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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnick5757 View Post
    doesn't mean the pats should cut him, just that he shouldn't play on clear passing downs.

    He is also very cheap, makes under 1 mil.
    We're not cutting him, we're trying to trade him because his deal ends after this 2013-14 season, and he's the most expendable of the LBs

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    Talib and Vollmer need to be resigned/tagged/whatever. Welker's time is up. He just doesn't have the hands you need at WR to be paid top dollar. If he can't use his body to catch it, he probably won't.
    Sure welkers hands have slipped since he first got here (and his drops have been a disturbing this past year) , but this is too far IMO. Hes still one of the best slot guys in the league and makes a lot of tough catches in the slot others cant. That being said, I agree they shouldnt pay him top dollar. Both Talib and Vollmer are more essential for the long term framework of this team. Hope edelman gets more slot work next year and we add another outside receiver who draws some more attention.

    On another note, while I see the secondary as a definite need even assuming Talib is resigned, I think we also require another pass rusher. This is Another position I would consider tolling the 1st rounder this year for a potentially higher 1st the next year, although that comes with a grain of salt as I havent looked over next years class for likely prospects and its too far out anyway. A lot of guys in those spots have been able to step onto the field and produce sacks like crazy, although I think we all expect a boost from a healthy chandler jones next year. D still needs a lot of work, we seem to be saying this every year....

  3. #63
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    The pass rush is a problem, but it's not being addressed by some of you posters here.


    We need interior pass rush, not edge rushing. Ninkovich and Jones are much better than the previous's version of Anderson and Carter, but our interior pass rush regressed, mostly because Love regressed.


    A guy like Jesse Williams, or if we do happen to trade up to #6, and go after Lotulelei or Hankins; THAT'S what we need. We need a body next to Vince, and then we will be much better

  4. #64
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    setting welker's value is going to be tough for both the pats and welker because there are going to be a few teams that over value him greatly and what do you do then?i agree that there needs to be a pass rush improvement and looking for it through the draft could be wishful thinking.eve that being said i still wanna see welker,talib and vollmer signed.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by se247042 View Post
    The pass rush is a problem, but it's not being addressed by some of you posters here.


    We need interior pass rush, not edge rushing. Ninkovich and Jones are much better than the previous's version of Anderson and Carter, but our interior pass rush regressed, mostly because Love regressed.


    A guy like Jesse Williams, or if we do happen to trade up to #6, and go after Lotulelei or Hankins; THAT'S what we need. We need a body next to Vince, and then we will be much better

    This. Wilfork is pushing the pile all game long, basically by himself, while also trying to handle the runs up the middle. He's getting to be older, so it's not that easy. Shouldn't be one guys job anyway. Jones/Ninkovitch/Cunningham/Scott could be more than enough, if the pocket were actually pressed.

    Flaaco had perfect horseshoes to move around in most of that game. Can't blame this on DE's. The DT's have to push the Center's/Guards towards the QB for any pass-rush to be consistent.

    Jesse Williams should be our #1 pick.

    Anyone like the idea of bringing back Richard Seymour? 33 years old, but I think he can support Wilfork's efforts, and step in as a 3-4 DT on 3rd and long, as well as a 4-3 DT while we groom a high prospect like a Jesse Williams.

  6. #66
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    Can't sign Seymour without trading Spikes and getting a cover LB. Richard is too old to play on most downs, but would get too many snaps in practice to get in a sub.


    Its extremely doubtful, especially since he hates us now

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by se247042 View Post
    The pass rush is a problem, but it's not being addressed by some of you posters here.


    We need interior pass rush, not edge rushing. Ninkovich and Jones are much better than the previous's version of Anderson and Carter, but our interior pass rush regressed, mostly because Love regressed.


    A guy like Jesse Williams, or if we do happen to trade up to #6, and go after Lotulelei or Hankins; THAT'S what we need. We need a body next to Vince, and then we will be much better
    We need better pass rushing inside and off the edge. I don't think we need a 3 down player at DE, but I think they do need to look for a guy with some explosiveness off the edge to add depth behind Jones/Ninko. Francis did come on at the end of the season, but he isn't a speed guy. A guy who can play 50-60% of the snaps and put up close to 10 sacks would really help, even if that's the only value he brought. That's fine as long as Jones and Ninko stay healthy. However, if they fight injuries like this year, we're in trouble again. It would be nice to have a guy that not only compliments them when they're healthy, but provides insurance that we can get some pressure even without them.

    Losing Mark Anderson was a big subtraction from last year's team that I don't think got talked about enough. Not saying we should have paid him what BUF did (not saying it was too unreasonable either) but just his absence as a player really hurt. Would have loved to see this team if they could have managed to work something out with him. I think it would have made a bigger difference than people think because he wasn't a big name or a complete player. His niche was something we lacked though.
    Last edited by hugepatsfan; 01-22-2013 at 02:22 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    What I feel right now is like the satisfaction you feel when a highly judgmental, moralistic televangelist gets caught screwing a male hooker.
    NE Patriots Forum HOF (Class of 2011)

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  8. #68
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    I've been thinking a lot about Spikes and his future here. I love him as a run stuffer and an emotional presence on the field. I think when he's on the field other guys play more aggressive and better. But he's just so bad in coverage and in open space with shifty guys. It's a real liability for teams with backs that can catch the ball in the flat. They just outrun him to the sideline and he can't get the angle. He's amongst the best I've seen at LB between the tackles at or behind the LOS.

    The easy answer is to use him only in base, but that brings up the question of his contract. Sub defense is more important that base defense today because teams simply play it more. The nickel D is your foundation in the NFL now. So if Spikes only plays in the base package, how can you justify paying him too much money? I really like him and would love to see him here long term, but I just think his career started about a decade too late for him.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    What I feel right now is like the satisfaction you feel when a highly judgmental, moralistic televangelist gets caught screwing a male hooker.
    NE Patriots Forum HOF (Class of 2011)

    Trill Team

  9. #69
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    The pass rush as we saw improved this year with the addition of Chandler Jones but they still lack consistent push and physicality on the D-Line. Wilfork and Jones are solid but they need another guy that can get after the QB consistently plain and simple. This will aid the secondary play greatly.

    The secondary as we saw improved with the addition of Talib, now the question becomes will Belichik bring him back? Does he want to come back? If so that is great because I think we saw glimpses of what this defense can be with Talib on one corner and Dennard on the other. This will allow McCourty to stay at safety and prepare all training camp to play the position. I am still not a fan of Gregory nor Chung and feel they need a veteran presence back there A LA an Ed Reed. Also Kyle Arrington should never again play anywhere but slot receivers. He showed us again Sunday why he is not a #1 or #2 corner when Talib went down.

    I have no beef with the linebackers. Ninkovich, Spikes, Mayo and Hightower are all very good at their respective positions, but let's be honest none of them are spectacular in coverage. I think adding a 3rd down backer who has proven he can play coverage would be a great deal of help.

    Ok offensively. We all know Brady is going to be one of the best QBs to ever play the game, but this team relies on him to dig them out of any hole it digs itself. The Ravens punched the Pats in the mouth and instead of sticking to game plan and pounding the rock in the hurry up they had Brady drop back 52 times. Now don't get me wrong the guy is phenomenal but the running game had been doing quite well and could have helped give the Pats defense a rest in the 2nd half.

    Running back is secure for the forseeable future with Ridley, Vereen and Woodhead in the mix.

    Tight End is also all set with Gronk, Hernandez, Ballard and whatever guy they end up pulling off the street.

    Offensive line I believe Vollmer contract is up and he must be resigned even with his injury history. Incentive deal based on games played I bet.

    Last is the Wide Receiving corps. Lloyd although didn't put up numbers expected of him, but was solid and took some pressure off the middle of the field. Welker is one of the best receivers in the game and I have tossed the idea of both resigning him and letting him go around in my mind a lot lately. Regardless of what they do they need a WR outside the numbers that can go deep. After Lloyd and Welker the next guy up was Deion Branch...no thanks. I am not saying go out and get Larry Fitz, although I would be ecstatic if they did, but they preach depth and they had none at this position last year.

    Finally kick return. Can we finally get a guy that can return a kick past the 20? Imagine this offense if they didn't start nearly every one of their drives inside their own 20? Good lord.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banner18forRed View Post
    Finally kick return. Can we finally get a guy that can return a kick past the 20? Imagine this offense if they didn't start nearly every one of their drives inside their own 20? Good lord.
    Take a look at our RB on IR.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  11. #71
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    I'd really like to see us let Welker walk and go after Greg Jennings.... Seems like a Pats type of receiver, and would definitely be a help on the outside.

  12. #72
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    Sign Talib unless he wants outrageous money.
    Franchise Welker, if not sign Amendola or Davone Bess
    Sign Edelman
    Sign Vollmer
    Draft Matt Elam S out of Florida. Pair him gregory and mccourty at safety positions with Dennard, Dowling(barring health), Talib. Depth players

  13. #73
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    -Talib is going to demand a large contract. He is a big, physical corner that is 27 years old. He is looking to get paid plain and simple. Teams will pay him too as they saw what a difference he made in the Pats secondary. Last year corners like Brandon Carr were getting 5 yrs/ 50mill. Now Talib has a little more baggage but I think you can expect to see a similar deal offered his way. Let's see how much he really did like being a Patriot then.

    -Welker is still going to be looking for 3 yrs and 20+million in guaranteed money. Last year the Pats were offering about 16 mill guaranteed and I don't see that number changing. Either Welker signs the deal the Patriots want or he is likely to be franchised or let go. I also wouldn't mind an Amendola signing but the guy can't stay healthy and come to think of it none of the slot receivers in the NFL have stayed as healthy as Welker over the past few years. Minus the ACL in 2009.

    -Edelman is a jack of all trades and should be resigned. Guy returns punts, is a pretty good slot receiver, and hell he will play defense if you ask him. He has that "X" factor that can swing a game your way on one play.

    -Vollmer has proven when healthy he is a solid tackle. Protecting Brady these next 3-4 years is #1 priority for this team.

    -They need some help in the draft at a few different positions. The mention of Elam is a good one. Safety is definitely a concern. Chung stinks plain and simple. Gregory is average at best. You stick another solid safety back there with McCourty I think thats a good base. They also absolutely need a cover linebacker. Spikes, Mayo, Hightower, and Ninkovich are great but they just don't play the pass very well. If we were able to add a linebacker that can come in on 3rd down and stick to a tight end or running back it would be huge. Also need another defensive tackle. Wilfork and Love are fine but after that there isn't much. You saw when Love went down against the Ravens the drop off that occurred.

    -The offense should be dealt with via free agency or trade. And the only thing I see it needing is a TRUE outside the numbers threat that can stretch the field. I actually really like Lloyd but he is not the deep threat we thought he was. He is an athletic, good route running, possession receiver.

  14. #74
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    What do you guys think of Darrelle Revis? He's always gave us a hard time so why not bring him in for a workout? Couldn't hurt.
    20+ years from now I and others will look back @WMXXX and say remember when Brock Beat The Undertaker? More people will remember his only loss more than those 21 Straight wins.

  15. #75
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    If he was willing to come here, I'd sign him in a heartbeat. Obviously we'd never be able to sign him and keep Talib, but I'd be perfectly fine letting Talib go for Revis. Other matter would be what the Jet's would want for compensation. Either way it would be VERY expensive and highly unlikely.

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