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  1. #1
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    Almost 52 years ago....

    Eisenhower warned us of the growth potential of the military-industry complex and misused power:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y06NSBBRtY

    Where are we today on that? Why does half of me feel as if I'm being a paranoid conspiracy guy by wholly believing we, the plebs, are being roundly ****ed by those in charge and that it's done to a willingly? Do you snare at someone who believes this as some kind of crazy hippie creature?

  2. #2
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    Eisenhower did a lot of warning that people should pay attention to today.

    It amazes me how we think that if we had a military leader (general or otherwise) that we would have a massive buildup in the military. I think of it as the exact opposite. If you have someone who has been to war you are going to have to bring them a damn compelling case why soldiers should be put through that hell. The reason is simple...they've seen it and they know what it can do to someone.
    Member of the Owlluminati!

  3. #3
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    My people, the Andalites, only engage in war because we made the Yeerks aware and advanced. Never would we wage war for profit.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    My people, the Andalites, only engage in war because we made the Yeerks aware and advanced. Never would we wage war for profit.
    Am I speaking to Elfangor or to Ax?


    Vic Mackey: You better figure out how much you hate me. And how you're going to deal with that. 'Cause I'm not going anywhere.

    This sums up every sports interview, ever.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Eisenhower did a lot of warning that people should pay attention to today.

    It amazes me how we think that if we had a military leader (general or otherwise) that we would have a massive buildup in the military. I think of it as the exact opposite. If you have someone who has been to war you are going to have to bring them a damn compelling case why soldiers should be put through that hell. The reason is simple...they've seen it and they know what it can do to someone.
    Kind of like how Ron Paul, the only guy in the running in 2012 that would to drastically scale back military spending, got the most donations from military of any GOP candidate.





  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twitchy View Post
    Am I speaking to Elfangor or to Ax?
    Alloran.

    So there WERE two people who read that series? I knew those books couldn't just have been ready by me.

    Kind of like how Ron Paul, the only guy in the running in 2012 that would to drastically scale back military spending, got the most donations from military of any GOP candidate.
    Yeah but he's old and crazy unlike the two guys you are supposed to pick from.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by homestarunner93 View Post
    Kind of like how Ron Paul, the only guy in the running in 2012 that would to drastically scale back military spending, got the most donations from military of any GOP candidate.
    Kind of, Paul did serve from 63 to 68 (I had to look this up) but I was more meaning someone who has ordered men into battle and seen the repercussions of their decision. I think it really changes your opinion when you see the scars and damage caused by it and you become more reserved (for the most part).
    Member of the Owlluminati!

  8. #8
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    Another warning worth checking out: http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.html

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    Yeah but he's old and crazy unlike the two guys you are supposed to pick from.
    If crazy means principled and honest, then I'll be crazy all day every day.





  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Kind of, Paul did serve from 63 to 68 (I had to look this up) but I was more meaning someone who has ordered men into battle and seen the repercussions of their decision. I think it really changes your opinion when you see the scars and damage caused by it and you become more reserved (for the most part).
    It really depends on the man. There are some generals, like Ike, who take the exact point of view you have. Then there are some generals (to use a historical example) like Patton, who would have had a completely different view.
    Here is the question of the day, does anyone think that wealthy people should pay a lower percentage of their income to taxes than middle class people? Don't argue tax brackets, just a simple question. Do you think someone earning 46 million dollars should pay a lower percentage of their income than say someone earning sixty thousand?

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    I think we can all agree that 900 bases in 130+ countries is overkill but how much can we scale it back? That's a fine line that even I'm not sure where to draw. People are bringing up Ron Paul but his policy makes us almost isolationist. It makes you wonder how someone like him would handle seeing an Adolf Hitler rise to power. Do we just hide in the 50 states and let him run a muck in Europe?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    I think we can all agree that 900 bases in 130+ countries is overkill but how much can we scale it back? That's a fine line that even I'm not sure where to draw. People are bringing up Ron Paul but his policy makes us almost isolationist. It makes you wonder how someone like him would handle seeing an Adolf Hitler rise to power. Do we just hide in the 50 states and let him run a muck in Europe?
    ...and keeping 250k military personnel overseas. As I wrote yesterday in another topic, what in God's name does the Air Force need 6000 planes for, and what are ever going to use 6000 M1 tanks for?

    The more military hardware you have, the more you will always look for reasons to use it, even if only to keep it from rotting away - even that costs big bucks. We have massive overkill in every department. A 700 billion 'defense' budget is insane and obscene, and quite clearly, we can no longer 'afford' it at current levels. It must be brought down dramatically.

    I think the creation of the EU has insured that there will never be anything like another Hitler over here. I cannot foresee any circumstance under which the US would be required to send any ground forces to Europe ever again.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    I think we can all agree that 900 bases in 130+ countries is overkill but how much can we scale it back? That's a fine line that even I'm not sure where to draw. People are bringing up Ron Paul but his policy makes us almost isolationist. It makes you wonder how someone like him would handle seeing an Adolf Hitler rise to power. Do we just hide in the 50 states and let him run a muck in Europe?
    I actually don't think that would be a bad thing, and I am not all gung ho about Paul.

  14. #14
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    Anyone care to hazard a guess (without googling) who said this?
    Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them.
    You could just as easily insert 'Tea baggers' for Christians.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by GGGGG-Men View Post
    Another warning worth checking out: http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.html
    One of two books, IMO, that should be taught in high school. The other is Zinn's book, A People's History of the United States.

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