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  1. #496
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    Mingo isn't terrible agaijst the run, they designed runs to block him. He was keyed on a lot. Will be interesting to see how he shows out from here to the draft. Until the combine I think he is our guy thus far.

  2. #497
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    I'd rather take Chance Warmack at 9, even if its considered a few picks early for a guard. He is a sure thing and will make an impact, IMO. Mingo is too much of a risk. Aldon Smith was a situational player at first like Mingo is projected to be, but at least he had the sack numbers and tape to warrant taking him that high. Mingo is all potential. We don't need potential, we need impact.

    Also, I'm from the Philadelphia area, and talk on the radio here about the draft in a past couple weeks has made it seem like the Eagles are targeting Dee Milliner, the cornerback from Alabama. However, they don't want to take him at #4, unless he blows up like Patrick Peterson. They would be more comfortable trading down and taking him at #8 or #9, which is where Stephen Gilmore went to the Bills.

    That being said, if Damontre Moore is available at #4, how do you guys feel about making a move up to complete the defense with the much needed Terrell Suggs like player?

  3. #498
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfansince'67 View Post
    NOBODY wants to, and NOBODY will play cheap. Especially Paul Kruger, who is the Ravens best pass rusher, assuming T. Suggs doesn't return to pre-injury form. This guy, or any proven starter/contributor - is not going to play for the money that we have to offer - In my limited opinion.

    GO JETS!!!
    Yeah, this is where too many posters depart from reality and go into fantasy mode to fill out their perfect offseason roster. You have to decide if a Kruger is worth going after and if so, sacrifices must be made at other positions or potential FA acquisitions. It's easy slinging top names out there but who will truly fit the needs and under the current cost structure? These are big-boy decisions.

    No one's going to give any team a public service discount - those days are gone. And by the way, this doesn't go on in NE anymore - they get the guys no one else wants because they're the cheapest. It comes down to leverage and if a player has it, he uses it. The player's union insists on it. Kruger and every other FA will gauge the market value and listen to offers to determine their asking price. It's that simple.

    Speaking of Kruger, he's right near the top of my offseason list but I would pass on him to secure Landry, Slauson and a veteran QB (Smith - 1st, Flynn - 2nd). If there's enough money after all the cuts, then I'd take a shot at him but so many things would have to happen - how much can we get a team to pay for Sanchez if any? Can anyone else be restructured?

    There will be a lot of variables addressed as we now have a new OC who may not even utilize a FB and will be a pass-first play-caller. I've always held out hope that Chris Ivory be looked at in FA, but who knows what now fits Marty's offense. Should be interesting.

  4. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYJetsfan69 View Post
    I'd rather take Chance Warmack at 9, even if its considered a few picks early for a guard. He is a sure thing and will make an impact, IMO. Mingo is too much of a risk. Aldon Smith was a situational player at first like Mingo is projected to be, but at least he had the sack numbers and tape to warrant taking him that high. Mingo is all potential. We don't need potential, we need impact.

    Also, I'm from the Philadelphia area, and talk on the radio here about the draft in a past couple weeks has made it seem like the Eagles are targeting Dee Milliner, the cornerback from Alabama. However, they don't want to take him at #4, unless he blows up like Patrick Peterson. They would be more comfortable trading down and taking him at #8 or #9, which is where Stephen Gilmore went to the Bills.

    That being said, if Damontre Moore is available at #4, how do you guys feel about making a move up to complete the defense with the much needed Terrell Suggs like player?
    I think this talk in Philly could be due to Detroit needing a CB at #5 but who knows? I don't believe the Jets will move up like Tanny did - Idzik covets draft picks and likley realizes he needs bodies to fill the numerous holes.

    As for Warmack, I've never liked this idea especially since Rex has announced that G&P is a thing of the past. Is it so necessary to upgrade a good young OG (Slauson) that's never hurt at the expense of once again not addressing a (dire) needed pass rusher? Does Morninhweg need a OG at #9? It's quite a reach even for a so-called "sure-thing" as DeCastro wrongly was considered this time last year. I think it's a step back to take a step up and I wouldn't build a team this way. Will Idzik? My guess is no.

  5. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by aNYer View Post
    Mingo isn't terrible agaijst the run, they designed runs to block him. He was keyed on a lot. Will be interesting to see how he shows out from here to the draft. Until the combine I think he is our guy thus far.
    It's doubtful any of the people saying they don't want him have actually seen him play much.

    Mingo was so disruptive last year that this year they doubled him continually, and he still made plays in the backfield.

    I'm beginning to think that Mingo doesn't make it to 9, especially after he runs the combine.


  6. #501
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrX27 View Post
    It's doubtful any of the people saying they don't want him have actually seen him play much.

    Mingo was so disruptive last year that this year they doubled him continually, and he still made plays in the backfield.

    I'm beginning to think that Mingo doesn't make it to 9, especially after he runs the combine.
    Same here.

    Unless Ezekial Ansah lights it up at the combine

  7. #502
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    Quote Originally Posted by King P View Post
    Same here.

    Unless Ezekial Ansah lights it up at the combine
    Mingo is not a project, EAnsah is.

    Very limited experience, not just in playing DE/OLB but in playing football in general.

    BUT he's a physical freak in the mold of JPP, not Gholston, so I'm sure the Jets will do their due dilly.


  8. #503
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrX27 View Post
    Mingo is not a project, EAnsah is.

    Very limited experience, not just in playing DE/OLB but in playing football in general.

    BUT he's a physical freak in the mold of JPP, not Gholston, so I'm sure the Jets will do their due dilly.
    I agree that he's a project. I'm just saying if he lights it up at the combine, there's a slight chance somebody could take him in the Top 10.

  9. #504
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfansince'67 View Post
    NOBODY wants to, and NOBODY will play cheap. Especially Paul Kruger, who is the Ravens best pass rusher, assuming T. Suggs doesn't return to pre-injury form. This guy, or any proven starter/contributor - is not going to play for the money that we have to offer - In my limited opinion.

    GO JETS!!!
    Kruger is the very last guy I would chase of the ones I mentioned.

  10. #505
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    Quote Originally Posted by John X Doe View Post
    I think this talk in Philly could be due to Detroit needing a CB at #5 but who knows? I don't believe the Jets will move up like Tanny did - Idzik covets draft picks and likley realizes he needs bodies to fill the numerous holes.

    As for Warmack, I've never liked this idea especially since Rex has announced that G&P is a thing of the past. Is it so necessary to upgrade a good young OG (Slauson) that's never hurt at the expense of once again not addressing a (dire) needed pass rusher? Does Morninhweg need a OG at #9? It's quite a reach even for a so-called "sure-thing" as DeCastro wrongly was considered this time last year. I think it's a step back to take a step up and I wouldn't build a team this way. Will Idzik? My guess is no.
    The 4th pick is worth 1800 points. The 9th and 41st are worth 1840. If thats all it will cost for Moore, I would do it in a heartbeat. This draft does not have the same number of impact players as last years draft. The 2012 draft has been touted as one of those drafts that comes along once every couple decades. We can't bank on the same talent being available at the same picks. We are already having issues finding someone to take at 9 as where last year, you had a plethora of options.

    In most years, post round 2 you are looking for contributors and depth that can develop into starters. Sometimes you get lucky and find a starter in round 3 and later, but not every pick is Rusell Wilson. You are looking for quality depth that can develop. The drafting of depth has been our problem, as well as boneheaded trades like a 4th and 6th for Tebow. Moore is much more of a sure thing than Mingo or Jordan (barring injury). Even the last time we made a significant trade up, Sanchez had question marks and flew up the boards at the last minute. Different situation.

    It is not like our roster is barren of talent, we have some pieces our issue is the cap. In order to stay under, we are going to have to take on a lot of UFDA's anyway, so what is one more. The expectations for 2013 are low, we really need to look at 2014.

    If the right moves are made, we could have over $40 million (after resigning Revis) in cap space for 2014, which will be more than enough to make up for that second round player you gave up drafting this year to get Moore. Just because we are in cap hell this year and need players, does not mean we still can't make 1 big move. No way are we going to get all the players we need on our current budget, but outside of the draft we surely can not get an impact player like Moore due to those limitations.

    In response to your comments about Warmack, he grades out as a very good pass blocker as well as run blocker:

    In pass protection, Warmack does a nice job of supplying an initial punch and grasping hold of his opponent, showing good lateral agility to slide as well as the anchor to handle powerful bull-rushers.

    Furthermore, Slauson can play both guard postions, he actually switched from RG to LG in the Pro's. His senior season at Nebraska he started all 13 games are RG. I doubt it would be an issue for him to switch back, especially since the entire line is most likely going to have to learn new schemes for Mornhinwegs system.

    So essentially taking Warmack completes the line if Austin Howard shows more improvement this year and as we know, the game is won in the trenches.

    D'brick, Warmack, Mangold, Slauson, Howard sounds pretty good to me. I think we'll go back to having an elite line. Just because we are running the West Coast, doesn't mean we won't be running the ball. You have to run the ball to win, maybe not the extent of rex's ground and pound, but look at the 2 superbowl teams. Both can run and pass. They have balance. However it starts upfront with both teams. Their lines are nasty.

    I forget to address Decastro, but my feeling on that is we can't ultimately comment on him until he plays. I don't think its fair to judge him on the fact he got injured, but for what its worth I still believe had he played I think he would have had a great year.
    Last edited by NYJetsfan69; 01-23-2013 at 12:01 AM.

  11. #506
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrX27 View Post
    It's doubtful any of the people saying they don't want him have actually seen him play much.

    Mingo was so disruptive last year that this year they doubled him continually, and he still made plays in the backfield.

    I'm beginning to think that Mingo doesn't make it to 9, especially after he runs the combine.
    I agree with everything you said. It seems like a lot of people look at the stat sheet to determine how good a player is. I also am starting to think that Mingo will be picked at either 3 or 6. Oakland loves physical specimens (granted Al Davis is no longer around) and Cleveland seems to be switching to a 3-4 defense.

  12. #507
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    yes i agree mingo will rise too but if moore, mingo, and werner go in the first 8 do we take jones with #9 with his spinal condition. that **** scares me

  13. #508
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAVEMAN5 View Post
    yes i agree mingo will rise too but if moore, mingo, and werner go in the first 8 do we take jones with #9 with his spinal condition. that **** scares me
    JJones will be tested up the wazoo before the draft.

    If he's available at 9 and the Jets feel comfortable taking him, then we know the calibre player we'd be getting, the question is how long will his career be.

    Here's a good read about it.
    <link>


  14. #509
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrX27 View Post
    JJones will be tested up the wazoo before the draft.

    If he's available at 9 and the Jets feel comfortable taking him, then we know the calibre player we'd be getting, the question is how long will his career be.

    Here's a good read about it.
    <link>
    Great link! But after reading it, im now afraid to draft him. If he is only a big hit away from being permanantly sidelined im not sure thats worth a top 10 pick. Why would you want a guy who might only be available for 4-6 years (per article) So now it makes me think we should stay away from him. Could he be a star? Yes, but there will always be the spinal cord that everyone thinks about. This injury ends carrers, its not like hes just battling through pain.

  15. #510
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYJetsfan69 View Post
    The 4th pick is worth 1800 points. The 9th and 41st are worth 1840. If thats all it will cost for Moore, I would do it in a heartbeat. This draft does not have the same number of impact players as last years draft. The 2012 draft has been touted as one of those drafts that comes along once every couple decades. We can't bank on the same talent being available at the same picks. We are already having issues finding someone to take at 9 as where last year, you had a plethora of options.

    I don't know. If we could get the top RT prospect in addition to a Mingo, Jordan or Jones I think it would do wonders for the team. Fluker would be a great asset at RT (if available). I'm just one of the few who think Slauson is fine and Ducasse, Schlauderaff or a draft pick can handle RG duties. I get your point that the team isn't completely depleted but still believe we need some key positions filled/upgraded.

    In most years, post round 2 you are looking for contributors and depth that can develop into starters. Sometimes you get lucky and find a starter in round 3 and later, but not every pick is Rusell Wilson. You are looking for quality depth that can develop. The drafting of depth has been our problem, as well as boneheaded trades like a 4th and 6th for Tebow. Moore is much more of a sure thing than Mingo or Jordan (barring injury). Even the last time we made a significant trade up, Sanchez had question marks and flew up the boards at the last minute. Different situation.

    This may be true and the Jets historically (under Tanny) have locked in on a player. This paid off with Revis. Will this be Idzik's approach? BTW, don't you think Tebow's stock has risen as a viable backup to the wildly successful read-option offenses?

    It is not like our roster is barren of talent, we have some pieces our issue is the cap. In order to stay under, we are going to have to take on a lot of UFDA's anyway, so what is one more. The expectations for 2013 are low, we really need to look at 2014.

    The expectation bar kind of contradicts your assessment of the roster talent. I'm not going to agree to sacrifice next year to accomodate a 2-year plan. I understand that not every position can be addressed (and won't) but this doesn't negate the effort to be as competitive as possible next year. This is what a GM must do - look at short-term and long-term. That's why coaches never make good GM's.

    If the right moves are made, we could have over $40 million (after resigning Revis) in cap space for 2014, which will be more than enough to make up for that second round player you gave up drafting this year to get Moore. Just because we are in cap hell this year and need players, does not mean we still can't make 1 big move. No way are we going to get all the players we need on our current budget, but outside of the draft we surely can not get an impact player like Moore due to those limitations.

    If the Jets feel this guy is that good (and I don't doubt it) with 80+ tackles for the primary pass rusher then I'm on board. I don't know anything of his coverage skills if he even has that ability but if he's in the mold of a Von Miller, then the value exceeds the 2nd round pick thrown in.

    In response to your comments about Warmack, he grades out as a very good pass blocker as well as run blocker:

    In pass protection, Warmack does a nice job of supplying an initial punch and grasping hold of his opponent, showing good lateral agility to slide as well as the anchor to handle powerful bull-rushers.

    Furthermore, Slauson can play both guard postions, he actually switched from RG to LG in the Pro's. His senior season at Nebraska he started all 13 games are RG. I doubt it would be an issue for him to switch back, especially since the entire line is most likely going to have to learn new schemes for Mornhinwegs system.

    So essentially taking Warmack completes the line if Austin Howard shows more improvement this year and as we know, the game is won in the trenches.

    D'brick, Warmack, Mangold, Slauson, Howard sounds pretty good to me. I think we'll go back to having an elite line. Just because we are running the West Coast, doesn't mean we won't be running the ball. You have to run the ball to win, maybe not the extent of rex's ground and pound, but look at the 2 superbowl teams. Both can run and pass. They have balance. However it starts upfront with both teams. Their lines are nasty.

    I forget to address Decastro, but my feeling on that is we can't ultimately comment on him until he plays. I don't think its fair to judge him on the fact he got injured, but for what its worth I still believe had he played I think he would have had a great year.
    I was commenting on DeCastro before he was hurt - he was struggling. Anyone can get hurt.

    I hear the justifications for Warmack but I simply don't agree especially when we can sign a good young guard who's played the position well since being drafted. That could all change if we cannot or will not extend him but for now, I can't fathom selecting a guard in the top 10. If he was a building block to build around, yes. But we have two pillars of strength around that position. IMO, it's not a viable way of building a team that has a lot of needs and depth deficiencies.

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