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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocket View Post
    Ben was not a superstar. He was an all-star. We did not have a superstar. Billups was the closest thing we had to a superstar while we had our run. (damn near was one)
    Wallace was an allstar because Piston fans stuffed the ballot box. Being an allstar in any sport is overrated just because their own fans vote them in.
    If the voting was done by unbiased voting half of these so call stars would be watching the game from home .
    Wallace was fun to watch and brought lots of energy . I agree he was not a superstar. I also agree had Rasheed Wallace stayed down low he could have been a much better player. Superstar ? We will never know.
    "Just because the path is well beaten. That doesn't mean it's the right way to go"

  2. #17
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    I agree what most of you are saying about Ben... he was a Star, sure, but not a superstar. I also agree that Chauncey wasn't a superstar either, but he was the closest thing we had to one. That team didnt have a Lebron or a D Wade or a Durant... the writer of this is trying to prove a point but the evidence he presents only raises questions that we easily have answered. Teamwork and hard work won that championship.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by shyfly24 View Post
    Lets all call Bruce Bowen, Tony Allen, Rick Fox, Dough Christie superstars as well

    Lock down defenders w/ no offensive game. Do you see what I see?
    Not really the same thing. Big Ben anchored one of the greatest defensive teams of all-time.

  4. #19
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    Ben Wallace was a defensive-star probably only 2nd to Shaq during his time... far from a superstar imo(like many said, I think a superstar is the whole package). The 2004 Pistons just had a team of All-Stars kinda like the '08 Celtics even though KG, Allen, and Paul Pierce was once considered superstars on previous teams.


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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotMayo View Post
    Ben was a superstar for like a gazillion reasons. You can't just look at "stats"
    What did ben do that marcus camby didn't do? or that mutombo didn't do? If anything, camby and mutombo did the same things for their teams but had better offense.

    And im not just looking at stats, I saw one of the worst offensive players in the history of the nba. His offensive game looked worst then that of the worst d-league player. And I love ben.

    The fact Chauncy won a championship w/o a superstar proves his worth. Lebron (a superstar himself) needed another superstar/allstar to win a championship.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gators123 View Post
    Not really the same thing. Big Ben anchored one of the greatest defensive teams of all-time.
    When Ben left, our team was still a great defensive team. Ben was a big part of it, but we still were competitive w/o him. That proves his worth wasnt a necessity. When chauncy left we completely fell off the map. That proves a lot right there.

  6. #21
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    It took both Big Ben and Chauncey to make that team what it was, a complete team for team defense.
    $9.99

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunFactor007 View Post
    It took both Big Ben and Chauncey to make that team what it was, a complete team for team defense.
    Sheed was instrumental to that too. There were some games where Rip went off and Tay did well, but I think you could replace either of them with similar players and still win the ship.

    Chauncy's play made the entire team better, Ben anchored the defensive end of their play, and honestly Sheed came in and gave the team that attitude and confidence that they needed. Remember before the deadline that year they had some struggles, when Sheed got here he got them all fired up and ready to play. Just my thoughts. If you take Sheed, Billups and Ben and put them all together then you have a superstar... together as a team with stars they made the team a superstar team.

  8. #23
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    Shy, love the Billups-LBJ comparison.

    Big Ben was a super star in the eyes of Piston fans, he was a defensive super-star by league standards. As far as the media goes, he had his moments(more than any other defensive "specialist").

    We won in 2004 because our top 8 were deeper than most other teams, we were timely with our play. I honestly don't know if we would have won without the pick up of Sheed. He became our x-factor on most occasions.

  9. #24
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    i think stats get looked at too much marcus camby may have had good defensive stats but ben wallace brought an intangible skill set and could set the tone and made clutch defensive plays and had more steals and hustle plays
    POP! POP!

  10. #25
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    ben also shut down lanes on the court and did things that wont show up on a box score but did show up in more wins compared to camby and mutumbo
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  11. #26
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    I think people are inclined to mention the Pistons because like the Bullets, they had an offensively limited center who was undersized but was still an amazing rebounder and defender.

    All the starters for that team have made an All-Star team. So yeah... they had stars. Ben was the greatest rebounder and defender of his generation.

    But I think it was the idea that they focused on everything as a team. Scoring, defence... so people see them as a team, and no single player stands out as the "superstar".
    What the eye doesn't see and the mind doesn't know, doesn't exist.
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by shyfly24 View Post
    A superstar is a player that if there not playing on the team, the team looks lost out there and in essence, sucks.

    When Wallace left us for the bulls our team was still competitive. But when Billups left our team went completely down hill. The real superstar is Billups.
    Not that I disagree with you on this, but how much of that had to do with bringing in Iverson and not neccessarily losing Billups?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by sc8581 View Post
    Not that I disagree with you on this, but how much of that had to do with bringing in Iverson and not neccessarily losing Billups?
    Ok but he left mid season right? We were even worse w/o him. So it was the same team just replaced billups w/ stuckey. And instead of dominating in the playoffs, we looked lost

  14. #29
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    Once Billups was traded the team knew it was over for them. I've posted the article before about Billups, Rip, and Prince all crying in the hotel room together when they found out about the trade.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gators123 View Post
    Once Billups was traded the team knew it was over for them. I've posted the article before about Billups, Rip, and Prince all crying in the hotel room together when they found out about the trade.
    So are you saying it had nothing to do, not even a little chance, w/ stuckey not being a point guard and setting up his teammates like billups did? No chance at all? Is the only option that the team just gave up cause billups left?

    Why werent our players crying in rooms together when ben wallace left?

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