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  1. #31
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    hockey day is January 19th isnt it? I believe the NHL originally had the Wild playing in CHI that day, but fans were like...you can't take Hockey Day away from the fans after taking away so much from them already.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by penguins2946 View Post
    Pens fan here. I see that you guys are talking about wanting to get another D, preferably a defensive D. Pens need a winger for Crosby. We have Martin. You have Setoguchi. What would it take for a deal to be made around them? I was thinking something like:

    Martin (we'll pay half of his salary), Kennedy and Morrow for Setoguchi and Clutterbuck

    Would you guys do that or would the Pens need to throw in more?
    Little late...but terrible trade. Martin was garbage with a garbage contract that the Pens have been swinging to everyone. Morrow is an awesome prospect I would love to have but Setoguchi is much more valuable especially since we now will actually get to see what he can do with a balanced offense.

    If you look back pens fans have been swinging him to us more than once and im not trading a top 6 forward and another great top 9 and fan favorite guy for your worst Defender last year.
    Last edited by pidg88; 01-13-2013 at 05:10 PM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    Little late...but terrible trade. Martin was garbage with a garbage contract that the Pens have been swinging to everyone. Morrow is an awesome prospect I would love to have but Setoguchi is much more valuable especially since we now will actually get to see what he can do with a balanced offense.

    If you look back pens fans have been swinging him to us more than once and im not trading a top 6 forward and another great top 9 and fan favorite guy for your worst Defender last year.
    At $5 million, he has a trash contract. But at $2.5, that's a bargain. And it's the opposite, a bunch of teams have inquired about Martin, such as Nashville.

  4. #34
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    Then trade that garbage defender to Nashville. One of the pens fans on this forum last season tried to pitch him here look it up and read the posts even he agreed he was garbage and a garbage ****ing contract. And where the hell is this 2.5 coming from his contract is 5mil I could give a **** less if you pay half of it one year. Garbage. Come back here if you want to propose a real trade that helps both teams. Here ill counter your trade

    Despres for Clutterbuck
    Last edited by pidg88; 01-13-2013 at 09:20 PM.

  5. #35
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    And get outta your Pens thread saying that the wild forum "agreed and liked" the trade idea. One person said he didnt mind it. No one else agreed with it. You have 3 years and 15 mil left owed to a player who was at the bottom of your D last year and will be again this year. There has been talk of you guys using the amnesty on him and then you think you can turn around and trade him for a top 6 forward and one of the best bottom 6 players in the league? This isnt NHL 13, Martin is garbage. trolol

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    Then trade that garbage defender to Nashville. One of the pens fans on this forum last season tried to pitch him here look it up and read the posts even he agreed he was garbage and a garbage ****ing contract. And where the hell is this 2.5 coming from his contract is 5mil. Garbage. Come back here if you want to propose a real trade that helps both teams. Here ill counter your trade

    Despres for Clutterbuck
    Under the new CBA, teams can keep up to 50% of existing contracts while trading players. Pens could keep $2.5 while shipping $2.5 to the Wild.

    And on the trade, you are severely overvaluing your players. Setoguchi had 36 points last year. That's not good for a scorer. He hasn't gotten over 50 points in 3 years. His offense has been underwhelming to say the least. Along someone like Crosby, he would/should get back up to where he used to be. That's not going to happen in Minnesota.

    I agree with Clutterbuck being valuable, but he isn't even close to being worth Despres. Despres is a young D, that is NHL ready, and will most likely be a top-4 D for a long time. A 3rd line grinder isn't worth that.

    Martin was a rock for NJ for the longest time, then he came into a system that was terrible for him. There's no other way to put it. He isn't as bad as people say he is. He struggled last year. Seto has struggled for 3 years.

    To top it off, we throw in our top D prospect that's gonna be a very good point producer on the back-end and a decent 3rd line winger to replace Clutterbuck.

    You saying that the deal is terrible is not only short-sighted, but just plain wrong. It's an extremely even deal. Pens are giving up a top-4 D AT A GOOD PRICE that the Wild need, a decent 3rd line winger and one of the top-30 prospects in hockey. The Wild are giving up a winger that hasn't produced in a long time and a good 3rd line winger.

    And there's no reason to be rude on your posts, seriously.

  7. #37
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    Martin was a rock in a trap defense! Everyone was! Once out of that system what happened to him? Oh yeah he sucks now for you guys and you overpaid for him and are now trying to pawn him off on us. Yes you can pay one year, but I dont want a ****** 5 mil cap hit for 2 more. Unless your saying your going to pay half for the next three years. Remember what happened to all players after JL was no longer coaching them, even Minnesota players (our Goalie Backstrom?) got an extremely inflated contract because his numbers reflected the trap system, and congrats you guys signed your own inflated contract to a fringe top 4 defender.

    Your right Setoguchi hasnt been himself. But last year he was on a ****** team (the Wild) and his center was usually either Warren Peters, Chad Rau or Matt Cullen if he was lucky. Anyone would have a ****** year with those guys as your swing man. Koivu is one of the most under rated centers in the league and Granlund is one of the top prospects in the game, his numbers will do just fine once he has a competent line.

    Your top D prospect is NOT Morrow. You have Despres (who is still technically a "prospect"), Pouliot and Maatta who all are about even. I would rank Morrow 3rd probably behind Depres and Pouliot.

    Get this in your head, I could give a **** less about this 3rd line winger your throwing in, the wild have extreme depth at forward.

    Yes the deal is terrible. How is that short sited? Taking on a terrible contract for three more years for a fringe top 4 D is short sighted? We gave up the best defender this club has ever had to get Seto and a prospect and there is no way I then turn him around and trade him for Martin. Martin is a fringe top 4 defender and you will see that this year when young guys start getting ice time over him. YOUR OWN FANS ON YOUR THREADS HAVE SAID YOU SHOULD BUY OUT MARTIN. So stop trying to sound like your doing us a favor by taking a top 6 winger from us for him.

    I will stop being rude when you realize that you cant just come in here throw a ****** offer out and act like your doing us a favor. You didnt like my ****** offer now did ya?

    You want Setoguchi and Clutterbuck? Bennett+Morrow+Tangradi for Setoguchi+Clutterbuck+2nd rounder

    You get a proven top 6 that you can "revive" that I guess other teams cant? One of the best third liners and a high'ish draft pick

    We get a triplet of prospects headlined by Morrow and Bennet with hoping Tangradi can become the powerforward he was suppose to be here.
    Last edited by pidg88; 01-13-2013 at 09:43 PM.

  8. #38
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    And if im over valuing my players I have no idea what to call what you are doing with Martin. Your dead on with Morrow he is a stud but the Wild have no one who can replace Setoguchi or Clutterbuck right now you would be taking our 2nd and third line RW and giving us a fringe top 4. Our D might be thin but its not worth that. And dont say Kennedy replaces Clutter because he doesnt, I dont think Kennedy has ever played on his off side just LW and C so that would do us no good.

    In other words your creating 2 holes and kind of replacing one. Although I think Sutter, Spurgeon, Gilbert and Scandella are all better then Martin so its like creating 2 holes and filling half a hole.
    Last edited by pidg88; 01-13-2013 at 09:44 PM.

  9. #39
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    Didn't someone on the page before say this:

    "but getting Paul Martin to shore up our defense, and putting another quality D prospect like Morrow in the minors would be nice."

    I'm not overvaluing Martin, I put him in a similar situation to Setoguchi. Both have struggled recently. Why isn't it fair to trade a struggling D and a top D prospect (I know my team better than you do, and Morrow is the top D prospect) for a struggling wing? The TK and Clutterbuck part can be left out, it's not even that important. The core of this deal is Morrow and Martin for Setoguchi, which is kinda an overpayment imo.

    And your point on Seto struggling, he has been struggling for 3 years, not just last year. He has a max of 41 points in those seasons. Don't give me the excuse that he had a bad center. It probably didn't help, but he was struggling before he was there.

    I'm not even going to argue with you anymore, your just a jerk who is wearing tinted green glasses. It's just bad how blatant your homerism is. You think a 3rd line grinder and a top-9 winger (I'm not even giving him a top-6 title anymore, he needs more than 40 points a season to prove to me that he is a top-6) is worth the Pens top prospects at F and D and another young F? Are you kidding me? Freaking TK had more points than Seto over the last 2 years. The same TK that sucks. I can understand wanting to get the most out of your players, but you just need to get realistic. A scorer who can't even get 45 points and a 3rd line grinder aren't worth 2 1st round picks and a 2nd. It's that simple. I wouldn't doubt that Seto was just a throw in for Burns, honestly. He had 2 bad seasons before, then he got shipped out.
    Last edited by penguins2946; 01-13-2013 at 09:59 PM.

  10. #40
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    So Morrow is better then Despres? I dont care what team what prospect is from I follow Juniors and AHL more then I do the NHL, and I follow the NHL pretty religiously so that tells you something. I mistated earlier I think Morrow is your 2nd best D prospect but no right now your best D prospect is Despres his game is MUCH more mature and well rounded then Morrows not to mention he has a much bigger frame and reach. Morrow is an amazing offensive D man but he does have holes in his D game and his rushes and joining the rushes often leave holes in his defensive game. Ask anyone from this thread of Detroits do not question my knowledge on Prospects and I already gave Morrow his Kudos but Despres is better right now.

    Seto struggled in SJ because his first years he was relied on hence his good point output. Once they signed Heatley and Pavelski and Couture came he lost his role and his numbers dropped because of less TOI and less top 6 time. Thats why SJ could trade him to us. Then he came here and was injured and didnt have a true line to play with (we had maybe 3 true top 6 players on our team last year and Koivu was usually hurt and when he wasnt Seto was)

    Martin is struggling because he is out of the system that any defender can shine in (the trap). He is now playing to his real potential a #4 or #5 D man that you are paying 5mil. The alone fact of that for Seto's 3mil makes this extremely unappealing. He is also 31 and past his prime where Seto is 26 and entering his prime and with a good team to turn his play around.

    So if we drop TK and Clutter, and add in Morrow who again as I said is a top D prospect in the league right now it is still not nearly worth in for the Wild to hamstring ourselves with a 15mil over the next 3 years contract for a #4 or #5 D in exchange for a 2nd/fringe 1st line RW that has the ability to score 30 goals. If you call Martin anything more then a 4-5D your are kidding yourself and all of us in here. We have top D prospects so Morrow really isnt a necessity. Where is the value here for the Wild? You said I was short sited well I dont see any short or long term benefits as next year our top D prospect should be on the team (if he isnt already this year in Brodin) and our other youngsters like Spurgeon and Scandella will have supplanted themselves as top 4 D making Martin a 5mil #5 D for our team.

    And no offense to Purplejesus, he knows more then me in any other sport but hockey, so when he says acquiring Martin would be nice I dont think he really knows exactly what he is talking about. If he would have proposed such a thing I would of came at him too.

  11. #41
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    And btw stop editing your posts and adding new content, if you have something else to say have some etiquette and post a new response so you dont take out things that I am already talking about in my new post.

  12. #42
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    Again my trade was to show you that you laugh at my offers cause you see them as one sided, just how I see yours. Your posts reek of this "homerism" too. I just dont get how you can justify talking about buying out Martin in your own forum and then try to throw him around like he is worth a top 6 forward. Yes Seto is a top 6 forward and it shows just how stupid you are if you arent going to consider him that. Call me a jerk all you want I could care less, but quit acting like what you know if fair and all that because you wear the same glasses I do.

  13. #43
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    And also if you wont even give him a top 6 title yada yada bs why do you want him? If he is not top 6 material you cant put him with Crosby or Malkin now can you?....


    No wait your theory is only your team can revive him to top 6 right? Because NO other team could turn him around and add some pieces around him so he plays better right?...Dang I forgot that....I really wish we were like the Pens and be the only team able to do that...

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    So Morrow is better then Despres? I dont care what team what prospect is from I follow Juniors and AHL more then I do the NHL, and I follow the NHL pretty religiously so that tells you something. I mistated earlier I think Morrow is your 2nd best D prospect but no right now your best D prospect is Despres his game is MUCH more mature and well rounded then Morrows not to mention he has a much bigger frame and reach. Morrow is an amazing offensive D man but he does have holes in his D game and his rushes and joining the rushes often leave holes in his defensive game. Ask anyone from this thread of Detroits do not question my knowledge on Prospects and I already gave Morrow his Kudos but Despres is better right now.

    Seto struggled in SJ because his first years he was relied on hence his good point output. Once they signed Heatley and Pavelski and Couture came he lost his role and his numbers dropped because of less TOI and less top 6 time. Thats why SJ could trade him to us. Then he came here and was injured and didnt have a true line to play with (we had maybe 3 true top 6 players on our team last year and Koivu was usually hurt and when he wasnt Seto was)

    Martin is struggling because he is out of the system that any defender can shine in (the trap). He is now playing to his real potential a #4 or #5 D man that you are paying 5mil. The alone fact of that for Seto's 3mil makes this extremely unappealing. He is also 31 and past his prime where Seto is 26 and entering his prime and with a good team to turn his play around.

    So if we drop TK and Clutter, and add in Morrow who again as I said is a top D prospect in the league right now it is still not nearly worth in for the Wild to hamstring ourselves with a 15mil over the next 3 years contract for a #4 or #5 D in exchange for a 2nd/fringe 1st line RW that has the ability to score 30 goals. If you call Martin anything more then a 4-5D your are kidding yourself and all of us in here. We have top D prospects so Morrow really isnt a necessity. Where is the value here for the Wild? You said I was short sited well I dont see any short or long term benefits as next year our top D prospect should be on the team (if he isnt already this year in Brodin) and our other youngsters like Spurgeon and Scandella will have supplanted themselves as top 4 D making Martin a 5mil #5 D for our team.

    And no offense to Purplejesus, he knows more then me in any other sport but hockey, so when he says acquiring Martin would be nice I dont think he really knows exactly what he is talking about. If he would have proposed such a thing I would of came at him too.
    I agree with pretty much everything you said there. That was a good response. I disagree with the Morrow vs Despres thing, for I think Morrow is the better prospect but Despres is the better player, but the rest I can be on board with. I'm one of the few that doesn't want to buy out Martin though. We have no one to replace him in the short-run. He isn't a top-pair shutdown D, but he is a serviceable #3 or #4. I don't think the Wild would have much interest in Martin though. I think, with all of the offensive talent and Yeo as the coach, that they would be playing a similar style to the Pens, and then Martin would just suck there as well. Maybe someone like the Blues would be interested.

  15. #45
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    There we go cooler minds prevailed. Morrow long term might be the better player if he can fix the holes in his D game. Reminds me a little of Cam Folwer can put up monster offensive numbers but will need to play with someone very D minded to make up for it. I still think Despres will be better though.

    I know it sucks but Pens fans will have to face it that you signed him to a ****** contract. The second it was signed I almost **** myself when I heard the cap hit. He is a serviceable 4 D man but has the cap hit of a #2.

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