
    i dont get the hype around shumpert(i mean i get knick's fans love,any decent player they draft is said to be an all time great,but why others go along with it)
    Because he really is a good perimeter defender (best one they have) and can hit the open shots as well. Hard working too.

  8. #8
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    This is the part of PSD that drives me crazy. People cant talk objectively about other teams players.
    Jimmy Butler is showing great promise, but Iman Shumpert is an incredible young talent as well. Cant just assume he is garbage because you hate the knicks.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BullsFTW View Post
    Jimmy

    If he was a Knick, they'd dubbed him as the second coming of Michael Jordan.
    If he were a Knick, there would be 17 threads in the NBA forum right now

    Jimmy G. Stops

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Moroni View Post
    This is the part of PSD that drives me crazy. People cant talk objectively about other teams players.
    Jimmy Butler is showing great promise, but Iman Shumpert is an incredible young talent as well. Cant just assume he is garbage because you hate the knicks.
    Yes it happens here quite a bit unfortunately whether they want to admit it or not. personally I think shumpert is a good player as i mentioned earlier.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Moroni View Post
    This is the part of PSD that drives me crazy. People cant talk objectively about other teams players.
    Jimmy Butler is showing great promise, but Iman Shumpert is an incredible young talent as well. Cant just assume he is garbage because you hate the knicks.
    not saying he's garbage but he's awful offensively(as of now),whereas butler shows decency on that side of the ball(in the limited time he gets)

  12. #12
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    Way too early to tell. Shumpert has played less than a full NBA season and Butler is just now starting to get heavy minutes. They both have promise and both will get better, but it's way too early to judge them definitively.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Moroni View Post
    Cant just assume he is garbage because you hate the knicks.
    Sure you can!



    Seriously though, I'm not sure I get the point of the comparison considering that to even make this leap, you first have to ask both to play "out of position."

    It reminds me of Zoolander when Fabio wins the "Slashy"; "I'd like to thank the association for pointing out that I'm the best Actor slash Model and not the other way around."

    Last edited by TopsyTurvy; 01-29-2013 at 02:05 PM.

  14. #14
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    Shump vs Butler, Dunk Comp, that should settle this debate.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Moroni View Post
    This is the part of PSD that drives me crazy. People cant talk objectively about other teams players.
    Jimmy Butler is showing great promise, but Iman Shumpert is an incredible young talent as well. Cant just assume he is garbage because you hate the knicks.
    Iman Shumpert IS incredibly talented. That's true. He also may or may not be as good at defense as Jimmy. I don't know, I haven't seen enough of him. But I don't need to see anything from him to know this:

    He has no offensive game. None. That's not ME being unobjective, if you disagree that is your inability to be objective. Let's look at some numbers!

    We all know he's been awful from the field this year, and it's a super small sample size. So I am going to use last years numbers:

    40.2% from the field. That's livable if you do certain things well enough, like get to the line and hit free throws. Well, Shumpert is fine from the line, shoots about 80%. But here's the problem, he has a piss poor free throw rate. Don't confuse "free throw rate" with "free throws per game" last year his free throw rate was .20 (it's .15 this year) that is below average, league average is about .277. (Butler: 40.5/48.8, 77%/86%, .71/.43) All those are his last year/this year numbers for the various things listed. I'm sure you can place them).

    Let's look at how he did from the floor then! I'll use SG league averages for this, because it's obviously very different depending on position.

    At the rim he scores about 61.6% of the time and league average is about 64.3%, so we can call him average. (48.4/73.4)

    From 3-9 feet he shot 22.0% league average is about 38.6% and he just didn't take many there, let's call it Small Sample Size and say he's probably average from there, because let's be honest, it's 3-9 feet and he only took .8 attempts per game. (41.7/15.4 (only .3 attempts per game)

    10-15 feet: 28.1%. That is awful. The league average is 41.6% But hey, we can attribute that to small sample as well, I guess. He didn't take that many. (60%/40%)

    Finally, we have 16-23 feet, Shumpert hit about 36% of the time from that distance, which is just a shade below league average. (35%/38%)

    Now that we've taken a look at that, we can poke at Turnover rate, his is about 16%. League average? 10.1% (11.9/6.8)

    Offensive rebounding rate? 2.8% compared to the league average of 3%. (7.3/7.9)

    So ultimately, Shumpert is, in every aspect of offense, average-ish/slightly below average to bad.

    Literally in every single aspect. And it can all be summed up nicely by the following number:

    .485ts%. That is terrible. The league average is .53. (.526/.580)

    And you really don't want to bring up this year, because he's got a .360.

    So please don't tell me I'm not being objective. Compared to Shumpert, Butler is Michael Jordan offensively.

    Again, this doesn't take away from the fact that Shumpert is RIDICULOUSLY talented. He's a freak of nature athlete. But right now, Jimmy Butler is his superior in every conceivable way offensively and I don't know Shumpert's rate stats defensively, but I know he has a helluva reputation, so I imagine it's at worst pretty close to a wash on that side of the ball.
    Last edited by Doogolas; 01-29-2013 at 02:10 PM.

    And then. He made them pancakes.

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