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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccugrad1 View Post
    I am no political expert, but I will respond:

    The Economy-- Let's be honest, the only real problem with the economy is actual paying jobs. People say, "Oh there are no jobs out there." There are jobs out there, IF you believe that $7.25 or $8.00 per hour is something that you can make a living on. You want to get people back to work; make it worth their while to go back to work with a legitimate wage. Why go back to work for $250 per week (after taxes and what not) when you can stay home, collect unemployment and make more money? I think people are spending; it may not be as much as they used to, but people are spending money. I am a firm believer that in terms of the economy, the one thing that really needs to be done is getting rid of all these "Illegals." Also, someone making $250,000 is NOT Middle Class Barack Obama. I am sorry to tell you. If you are making $250,000 per year, you are living VERY WELL!!!!!!

    Terrorism-- It is one of those things that will NEVER go away. You aren't getting rid of it no matter how hard you try and it is a "war" that the United States is NEVER going to win.

    Foreign Policy-- I think we spend too much money and too much time in foreign places. Democracy is NOT for everyone. If the Middle East wants to blow each other up, let 'em. I don't think we need to be isolated, but in many regards I believed a bunch of what Ron Paul said on this issue.

    Finally, when the American people realize these idiots in Washington don't care about us and only care about spending money at our expense, the better off we will be. You aren't going to change them.
    How much do you think the minimum wage should be????

    Should there be a minimum wage at all????

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmsterNat View Post
    I think the secret here is to make yourself talented enough and educated enough where you do not have to take those jobs.

    There will always be some sort of underclass. Dishes will be washed and hamburgers will be flipped. Just try to make sure you're not the one doing it.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jomota View Post
    I think the secret here is to make yourself talented enough and educated enough where you do not have to take those jobs.

    There will always be some sort of underclass. Dishes will be washed and hamburgers will be flipped. Just try to make sure you're not the one doing it.
    Or you could make sure the people who are doing it can make a living wage. That's also an option.

    There will always be an underclass, but they're no longer known as slaves or serfs. Their lot in life can change and has changed.
    Labgrownmangoat has been feeling stabby as **** lately and is taking a few days off to rest, relax, and recharge. That means drinking, sexual triathlons, and a drug buffet. Oh, and maybe a hike or two on some godforsaken mountain. And forgetting for a while about border ****ery, Russia's ****ery, and the GOP's ****ery, as well as avoiding the cackling whores who will be joyously celebrating the possible gutting of the Affordable Care Act. -- paraphrase of Rude Pundit

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Labgrownmangoat View Post
    Or you could make sure the people who are doing it can make a living wage. That's also an option.

    There will always be an underclass, but they're no longer known as slaves or serfs. Their lot in life can change and has changed.
    Sure but then more of them are unemployed and/or prices are higher on everyone else.
    Last edited by jrice9; 01-29-2013 at 08:11 PM.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrice9 View Post
    Sure but then more of them are unemployed and/or prices are higher on everyone else.
    Ba Da boom, Ba Da Bing!!!!!

  6. #21
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    I agree.

    Deficit - The economy should be the issue now and not the deficit. If you fix the economy it will make it easier to fix the deficit more so than the other way around.... The country isn't gonna crumble anytime soon because of the deficit. But many parts of our country will fall apart if the economy doesn't pick up.

    The War on Terror - I said this all the way back after 9/11. I nearly fell out of my chair when they called it "The War on Terror".... You cannot win a war against an idea. Period. Terrorism isn't a country or a group of people. Terrorism is an idea and there will always be terrorism. When you are fighting an idea you have no military objectives to achieve victory. Its a never ending battle....

    Ultimately terror was thrown in our face by the media so that the government could do things they had been trying to do for a long time anyways. The same thing that they are doing with the school shooting and trying to pass gun legislature that they have wanted all along.... Nearly all legislation passed in this country is done for either financial benefit or further control of citizens. At least IMO.

    Also the notion that instead our country fights the drug cartels is a good one. Except for the fact that our country has no intention of stopping the cartels because they even allow them to run money and drugs into our country.

    Foreign Policy

    Agree completely with the OP. But then again I don't have money invested in the oil companies, stocks in weapons technology companies or own construction companies making billions for rebuilding these countries. Our politicians and their "sponsors" are making money off of us being in the Middle East.

    I do agree that we should be building stronger ties to countries such as Japan and South Korea.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrice9 View Post
    Sure but then more of them are unemployed and/or prices are higher on everyone else.
    Does anyone think we can't pay more for food to help people have a better life. Part of me is on the fence with these ideas because as a nation I think we have squeezed the impoverished too much. We have a shrinking middle class and a poor educational system that puts people in a situation where the deck is stacked against them to a degree that embarrasses me as a citizen.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrice9 View Post
    Sure but then more of them are unemployed and/or prices are higher on everyone else.
    or the CEO can take a pay cut so the workers can pay more without paying that much on to the customers. BUT the market decides wages and salaries...principles and values doesn't. it would be nice if a CEO somewhere gets a conscience one day though.
    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post
    1. Thunder
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    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post

    I already have that scrizzguap on the Dubs winning a 'ship.
    Sincerely,
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    Quote Originally Posted by COOLbeans View Post
    What do you do for a living because I guarantee it's not in academics or psychology?

  9. #24
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    I have to do an individual post for education.

    (1) The quality of teachers today is so much lower than in the past in my opinion. I'm only 29 years old and I just have to laugh from time to time at how dumb some of these younger teachers are at the school. They do little actual teaching.... So many of them just hand out worksheets and then go hangout in the teachers lounge.

    (2) The amount of special education children these days is staggering in comparison to the past. You have so many children with all these various conditions that get different work and just a different education in general.

    (3) The school I went to 13 years ago only had 2 children that had English as a 2nd language. That same school now with nearly the exact same amount of students has over 60 children with English as a 2nd language.

    (4) Less actual teachers..... As mentioned above that same school has nearly 20 more support positions than 13 years ago with the same amount of students. These are support positions not actual teachers.... This middle school has 400-500 students.

    1 Principal
    1 Vice Principal
    1 Assistant Principal (The difference between a Vice and Assistant?)
    3 Office secretaries (Seriously 3?)
    1 Keeper of Records
    1 Therapist
    2 Guidance Counselors (Why 2?)
    2 School Nurses (Why 2?)
    1 Full-time Police Officer
    1 Discipline Teacher
    3 Special Education Teachers
    3 English as 2nd Language Teachers
    4 Janitors (We had 2 when I was in school)
    6 Cafeteria Workers
    6 Assistant teachers
    3 Computer teachers (Didnt have computer class when I was in middle school)
    2 Spanish teachers (Didn't have Spanish in middle school)
    6 Math teachers (2 per grade)
    6 English teachers (2 per grade)
    3 science teachers
    3 social studies teachers
    2 librarians (Why 2?)
    1 Band Instructor
    3 PE teachers
    Then you have all of the coaches for the 12 sports.

    So many of those are completely unnecessary positions.

    (5) Race? Our school has around 30% black students but 0 black teachers something that even the kids bring up.

    (6) No support at home.... The majority of American families are either single-parents or traditional parents that both work. The bottom line is that this means that parents are spending more time at work or doing other things than at home with their children.

    (7) Rewarding and punishing teachers for grades.... They do this in our district. If students have high test scores the teachers get bonus money at the end of the year. If they don't well.... And guess what? The schools in bad areas with low test scores have trouble finding teachers while the ones in better parts of town have a surplus of applicants. There is pretty much no motivation for teachers to work at these troubled schools when they can work at a better school and make more money for actually doing an easier job.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcityroller View Post
    I have to do an individual post for education.

    (1) The quality of teachers today is so much lower than in the past in my opinion. I'm only 29 years old and I just have to laugh from time to time at how dumb some of these younger teachers are at the school. They do little actual teaching.... So many of them just hand out worksheets and then go hangout in the teachers lounge.

    (2) The amount of special education children these days is staggering in comparison to the past. You have so many children with all these various conditions that get different work and just a different education in general.

    (3) The school I went to 13 years ago only had 2 children that had English as a 2nd language. That same school now with nearly the exact same amount of students has over 60 children with English as a 2nd language.

    (4) Less actual teachers..... As mentioned above that same school has nearly 20 more support positions than 13 years ago with the same amount of students. These are support positions not actual teachers.... This middle school has 400-500 students.

    1 Principal
    1 Vice Principal
    1 Assistant Principal (The difference between a Vice and Assistant?)
    3 Office secretaries (Seriously 3?)
    1 Keeper of Records
    1 Therapist
    2 Guidance Counselors (Why 2?)
    2 School Nurses (Why 2?)
    1 Full-time Police Officer
    1 Discipline Teacher
    3 Special Education Teachers
    3 English as 2nd Language Teachers
    4 Janitors (We had 2 when I was in school)
    6 Cafeteria Workers
    6 Assistant teachers
    3 Computer teachers (Didnt have computer class when I was in middle school)
    2 Spanish teachers (Didn't have Spanish in middle school)
    6 Math teachers (2 per grade)
    6 English teachers (2 per grade)
    3 science teachers
    3 social studies teachers
    2 librarians (Why 2?)
    1 Band Instructor
    3 PE teachers
    Then you have all of the coaches for the 12 sports.

    So many of those are completely unnecessary positions.

    (5) Race? Our school has around 30% black students but 0 black teachers something that even the kids bring up.

    (6) No support at home.... The majority of American families are either single-parents or traditional parents that both work. The bottom line is that this means that parents are spending more time at work or doing other things than at home with their children.

    (7) Rewarding and punishing teachers for grades.... They do this in our district. If students have high test scores the teachers get bonus money at the end of the year. If they don't well.... And guess what? The schools in bad areas with low test scores have trouble finding teachers while the ones in better parts of town have a surplus of applicants. There is pretty much no motivation for teachers to work at these troubled schools when they can work at a better school and make more money for actually doing an easier job.
    The problem with teachers and education can be summed up in one word…union.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by FOBolous View Post
    or the CEO can take a pay cut so the workers can pay more without paying that much on to the customers. BUT the market decides wages and salaries...principles and values doesn't. it would be nice if a CEO somewhere gets a conscience one day though.
    I will agree with you that a lot of CEOs could do with a pay cut. However, you're missing the big picture. Most jobs and a lot of unemployment revolves around small business.

    Take a restaurant or a McDonalds or a car wash…places that employ maybe 50 people at unskilled jobs for a minimum wage of $8.00. No one can live on that, so let's raise them up to $15 an hour. What do you think happens. Prices go up and employees get laid off. The "rich fat cat business owner" isn't about to take a pay cut to pay the employees more.

    The "rich fat cat owner" probably isn't all that rich either. On an hourly rate, the owner is the one of the lowest paid people in the business. He puts in 80+ hours a week. The employees have nothing vested in the business. The owner? He has his life's fortune invested in the business.

    If an employee quits for more money, he's looking out for his family. If the owner fires an employee to hire someone for less, he's a cold hearted prick. Then he winds up in court.

    Health care? Congress should check with business owners. They have the secret solved. They never get sick or injured.

    Ask any business owner about employee theft, employees taking days off or coming in late.

    People making minimum wage pretty much deserve it. Make yourself worth more and you will get more. Business owners are more than happy to pay you what you are worth if you can prove your value. You won't get rich delivering pizzas.

    People need to stop looking for someone to take care of them.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by jomota View Post
    I will agree with you that a lot of CEOs could do with a pay cut. However, you're missing the big picture. Most jobs and a lot of unemployment revolves around small business.

    Take a restaurant or a McDonalds or a car wash…places that employ maybe 50 people at unskilled jobs for a minimum wage of $8.00. No one can live on that, so let's raise them up to $15 an hour. What do you think happens. Prices go up and employees get laid off. The "rich fat cat business owner" isn't about to take a pay cut to pay the employees more.

    The "rich fat cat owner" probably isn't all that rich either. On an hourly rate, the owner is the one of the lowest paid people in the business. He puts in 80+ hours a week. The employees have nothing vested in the business. The owner? He has his life's fortune invested in the business.

    If an employee quits for more money, he's looking out for his family. If the owner fires an employee to hire someone for less, he's a cold hearted prick. Then he winds up in court.

    Health care? Congress should check with business owners. They have the secret solved. They never get sick or injured.

    Ask any business owner about employee theft, employees taking days off or coming in late.

    People making minimum wage pretty much deserve it. Make yourself worth more and you will get more. Business owners are more than happy to pay you what you are worth if you can prove your value. You won't get rich delivering pizzas.

    People need to stop looking for someone to take care of them.
    If I personally heard somebody say that to another person I'd slap the **** out of them. No lie.

    Somebody HAS to make minimum wage. In order for anybody to be wealthy a great number of people have to be poor. That is economics.

    My girlfriend had to work 2 minimum wage jobs for nearly 4 years instead of going to college when she had scholarships. Her parents are both in jail and when she turned 18 she had custody of her 7-year old sister because she has no immediate family and they were gonna put her in a group home.

    I guess she DESERVED to have to work 2 minimum wage jobs for not having anybody to help her do the right thing and single-handedly raise her 7-year old sister.

    So yeah those young people that don't have anywhere to go or anybody to help them out deserve minimum wage for not being able to jump into $100,000 a year jobs right out of high school.....

    28% of Americans are making poverty level wages. That means that over 1/4 of the jobs in this country are paying poverty level wages. But hey those 28% of Americans "deserve" to struggle from paycheck to paycheck right? You make sound as if there are millions of high paying jobs out there vacant for these people to be able to move into....

    At our point of highest unemployment we had lost over 7 million jobs in the recession. Over 60% of those jobs were what are deemed "middle class" jobs making between $40,000-60,000 a year. The jobs that have been created since that point 58% are "lower class" jobs. The jobs that are out there being created are mostly minimum wage and poverty level jobs.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-u-s-recovery/

    http://thinkprogress.org/economy/201...obs/?mobile=nc

    If you are in college right now, you will most likely either be unemployed or working a job that only requires a high school degree when you graduate. The truth is that the U.S. economy is not coming anywhere close to producing enough jobs for the hordes of new college graduates that are entering the workforce every year. In 2011, 53 percent of all Americans with a bachelor's degree under the age of 25 were either unemployed or underemployed. Millions upon millions of young college graduates feel like the system has totally failed them. They worked hard in school all their lives, they went into huge amounts of debt in order to get the college education that they were told they "must have" in order to get a good job, but after graduation they found that there were only a handful of good jobs for the huge waves of college graduates that were entering the "real world". All over America, college graduates can be found waiting tables, flipping burgers and working behind the register at retail stores. Unfortunately, the employment picture in America is not going to get significantly better any time soon.

    All over the United States, "middle class jobs" are being replaced by "low income jobs" and young college graduates are being hurt by this transition more than almost anyone else. Massive numbers of young college graduates are now working jobs that do not even require a high school degree. Some of the statistics about young college graduates are absolutely astounding.
    http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/a...-underemployed

  13. #28
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    Congrats on being someone that doesn't look at his food recipts

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerlive View Post
    Does anyone think we can't pay more for food to help people have a better life. Part of me is on the fence with these ideas because as a nation I think we have squeezed the impoverished too much. We have a shrinking middle class and a poor educational system that puts people in a situation where the deck is stacked against them to a degree that embarrasses me as a citizen.
    Well that worst agruement I've ever heard. You pay more. I give more then i feel my logic tells me i should, I'm not getting your 6 dollar a gallon of milk bandwagon though.
    Last edited by ewing; 01-30-2013 at 01:35 AM.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcityroller View Post
    If I personally heard somebody say that to another person I'd slap the **** out of them. No lie.

    Somebody HAS to make minimum wage. In order for anybody to be wealthy a great number of people have to be poor. That is economics.

    My girlfriend had to work 2 minimum wage jobs for nearly 4 years instead of going to college when she had scholarships. Her parents are both in jail and when she turned 18 she had custody of her 7-year old sister because she has no immediate family and they were gonna put her in a group home.

    I guess she DESERVED to have to work 2 minimum wage jobs for not having anybody to help her do the right thing and single-handedly raise her 7-year old sister.

    So yeah those young people that don't have anywhere to go or anybody to help them out deserve minimum wage for not being able to jump into $100,000 a year jobs right out of high school.....

    28% of Americans are making poverty level wages. That means that over 1/4 of the jobs in this country are paying poverty level wages. But hey those 28% of Americans "deserve" to struggle from paycheck to paycheck right? You make sound as if there are millions of high paying jobs out there vacant for these people to be able to move into....

    At our point of highest unemployment we had lost over 7 million jobs in the recession. Over 60% of those jobs were what are deemed "middle class" jobs making between $40,000-60,000 a year. The jobs that have been created since that point 58% are "lower class" jobs. The jobs that are out there being created are mostly minimum wage and poverty level jobs.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-u-s-recovery/

    http://thinkprogress.org/economy/201...obs/?mobile=nc



    http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/a...-underemployed
    Sounds like your friend was let down by her loser parents and not necessarily by the system. She got dealt a bad hand and that happens sometimes.

    What ever her minimum wage jobs are, if she is a good employee she will move above that. Burger flippers have shift supervisors that have restaurant managers. The cream rises to the top. There is no financial incentive for a business owner to keep a good employee down. Nor does a business owner want to hire supervisory personnel from the outside. He would rather promote what he knows. If the employee has a value, they will move up. It may take some time, but it will happen.

    When Walt Disney World opened the Animal Kingdom some years ago the papers featured an article relating how the park's general manager started out as a tram attendant. They also had a hotel GM that began as a front desk clerk. Extreme example? Sure. But business and industry has many similar stories like this.

    As for all those mid level jobs that no one can fine…they moved overseas thanks to greedy unions, not greedy CEOs. Maybe you should be looking at the party that the unions so strongly support.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerlive View Post
    Does anyone think we can't pay more for food to help people have a better life. Part of me is on the fence with these ideas because as a nation I think we have squeezed the impoverished too much. We have a shrinking middle class and a poor educational system that puts people in a situation where the deck is stacked against them to a degree that embarrasses me as a citizen.
    I was standing in line at a Wendy's a few weeks ago and saw a woman under thirty with three kids pay for four lunches (including ice cream) with an EBT card. She wasn't embarrassed, why should you be????

    You see similar scenes in the supermarket. Food is paid for with EBT cards, then the cash they saved is used for the second ring out for the Fritos, Heinnekins and SnoBalls. They're no embarrassed, why should you be????

    And, please, don't let your response be that this doesn't happen.

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