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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    ? Stallworth is done
    I wouldn't mind him at league min.

    What do you think of the Pats drafting a WR?

    Thanks for the Memories Suarez!


  2. #17
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    Keep for the Right Price :

    Julian Edelman

    Aqib Talib
    If price is right.. He actually gets hurt A LOT. My best friend is a hardcore Bucs fan and literally told me as soon as we signed him that when you need him, he won't be there.

    Wes Welker
    Prefer keep but dont really care at this point. Yes, still bitter

    Trevor Scott
    Good depth, but at the right price

    Danny Woodhead
    But I have a feeling he is gone

    Dane Fletcher
    Plays very well when healthy

    Donte Stallworth

    Keep at All Costs :

    Sebastian Vollmer

    Michael Hoomanawanui
    Actually played pretty decent and we need a backup TE who knows the offense


    Let Go to Free Agency :

    Ron Brace
    Deion Branch
    Patrick Chung
    Marquice Cole
    Niko Koutouvides
    Derrick Martin
    Nick McDonald
    Tracy White
    Will Allen
    James Richard
    Jake Ballard
    Myron Pryor


    Let Go to Hell :

    Kyle ****ing Arrington
    Last edited by RateSports; 01-21-2013 at 09:11 PM.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnick5757 View Post
    I wouldn't mind him at league min.

    What do you think of the Pats drafting a WR?
    Yeah, but either way he's probably just camp fodder if he's brought back.

    If we draft a receiver high, then it's definitely time to pack Welker's bags. The problem with expecting a rookie WR to come in and perform in this offense is that the route tree is much more complex than most teams. Even a veteran like Ocho couldn't ever figure it out, so if we draft a receiver high then he needs to be a tremendous fit. I'm not saying it is impossible, it just has to be the right fit.
    Patriots Forum Hall of Fame Class of 2011


  4. #19
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    Brady is becoming too comfortable out on the football field. With Welker and Aaron running crossing routes below, he's usually solid in finding an 8 yard completion without too much challenge.

    Remember when his targets were Deion, Troy, and Givens? Brady was more aware as a QB pre-2007, and that's why his 2007 season was one of the greatest. He wasn't just dumping off passes then (before the playoffs), he had to work at it. Now, it's not too hard to find a guy open. But when you play a defense like the Giants or Ravens, and you are used to playing nonchalantly, it won't go well for you.

    I know it sounds weird, but because Welker is so good as Brady's go-to man, he needs to go. We need Brady to be less reliant on Welker. Because anyone who has watched a Patriots game will know on fourth and not one, Brady is looking for Welker and really only Welker. He needs to be more aggressive.

    If we want a tall stretch the field type guy this year, it's Justin Hunter. I'd prefer next year and go for Brandon Coleman, who's taller and faster.


    We need Brady to be back on his game

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by se247042 View Post
    Brady is becoming too comfortable out on the football field. With Welker and Aaron running crossing routes below, he's usually solid in finding an 8 yard completion without too much challenge.

    Remember when his targets were Deion, Troy, and Givens? Brady was more aware as a QB pre-2007, and that's why his 2007 season was one of the greatest. He wasn't just dumping off passes then (before the playoffs), he had to work at it. Now, it's not too hard to find a guy open. But when you play a defense like the Giants or Ravens, and you are used to playing nonchalantly, it won't go well for you.

    I know it sounds weird, but because Welker is so good as Brady's go-to man, he needs to go. We need Brady to be less reliant on Welker. Because anyone who has watched a Patriots game will know on fourth and not one, Brady is looking for Welker and really only Welker. He needs to be more aggressive.

    If we want a tall stretch the field type guy this year, it's Justin Hunter. I'd prefer next year and go for Brandon Coleman, who's taller and faster.


    We need Brady to be back on his game
    I'm not sure Brady can even throw the deep ball well anymore. Including DPI calls, he was only successful on 35% of his throws that went over 15 yards in the air this year - that's worse than all but two QBs, Big Ben and Weeden.

    Thanks for the Memories Suarez!


  6. #21
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    When was the last time Brady threw a deep ball, and underthrew it? Probably last years Super Bowl. Tom's overthrowing these passes, and it's because he's throwing it to 5'10"-6'1" guys. Throw it to 6'4" Hunter, and that's not being overthrown

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by se247042 View Post
    When was the last time Brady threw a deep ball, and underthrew it? Probably last years Super Bowl. Tom's overthrowing these passes, and it's because he's throwing it to 5'10"-6'1" guys. Throw it to 6'4" Hunter, and that's not being overthrown
    This is very accurate. Brady can throw the deep ball but you can't throw it to guys who are too short. Always taught that if the receiver is too short, its best to just throw it where they can run under it or have it overthrown.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by se247042 View Post
    When was the last time Brady threw a deep ball, and underthrew it? Probably last years Super Bowl. Tom's overthrowing these passes, and it's because he's throwing it to 5'10"-6'1" guys. Throw it to 6'4" Hunter, and that's not being overthrown
    It's not just that, we have no, and I mean none, receivers that are fast. Gronk, Hernandez, Welker, Lloyd, Branch, Edelman are all over 4.52 in the 40. For the TEs its not really a problem, but they are big, play inside more etc ., except for the fact that we try to play Hernandez at WR, and which he can't really do as a true outside player. But I would venture a guess that we have the slowest WR core in the NFL. Not one sub 4.5 guy.... And no receiver over 6ft. It's different when you you got a guy who runs 4.5 and is 6'4" but these little slow guy pose no fear into defenses. Opposing defenses basically collapse the middle and short part of the field, and especially in red zone and that makes it tough.... Obviously we are a good offense but still lack speed and when one part of the offense is missing I. E. I Gronk, it makes things a whole lot easier on the defense.... I agree Brady seems a little to set in his reads like he is trying to play all of the game pre snap and then lock in on the guy who he thinks will be open... Idk its hard to criticize the number 4 offense of all time but it does seem to be that the elite defense have shut us down in playoffs recently.... I'd like to see us try to get a couple of at least decent down the field receivers doesn't have to be a guy like green or Johnson, and but someone like a Manningham, or Greg Jennings who at least has the ability to beat a guy one on one deep down the field.

  9. #24
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    Keep at all costs:
    Sebastian Vollmer

    Keep if price is right:
    Aqib Talib
    Wes Welker
    Danny Woodhead
    Julian Edelman
    Dane Fletcher
    Jake Ballard
    Michael Hoomanawanui

    Probably gone:
    Kyle Arrington
    Ron Brace
    Deion Branch
    Patrick Chung
    Marquice Cole
    Niko Koutouvides
    Donte Stallworth

    Gone:
    James Develin
    Marcus Harrison
    Derrick Martin
    Nick McDonald
    Trevor Scott
    Donald Thomas
    Tracy White
    Will Allen
    James Richard
    Myron Pryor

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    100% Chung will be gone


    Its funny we have the same view on this guy! ( if I remember correctly) We both were very high on him then the injuries and crap coverage play he slowly moved down the list now we want the axe. At first I was nervous with a no Chung secondary but to be quite honest I didn't even realize he was even gone so bye bye Pat


    Welker at the right price.... ya he is amazing but is getting old and injury prone
    Talib for sure..... D played so much better with him and winning does a lot to an attitude
    SEABASS for the right price.... Great player when healthy but needs to be healthy
    Quote Originally Posted by Bullseyed View Post
    I kind of agree with this, but then we'd end up will BB in a helicopter trying to fly over random football fields all over the country.
    Big Brother is watching

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by RateSports View Post
    This is very accurate. Brady can throw the deep ball but you can't throw it to guys who are too short. Always taught that if the receiver is too short, its best to just throw it where they can run under it or have it overthrown.
    Sorry this is bull, as is the post prior to it. Brady can huck the ball 65 yards I'm sure, but he's not accurate anymore, so it's stupid to pursue a deep WR when we can't use him unless you want Brady's pick count to go over 20 - and I don't.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Sorry this is bull, as is the post prior to it. Brady can huck the ball 65 yards I'm sure, but he's not accurate anymore, so it's stupid to pursue a deep WR when we can't use him unless you want Brady's pick count to go over 20 - and I don't.
    Clearly his deep ball has declined but c'mon man.

    Brady's best deep ball targets this season were Lloyd and Hernandez or Gronk (hardly even had both at once). The big play though the air was not good (apparently terrible) this year because of the WR's not so much because of the QB.

    When you have Gronk and AH on the field together they make each other (and the other receivers) better deep-intermediate threats. It would also be stupid for Brady to force it down field when that is clearly not the strengths of his WRs and nothing is opening up due to Gronk/AH injuries.

    And while we are on the topic of WR: IMO if we pay more than 6m a season for Welker we are grossly overpaying him.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot Pride View Post
    Clearly his deep ball has declined but c'mon man.

    Brady's best deep ball targets this season were Lloyd and Hernandez or Gronk (hardly even had both at once). The big play though the air was not good (apparently terrible) this year because of the WR's not so much because of the QB.

    When you have Gronk and AH on the field together they make each other (and the other receivers) better deep-intermediate threats. It would also be stupid for Brady to force it down field when that is clearly not the strengths of his WRs and nothing is opening up due to Gronk/AH injuries.

    And while we are on the topic of WR: IMO if we pay more than 6m a season for Welker we are grossly overpaying him.
    Agree, I love wes, but for what he does, compared to the skill sets of guys like Gronk, Hernandez and Edelman (assume resign), he's not worth big money.... If we're gonna spend, I'd pay Greg Jennings and let Welker walk, and use the franchise tag on Talib.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot Pride View Post
    Clearly his deep ball has declined but c'mon man.

    Brady's best deep ball targets this season were Lloyd and Hernandez or Gronk (hardly even had both at once). The big play though the air was not good (apparently terrible) this year because of the WR's not so much because of the QB.

    When you have Gronk and AH on the field together they make each other (and the other receivers) better deep-intermediate threats. It would also be stupid for Brady to force it down field when that is clearly not the strengths of his WRs and nothing is opening up due to Gronk/AH injuries.

    And while we are on the topic of WR: IMO if we pay more than 6m a season for Welker we are grossly overpaying him.
    Sorry, but what Brady had available for deep throws - 15 yards+ down field (15 is deep? barely qualifies until you get to 25 and more) was above average, and his results were far below average. Looks a lot more like the QB to me. The only WR Brady has ever been very successful with downfield was Moss - and Moss talent wise is the greatest deep ball WR of all time. How do we know Brady was on target to him? Moss was able to correct his routes better than anyone I've seen in 46 years as a fan to get under the ball.

    Brady is 2nd all time in Int%. If Gronk and AH were healthy this year all year, we would have shattered the 2007 teams all time scoring record. Why does anybody with an ounce of sense want Brady to throw long, when he is doing fine at what he does, and the evidence since 2010 indicates he isn't good at it anyway?


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by holywack17 View Post
    use the franchise tag on Talib.
    Pay Talib the average of the top 5 CB's in the NFL (~$10M) for a guy with injury and behavior problems? Man, I'm glad you are not the GM.

    We gave Bodden $24M for 4 years with $14M upfront. $3.5M guaranteed and $6M total is plenty enough for Talib. If we want to take a shot long term. Or we could go for $7.5M for one year.
    Last edited by bagwell368; 01-23-2013 at 08:45 AM.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

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