2013 Free Agency and Trade Thread (News, Articles, Ideas etc)(6)

[KW93KB24]

Wait isn't brian hartline looking for 7 million a year? You guys are fine with giving brian hartine 7 freaking million dollars a year, but not ok with giving mike wallace 9-10 mill a year? Lol.

[100%CHEESE FREE]

Victor Cruz - WR - Giants

Giants co-owner John Mara said "right now" impending restricted free agent Victor Cruz is asking for too much money.
Mara added "there's a limit," and said "that's his agent" asking for too much money "right now," which is standard in negotiations at this point. Mara also said Cruz is a priority, but he isn't the "only" priority. He would have no qualms with slapping a first-round tender on Cruz, which would be a bargain at $2.879 million. Cruz played for $540,000 in 2012.

rotoworld

I don't see a way to realistically get Cruz on our team, however Restricted Free Agency might be how the Giants set the market for him if he's unwilling to sign an extension. The Giants would have right of first refusal here but sort of makes you wonder though if a team with lots of cap room like the Dolphins could make a power play for him.

The only reason I'm posting this though is you have to think, who wouldn't give up a 1st round pick for Victor Cruz, especially if we're probably drafting a WR anyways. It won't happen though.

[Daniel0227]

Wait isn't brian hartline looking for 7 million a year? You guys are fine with giving brian hartine 7 freaking million dollars a year, but not ok with giving mike wallace 9-10 mill a year? Lol.

^That!
Ya, no Greg Camario please. Hartline does not fit unless...No. Just don't fit. Wallace on the other hand does. Fast kid with alot more growth.

Look at this and tell me you would not want this kind of guy outside.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...,d.b2I&cad=rja

"Worth every penny" people will say.

[Daniel0227]

Wait isn't brian hartline looking for 7 million a year? You guys are fine with giving brian hartine 7 freaking million dollars a year, but not ok with giving mike wallace 9-10 mill a year? Lol.

^That!
Ya, no Greg Camario please. Hartline does not fit unless...No. Just don't fit. Wallace on the other hand does. Fast kid with alot more growth.

Look at this and tell me you would not want this kind of guy outside.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...,d.b2I&cad=rja

[100%CHEESE FREE]

Wait isn't brian hartline looking for 7 million a year? You guys are fine with giving brian hartine 7 freaking million dollars a year, but not ok with giving mike wallace 9-10 mill a year? Lol.

Hartline has supposed said $5-6 mil per year which is a little high. Wallace's deal is going to go north of $10 mil if we want to beat the competition we'll face to land him.

These guys aren't the same kind of WR and won't fill the same role on our team, however the argument can be made that a guy like Hartline is a better fit for our offense. He could be that faster Michael Jenkins that will let us get out into the intermediate game more. We're not going to have some high scoring death from above offense, however if we had WRs who were better we can easily take some of those short "within 10 yards" pass plays and make them into within 20 or 30 yards. There are a few questions about his performance but $4.5-5 million would be ideal for Harline, I would have a hard time paying more though.

Again thinking we can get some fast guy to bust open our pass game with the help of a low % vertical pass game does not at all fit the QB that we have. I really doubt we'll see Wallace here, if we do he won't be putting up the same #s he did in Pittsburgh, that simple really.

[ApolloInfinity]

Hartline has had 1 year of solid play, that's it. He is a big risk.

[KW93KB24]

brian hartline is not worth 4 million IMO. and WE DID NOT DRAFT PONDER SO WE CAN THROW 10 YD PASSES ALL THE TIME. wtf?

[KW93KB24]

Crazy how you guys think wallace is just some fast guy lol. He does everything, deep, slants, end arounds, and screens. But noooo let's take a chance on brian hartline for 6 million a year!!

[KW93KB24]

Hartline has supposed said $5-6 mil per year which is a little high. Wallace's deal is going to go north of $10 mil if we want to beat the competition we'll face to land him.

These guys aren't the same kind of WR and won't fill the same role on our team, however the argument can be made that a guy like Hartline is a better fit for our offense. He could be that faster Michael Jenkins that will let us get out into the intermediate game more. We're not going to have some high scoring death from above offense, however if we had WRs who were better we can easily take some of those short "within 10 yards" pass plays and make them into within 20 or 30 yards. There are a few questions about his performance but $4.5-5 million would be ideal for Harline, I would have a hard time paying more though.

Again thinking we can get some fast guy to bust open our pass game with the help of a low % vertical pass game does not at all fit the QB that we have. I really doubt we'll see Wallace here, if we do he won't be putting up the same #s he did in Pittsburgh, that simple really.

Listen, why do you keep saying we have a low % vertical passing game? did it occur to you that we didnt have the receivers to do it? Yeah bill musgrave didnt call any deep plays, but it's because WE DONT HAVE THE RECEIVERS TO DO IT. Is that really hard to understand for some of you guys? theres a reason why we threw short/intermediate passes, and no it's not because ponder cant throw deep. We simply didnt have the receivers!!!


And for the bolded part, do you think ponder absolutely cant throw an accurate 50 yd bomb? If he cant then we need a new qb.

[pacofunk64]

I'm not paying Mike Wallace $10-$12 million a year and that's final, lol. We just can't do that and expect to sign Percy to an extension. Ok if we trade Percy for some stupid reason then ya let's bring in Wallace.

[VCU4LIFEGOVIKS]

I would still rather have Bowe if we are going to sign a big name free agent WR. Which for the record I dont see us doing.

[vikingsfan0845]

I would still rather have Bowe if we are going to sign a big name free agent WR. Which for the record I dont see us doing.

Agreed.

[100%CHEESE FREE]

Listen, why do you keep saying we have a low % vertical passing game? did it occur to you that we didnt have the receivers to do it? Yeah bill musgrave didnt call any deep plays, but it's because WE DONT HAVE THE RECEIVERS TO DO IT. Is that really hard to understand for some of you guys? theres a reason why we threw short/intermediate passes, and no it's not because ponder cant throw deep. We simply didnt have the receivers!!!


And for the bolded part, do you think ponder absolutely cant throw an accurate 50 yd bomb? If he cant then we need a new qb.

Man, do you read my posts at all? Weather we have the receivers to do it or not has absolutely nothing to do with Christian Ponder's arm strength or talent as a player. If we were to have Ponder throw ten 50+ yard bombs to a decently talented WR, we would be lucky to get 3 receptions out of it (i.e. accurate passes that can be caught) maybe 4 tops. Its NOT something that he is good at and NOT something that should be a focal point of our offense. Trying to make him do something that he's not good at because we might be able to get someone who's awesome like Mike Wallace is not a sound idea.

Great teams are built by guys who can recognize the strengths and weaknesses of their players and figure out how to put them in situations where the team can capitalize on those strengths and marginalize the weaknesses. Clearly Christian Ponder's biggest strength as a QB is the short to intermediate pass game, the guy has the capacity to be a classic West Cost QB. Dude's bread and butter is high percentage short and medium passes, getting the WR the ball at the best possible spot where he is most likely to catch it. Ponder's intermediate game has suffered arguably more than his long game because there were plenty more passes that he could have made at the 30+ yard range that didn't get caught this year because of our bad WRs. This is the area of our passing game which should be focused on because it should yield better results, especially if we get a bigger WR who is well suited to catching contested balls. Lets put him in a situation where he can complete 6+ of those passes instead.

I'm not about to say that he's a better WR, but on this team I bet we could make better use of Brian Hartline in our offense catching these kinds of passes past 30 yards than we ever would be able to make of Mike Wallace catching bombs down the field.

[vikingsfan0845]

Man, do you read my posts at all? Weather we have the receivers to do it or not has absolutely nothing to do with Christian Ponder's arm strength or talent as a player. If we were to have Ponder throw ten 50+ yard bombs to a decently talented WR, we would be lucky to get 3 receptions out of it (i.e. accurate passes that can be caught) maybe 4 tops. Its NOT something that he is good at and NOT something that should be a focal point of our offense. Trying to make him do something that he's not good at because we might be able to get someone who's awesome like Mike Wallace is not a sound idea.

Great teams are built by guys who can recognize the strengths and weaknesses of their players and figure out how to put them in situations where the team can capitalize on those strengths and marginalize the weaknesses. Clearly Christian Ponder's biggest strength as a QB is the short to intermediate pass game, the guy has the capacity to be a classic West Cost QB. Dude's bread and butter is high percentage short and medium passes, getting the WR the ball at the best possible spot where he is most likely to catch it. Ponder's intermediate game has suffered arguably more than his long game because there were plenty more passes that he could have made at the 30+ yard range that didn't get caught this year because of our bad WRs. This is the area of our passing game which should be focused on because it should yield better results, especially if we get a bigger WR who is well suited to catching contested balls. Lets put him in a situation where he can complete 6+ of those passes instead.

I'm not about to say that he's a better WR, but on this team I bet we could make better use of Brian Hartline in our offense catching these kinds of passes past 30 yards than we ever would be able to make of Mike Wallace catching bombs down the field.

Whether*

[ApolloInfinity]

Man, do you read my posts at all? Weather we have the receivers to do it or not has absolutely nothing to do with Christian Ponder's arm strength or talent as a player. If we were to have Ponder throw ten 50+ yard bombs to a decently talented WR, we would be lucky to get 3 receptions out of it (i.e. accurate passes that can be caught) maybe 4 tops. Its NOT something that he is good at and NOT something that should be a focal point of our offense. Trying to make him do something that he's not good at because we might be able to get someone who's awesome like Mike Wallace is not a sound idea.

Great teams are built by guys who can recognize the strengths and weaknesses of their players and figure out how to put them in situations where the team can capitalize on those strengths and marginalize the weaknesses. Clearly Christian Ponder's biggest strength as a QB is the short to intermediate pass game, the guy has the capacity to be a classic West Cost QB. Dude's bread and butter is high percentage short and medium passes, getting the WR the ball at the best possible spot where he is most likely to catch it. Ponder's intermediate game has suffered arguably more than his long game because there were plenty more passes that he could have made at the 30+ yard range that didn't get caught this year because of our bad WRs. This is the area of our passing game which should be focused on because it should yield better results, especially if we get a bigger WR who is well suited to catching contested balls. Lets put him in a situation where he can complete 6+ of those passes instead.

I'm not about to say that he's a better WR, but on this team I bet we could make better use of Brian Hartline in our offense catching these kinds of passes past 30 yards than we ever would be able to make of Mike Wallace catching bombs down the field.

Well, the WCO is about the short passes and run game to set up the long bomb of PA. It still has a vertical element to it.

Wallace can run every route Hartline and you act like all Wallace would run is a go route.

We need to get the freakin S out of the box, it's not that simple. Your not going to do that by running bubble screens and slants. You do that by sucking in the S's and LB's on PA and going over the top of them.

Bowe would command the same amount of money as Wallace, but Bowe hasn't neccessarily helped his struggling QB's either. Bowe run's the wrong routes and gets his QB in trouble. He has shown a lack of interest and effort, big red flags if you ask me.

You do know Wallace is 6'0, and is as good as anybody at coming down with the 50/50 deep ball...Somebody said we need a S. Rice type. Rice didn't burn anybody but always came down with the football, Wallace can do that and burn you to. I think Wallace is fast enough that Ponder can heave it as deep as he can he won't be able to out throw Wallace's legs.