Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 36
  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    7,166
    vCash
    1500
    I stopped reading Keith Law a long time ago. Not a fan, and this certainly doesn't change my mind.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Kris Medlen's Bed
    Posts
    10,034
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinny642 View Post
    Yeah I still have all the faith in the world of JHey, oh and Stanton got 4th
    That's really shocking actually


    The Cult of Gattis

  3. #18
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Kris Medlen's Bed
    Posts
    10,034
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by rtgthree View Post
    I stopped reading Keith Law a long time ago. Not a fan, and this certainly doesn't change my mind.
    He's one of my favorites but he can't admit when he is wrong about a player like he was with Beachy. He still stands by his original report that Beachy is a back end starter.


    The Cult of Gattis

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    7,166
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by ATL#22 View Post
    He's one of my favorites but he can't admit when he is wrong about a player like he was with Beachy. He still stands by his original report that Beachy is a back end starter.
    I just think he takes really stark stances that are often miles away from most other analysts. Every now and then he hits on someone that no one else saw coming, but most of the time the "mainstream" is more accurate.

    As for Beachy, though, there's a very real risk in my opinion that Law is ultimately right about that. "Back end" might be a tad bit extreme, but his SIERA in 2012 was 4.05 before he got hurt. I don't think anyone really expects him to keep his K rate up at 11 per nine innings, like it was in 2011. If it falls down into the 7.5 range, where it was in '12, then he's actually pretty unspectacular because he doesn't do a great job keeping the ball on the ground. Consider the following comparison:

    Brandon Beachy 2012: 7.56 K/9, 3.22 BB/9, 1.01 GB/FB, 4.05 SIERA
    Mystery Pitcher: 7.95 K/9, 3.63 BB/9, 0.99 GB/FB, 4.14 SIERA

    The mystery pitcher is the 2012 edition of James McDonald, who was solid but nothing too special (4.21 ERA). Now don't get me wrong: I LOVE me some Brandon Beachy. But there's a very real chance that he ends up as a #3/#4 type as opposed to an ace.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    5,935
    vCash
    1500
    Stanton probably got bumped because many people don't like his injury history and what it could bode for the future. You can count me among those people - it's worrisome to have so many nagging injuries at such a young age.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,461
    vCash
    1500
    I'm pretty ok with these rankings. Stanton probably should've been above Heyward, but you have to feel good about having 4 out of the top 25.

    And yes, Trout was the best player in the league last year by a wide margin. Cabrera has a better bat but Trout just provides so much more value.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    14,219
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by rtgthree
    "Back end" might be a tad bit extreme, but his SIERA in 2012 was 4.05 before he got hurt. I don't think anyone really expects him to keep his K rate up at 11 per nine innings, like it was in 2011. If it falls down into the 7.5 range, where it was in '12, then he's actually pretty unspectacular because he doesn't do a great job keeping the ball on the ground. Consider the following comparison:

    Brandon Beachy 2012: 7.56 K/9, 3.22 BB/9, 1.01 GB/FB, 4.05 SIERA
    Mystery Pitcher: 7.95 K/9, 3.63 BB/9, 0.99 GB/FB, 4.14 SIERA

    The mystery pitcher is the 2012 edition of James McDonald, who was solid but nothing too special (4.21 ERA). Now don't get me wrong: I LOVE me some Brandon Beachy. But there's a very real chance that he ends up as a #3/#4 type as opposed to an ace.
    Agree with this, and if JT does develop into a Number 1, having a 2-3-4 of Medlen, Beachy, Minor going forward is just fine by me if all of them stay healthy. Maybe just a poor choice of words by Law on some of the evaluations.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    In the gym
    Posts
    2,340
    vCash
    1500
    lol on Kimbrel's rank. Are you kidding???

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    7,166
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo95 View Post
    Agree with this, and if JT does develop into a Number 1, having a 2-3-4 of Medlen, Beachy, Minor going forward is just fine by me if all of them stay healthy. Maybe just a poor choice of words by Law on some of the evaluations.
    Which is the main reason I don't want to see the Braves trade Teheran. To be honest, I like Medlen so much that I see Teheran ending up as Medlen's wingman rather than the other way around...but your point stands that it'd be an incredible group.

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Clearwater/St Pete, FL
    Posts
    559
    vCash
    1500
    Should be:

    Trout
    Stanton
    Harper
    Kershaw
    Strasburg
    Heyward

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    599
    vCash
    1500
    One has to realize just how valuable a closer can be , even as good of one as Kimbrel. Any good starting pitcher is more valuable than the best closer. To even be on this list and be a closer is impressive enough.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    599
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by hagausaf View Post
    Should be:

    Trout
    Stanton
    Harper
    Kershaw
    Strasburg
    Heyward
    I'm not sure. For one superstar hitters are generally more valuable than superstar pitchers. Heyward just posted a fWar of 6.6. And most would say he isn't even close to reaching his potential yet offensively. He's already great and has has loads of potential.

    Kershaw I think peaked at 6.7 fWar in 2011 and going forward I would expect anything in the high 5 to low 6 range before he finally begins to tail off. Strasburg I would expect the same thing once he finally gets to the 200+ inning plateau.

    I would knock Harper down a tad but almost everyone loves his huge potential and with his hype and really good rookie year it's hard not to see him that high.

    And I would take Heyward over Stanton. Stanton is clearly the better hitter right now but Heyward makes up for that in defense (best right fielder in the game) and base running (top 10 base runner in the game). If/when Heyward offensive talent catches up to the Stanton level then Heyward will be of the absolute best players in the game.

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    St. Simon's Island
    Posts
    6,774
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by thewupk View Post
    And I would take Heyward over Stanton. Stanton is clearly the better hitter right now but Heyward makes up for that in defense (best right fielder in the game) and base running (top 10 base runner in the game). If/when Heyward offensive talent catches up to the Stanton level then Heyward will be of the absolute best players in the game.
    Agree 100%.

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    824
    vCash
    1500
    Trout should not have been MVP. I heard Maddog giving the stats on this back in the fall...but after the 7th inning, Trout's numbers were more than .100 pts lower than Cabrera. Hitting with risp, Cabrera dominated Trout. Cabrera may have been valued by war as lower, but the numbers that matter in a pennant chase are not calculated...Trout folded down the stretch, with risp & in the clutch. You get two guys that are that close...those numbers matter. Just check out the last month of the season stats.

    I woukd take Heyward over Harper. I think we have yet to see anywhere near the best Heyward. Kimbrel should be top 10-15...no pitcher has ever dominated that much over a two yr period...e

  15. #30
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    7,166
    vCash
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by vtgriff09 View Post
    Trout should not have been MVP. I heard Maddog giving the stats on this back in the fall...but after the 7th inning, Trout's numbers were more than .100 pts lower than Cabrera. Hitting with risp, Cabrera dominated Trout. Cabrera may have been valued by war as lower, but the numbers that matter in a pennant chase are not calculated...Trout folded down the stretch, with risp & in the clutch. You get two guys that are that close...those numbers matter. Just check out the last month of the season stats.
    Except that Trout also led the league in WPA, which absolutely takes into account clutch performance. And it does so way better than looking at arbitrary splits like after the seventh inning (when the game could just as easily be 10-0 as 2-1) or RISP (solo homers don't count). And to boot, WPA doesn't even take into account defense, where Trout absolutely owned Cabrera.

    As far as the "down the stretch" thing...a win in April counts the same as a win in September. When you win is irrelevant.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •