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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenged24 View Post
    Kobe plays great, team loses - Kobe's fault.

    Kobe plays great, team wins - Pau or Shaq is the reason.

    homer.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenged24 View Post
    Kobe plays great, team loses - Kobe's fault.

    Kobe plays great, team wins - Pau or Shaq is the reason.

    homer.

  3. #18
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    good points chronz.

  4. #19
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    Coach D hate to separate Kobe and Dwight from getting into a fist fight!

    https://twitter.com/kobebryant/statu...829442/photo/1

    they're trolling hard, so is the media.

  5. #20
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    The lakers pieces just don't fit well together. They need a couple young players and a 3pt specialist.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew32 View Post
    And you actually believe that...?
    Not 100% I dont, like his minutes excuse above doesn't add up but I do believe in his mind he is sacrificing. The point being, hes the same guy hes always been. Kobe isn't doing anything now that he wouldn't have done in the past.
    His inability to put aside his ego and sacrifice in 03 and 04 were a big part of why those Laker teams failed in terms of chemistry and performance when it mattered.
    Somewhat agree but hes come a long way since then.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    Kobe isn't doing anything now that he wouldn't have done in the past.
    Eh... but Kobe is on a different team now with a different coach and I don't believe he has always been the same mentally.

    His ego and personality has changed and developed over the years.

    He is also not physically the same player he was earlier in his career or capable of the same things.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by el hidalgo View Post
    exactly. its hard for his teammates to get in grooves when he takes 40 shots some games. gasol and dwight need more touches.
    Shouldn't your play dictate how many touches you get? If they want more touches, shouldn't they be less sloppy?

    Or do you think its in the best interest of the Lakers long term future if they sacrifice all chances of winning in hopes that Dwight/Pau eventually return to form?
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

  9. #24
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    You lost me at " kobe has sacrificed".

    He has sacrifized JACK in his career.

    When he was young he was FORCED to sacrifice ( HIS NUMBERS) because Shaq was the Man, and btw the whole thing went to hell when whe no longer felt like doing it.
    Worht mentionin that in 03 and 04 when he stopped sacrificing his numbers the thing went to HELL and the ring winning stopped
    He shoots whenever he wants.
    He has to be the top scorer of the team EVERY GAME, whenver a temamte is outscoring him in the first half he shoots like crazy the second half.
    Whenever he is near to a milestone he shoots like crazy.

    He takes all the shots in close games in the fourth quarters ( o yeah im impressed a lot with his unselfishness when he starts the game playing team game but in the 4th quarter he starts jacking up shots when triple teamed).
    +
    TO hell with the blinders.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew32 View Post
    He is also not physically the same player he was earlier in his career or capable of the same things.
    Too vague. Kobes career spans 17+ seasons, the point being raised is that Kobe is a BETTER player than the one hes been of recent memory. He certainly thinks so, the stats certainly back it up, its just the team success thats lacking and I dont think that should reflect on him one iota. Then again, Ive changed my mind on Kobe before. Considering the numbers tho, I dont see what more he can be doing.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    Shouldn't your play dictate how many touches you get? If they want more touches, shouldn't they be less sloppy?
    Yes but playing well individually doesn't necessarily make ball dominance a good thing if you are on a team like the current Lakers.

    Or do you think its in the best interest of the Lakers long term future if they sacrifice all chances of winning in hopes that Dwight/Pau eventually return to form?
    Back in 2012 I thought Kobe was being way too ball dominant and selfish offensively in the regular season and not allowing Gasol and Bynum to carry enough of the offensive load.

    I predicted they would fail that year due to Kobe carrying too large a load.

    In the playoffs Kobe played even more selfishly and of course they failed as I predicted.

    In that case I felt forcing Bynum/Pau to carry a bigger load (even if they didn't produce with it) was their only chance to contend.

    I feel they may have the same issues this year (although I am not 100% sure).
    If Kobe doesn't get his other offensive players playing more effectively they will fail again no matter how well he plays individually.

  12. #27
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    Interesting thing is that Nash was interviewed the other night after the clipper game and he said that (when) the other guys werent making shots, he always goes to the most efficient option (in his opinion?) which is dump the rock to kobe and let him go to work.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellcrooner View Post
    When he was young he was FORCED to sacrifice ( HIS NUMBERS) because Shaq was the Man, and btw the whole thing went to hell when whe no longer felt like doing it..
    He has NEVER sacrificed.
    That is pro-Kobe propoganda spit by the man himself.

    He never sacrificed even in those years.

    In the 01-02 playoffs he averaged 22.5 FGA.
    In the 08-10 playoffs he averaged 22.5 FGA.

    Yes in 00 he averaged only 18 FGA but that was already more then he could handle.
    You don't want to give a 50%TS player inefficient offensive player more touches.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellcrooner View Post
    TO hell with the blinders.
    But your admitting Kobe has been like this a good while right, it was good enough to win alot more than they are winning now and hes playing better now than he was then, so how can it be on him?

    Unless your saying hes become an entirely new form of cancer we haven't seen from him in a very long time. I dont buy that, this team may be underachieving but it is more talented in terms of name value than actual talent.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew32 View Post
    Yes but playing well individually doesn't necessarily make ball dominance a good thing if you are on a team like the current Lakers.
    Based on what tho, he was forced into being the defacto PG for much of the year. I have my own opinion on how the Lakers should have played but Kobe being more ball dominant wasn't my issue, it was who he shared the floor with. If it were up to me I would have started Meeks with Kobe in the backcourt and have Kobe become even more ball dominant. But I dont think it makes a night and day difference here either.


    Back in 2012 I thought Kobe was being way too ball dominant and selfish offensively in the regular season and not allowing Gasol and Bynum to carry enough of the offensive load.
    Maybe-maybe not, I think Phil has hinted at this but I truly believe maximizing Bynum's post touches came at the expense of Pau's game. It may have been necessary given Pau's gradual decline but that had very little to with Kobe, the Lakers were one of the better post up teams in the league, hard to say the bigs werent utilized, its very hard to force feed 1 big, much less 2.
    I would argue Bynum was over-utilized but the lockout and his injury this year have clouded my perspective on that.

    In that case I felt forcing Bynum/Pau to carry a bigger load (even if they didn't produce with it) was their only chance to contend.
    I think the bigs should show something before getting it but I see what you mean. Kind of wish Kobe sat some games so we could see how the Lakers operate for a larger sample of work without him. Because thus far I think the Lakers would be far worse if Kobe did less.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

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