Best leagues in Europe discussion

[NYKalltheway]

I'm a bit blank at the moment for an opening post, but you get the point.

I personally prefer the Serie A and Bundesliga to all leagues, while I find the La Liga the best in overall quality. I find the Premier League ridiculous and feel it has the lowest quality of football outside the top 6 leagues (Spanish, Italian, German, English, French, Portuguese)

Also Greek league is unwatchable as it's the most corrupted league in the world by far where 14 out of 16 teams are there just to benefit one team (Olympiakos). So we have the future champion, who is known 3 years before the league begins, playing 28 friendlies out of 30 fixtures and in case they suck too much the refs make sure they win Undefeated championship for 2012-13 season and I've known it since October 2011 ffs


I watch Panathinaikos in Greece, random Bundesliga games, random La Liga games, lots of Serie A (and all highlights) and an occassional Premier League game if I'm at a pub on a Saturday or actually attend a game*.


* I'm on a mission to visit all London grounds on a matchday, halfway there Including lower leagues.


Be sure to state with honesty which leagues you watch in your argument. AND BE SURE TO HAVE AN ARGUMENT AND NOT JUST A STATEMENT!

[OrangeCrush]

For me, the Italian Serie A is by far the most enjoyable to watch. Great atmosphere, fans, tradition, culture and it is the most tactical of the major leagues. Also it's producing some good young players.

La Liga is probably the most elite in terms of 'star players', but there's not much parity between sides. Still, it's the most prestigious to watch.

EPL has some quality teams but the atmosphere is lacking, and I personally don't enjoy 'kick and run' football.

The Brazilian leagues are also very good to watch. Great football and a very even level. A team could win the league one year and get relegated the next. Also, Brazilian clubs are improving their finances a lot so it won't be long before they keep all their talented youngsters and even import stars from Europe.

So for me, right now it's 1) Italian Serie A, 2) La Liga Spain, 3) EPL, 4) The Brasileiro and 5) Bundesliga.

[Foye]

For me, the Italian Serie A is by far the most enjoyable to watch. Great atmosphere, fans, tradition, culture and it is the most tactical of the major leagues. Also it's producing some good young players.

La Liga is probably the most elite in terms of 'star players', but there's not much parity between sides. Still, it's the most prestigious to watch.

EPL has some quality teams but the atmosphere is lacking, and I personally don't enjoy 'kick and run' football.

The Brazilian leagues are also very good to watch. Great football and a very even level. A team could win the league one year and get relegated the next. Also, Brazilian clubs are improving their finances a lot so it won't be long before they keep all their talented youngsters and even import stars from Europe.

So for me, right now it's 1) Italian Serie A, 2) La Liga Spain, 3) EPL, 4) The Brasileiro and 5) Bundesliga.

Great atmosphere in the Serie A?

Like in that game were only 1 away fan showed up? I lol'ed.

[NYKalltheway]

Great atmosphere in the Serie A?

Like in that game were only 1 away fan showed up? I lol'ed.

do you even know why that happened?

[O_T-1]

My favorite league is the premier league.

I love the intensity of the games!


About my country, Portugal, We we had the financial capacity we would become one of the best leagues in the world.
Why?

- We are crazy about soccer. Every kid in school wants to be a soccer player
- We have new and good stadiums
- We are, geograycaly speaking, the best european door for south american players
- We have the best scouts in the world (you can debate that but its my opinion)


We just miss the money to keep our best players!

We also have an not normall capacity to rebuilt our teams. Look at Porto... each year they sell their best players and they still have a strong team!

In facto this year they will win the champions league

[homie564]

My favorite league is the premier league.

I love the intensity of the games!


About my country, Portugal, We we had the financial capacity we would become one of the best leagues in the world.
Why?

- We are crazy about soccer. Every kid in school wants to be a soccer player
- We have new and good stadiums
- We are, geograycaly speaking, the best european door for south american players
- We have the best scouts in the world (you can debate that but its my opinion)


We just miss the money to keep our best players!

We also have an not normall capacity to rebuilt our teams. Look at Porto... each year they sell their best players and they still have a strong team!

In facto this year they will win the champions league

not sure that's really debateable lol. Sporting has the best schools in the world without a doubt (Ronaldo, Nani, Figo, Simao, Moutinho, etc. etc.) Benfica produced world class talents (Gomes, Rui Costa, etc. etc.) Porto (Deco, Pepe, etc. etc). Not to mention teams like Benfica and Porto continuously sell their best players like you said and are ALWAYS competitive. Portugal needs to open their doors to private ownership. It would create another world of competition coming through a league with great historical players to allow to keep their best talents and open up some interesting european play.

[homie564]

Superliga is honestly better than the Brasileirao. Brazillian football is honestly like watching a high class MLS game lol. Always back and forth, back and forth, back and forth lol. Portugal has finally gotten real competition now, and will be even better when Sporting stops being terrible lol. Braga, Maritimo, Academica, Rio Ave, etc. are all rising teams too.

[HoopsDrive]

Superliga is honestly better than the Brasileirao. Brazillian football is honestly like watching a high class MLS game lol. Always back and forth, back and forth, back and forth lol. Portugal has finally gotten real competition now, and will be even better when Sporting stops being terrible lol. Braga, Maritimo, Academica, Rio Ave, etc. are all rising teams too.

nah, Primeira Liga only has Benfica and Porto as real teams, Braga is basically your average Brazilian team in the Paulista or Carioca. Brasileirao has about 8 teams that can compete for the title in a given year, it's parity heaven. Brasileirao's top to bottom league strength is second to none, the only league where a traditional side like Palmeiras can get relegated with a decent squad AND qualify for the major continental competition at the same time . it would be like having Man Utd, Real or Bayern relegated and appearing in the UCL, you just won't see that happening, but not in the Brasileirao

[Corndog]

My favorite league to watch is EPL, but it is the most available here in America. I really enjoy the Bundesliga and I think it's the best set up league. Many of your points about it really illustrate why I enjoy it so much. It's competitive, fun to watch and the crowds are amazing.

I do agree there are alot of problems with EPL, not so much in the foreign players(it's a global brand, so that is some what understandable), but the foreign owners. I also think the transfer spending is nothing short of ridiculous and irresponsible.

But it is a fairly competitive league, despite the lack of different champions. Atleast the lower teams can occasionally beat the top three teams. Even though I can't stand Man U(mainly due to their bandwagon fans),alot of their games are fun to watch because they can have alot of closer games. There is definitely a lack of defense in the league, but sometimes that makes things more interesting for me. Whereas in La Liga, no one is beating Barcelona. The Madrids are the only teams that can even compete and even they can't beat Barcelona and pretty much beat up the rest of the league. While I appreciate Barcelona's greatness, I rather watch them play in the Champions League where they have closer competition.

As far as Series A, I haven't really watched it much, but I will give it a chance.

[homie564]

nah, Primeira Liga only has Benfica and Porto as real teams, Braga is basically your average Brazilian team in the Paulista or Carioca. Brasileirao has about 8 teams that can compete for the title in a given year, it's parity heaven. Brasileirao's top to bottom league strength is second to none, the only league where a traditional side like Palmeiras can get relegated with a decent squad AND qualify for the major continental competition at the same time . it would be like having Man Utd, Real or Bayern relegated and appearing in the UCL, you just won't see that happening, but not in the Brasileirao

You make a good point with that relegation. In portugal Sporting completely fell off this year, but you can't expect them to be this bad for much longer. Braga is above an average team I think. They can easily compete with the big guys. Then like I said teams like Maritimo, Rio Ave, Academica, etc are pretty good teams that have up and down years like many Brazillian teams as well. I was mostly talking about the game quality though, portugal actually have very good quality. I personally hate Serie A, Italian soccer has to be the most boring soccer in the world . French is pretty bad too.

[alencp3]

EPL is the most enjoyable to me... i cant stand Serie A... and in La Liga no one outside Barca, Real, Atletico and Malaga is really worth watching. Bundes is also fun but it lacks in quality. French league is Ibra's *****

[hizpcstr]

EPL is the most enjoyable to me... i cant stand Serie A... and in La Liga no one outside Barca, Real, Atletico and Malaga is really worth watching. Bundes is also fun but it lacks in quality. French league is Ibra's *****

Zlatan do you anything about the french league? "no, but they know about me"

[UKBronco58]

The Premier League is by far the most enjoyable to me. Maybe because I've been brought up watching it but I much prefer fast paced football. Arsenal of the early 2000s being a prime example.

I admire the way teams like Barcelona play, I just don't find it particularly entertaining.

I probably watch La Liga more than the other leagues as we get decent coverage here but I'm a big fan of the Bundesliga.

[NYKalltheway]

A bit of analysis on the top leagues.

Continental cup statistics

Last 20 years(1992-93)

Champions League winners: Spain 6, Italy 5, England 4, Germany 2, France 1, Netherlands 1, Portugal 1
UEFA Cup winners: Italy 5, Spain 5, Germany 2, Portugal 2, Russia 2, England 1, Netherlands 1, Turkey 1, Ukraine 1
Cup Winners Cup winners: England 2, Italy 2, Spain 2, France 1, Germany 1

Champions League finalists: Italy 6, England 5, Germany 4, Spain 3, France 1, Netherlands 1
UEFA Cup finalists: England 3, France 3, Germany 3, Italy 3, Spain 3, Portugal 2, Scotland 2, Austria 1
Cup Winners Cup finalists: France 2, Austria 1, Belgium 1, England 1, Germany 1, Italy 1, Spain 1

Spain 13 wins
Italy 12 wins
England 7
Germany 5 wins
Portugal 3 wins
France 2 wins
Netherlands 2 wins
Russia 2 wins
Turkey 1 win
Ukraine 1 win


Last 10 years(2002-03)

Champions League winners: England 3, Italy 3, Spain 3, Portugal 1
UEFA Cup winners: Spain 5, Portugal 2, Russia 2, Ukraine 1

Champions League finalists: England 5, Germany 2, Italy 2, France 1
UEFA Cup finalists: England 2, Portugal 2, Scotland 2, Spain 2, France 1, Germany 1

Spain 8 wins
England 3 wins
Italy 3 wins
Portugal 3 wins
Russia 2 wins
Ukraine 1 win



Last 5 years(2007-08)

Champions League winners: England 2, Spain 2, Italy 1
UEFA Cup winners: Spain 2, Portugal 1, Russia 1, Ukraine 1

Champions League finalists: England 3, Germany 2
UEFA Cup finalists: England 1, Germany 1, Portugal 1, Scotland 1, Spain 1


Spain 4 wins
England 2 wins
Italy 1 win
Portugal 1 win
Russia 1 win
Ukraine 1 win



La Liga

Positives:
- Very good teams until mid-table positions
- Relatively good pace combined with technique
- Top class midfieliders
- You can watch the two best teams in the world
- Decent atmosphere, mainly in smaller teams' grounds
- Successful teams in continental cups
- Cultural rivalries (Basque, Catalan, Castillan, Galician, Andalucian etc)
- Decent priced tickets
- Most owners are fans of the team.



Negatives:
- Historically has poor competition. Only a handful have won it with Real Madrid and Barcelona dominating almost forever
- Lots of (young) players die due to organ failures or are diagnoses with such issues, which leads to enhancement drug abuse assumptions
- Atmosphere is below average in big games
- Defenses are sub-par
- Real Madrid and Barcelona can dominate very easily in some occasions.
- Very top heavy league


Premier League

Positives:
- Fast paced football
- Stadiums are filled (over 90% attendance-capacity relation)
- Great TV broadcast
- At least 6 teams that have star players
- Good rivalries
- Excellent marketing


Negatives:
- Kick and run style. Painful to watch if you love the sport as midfield is unused in many occasions. Lack of tactical play.
- Horrid tackles that have no place in the game are often allowed. Overly physical game
- Atmosphere below par given attendance figures
- Too many foreigners
- Overrated players and arrogance (the self-acclaimed "best league in the world")
- Top heavy league
- Often has ridiculously one sided results (5-6-7-8 goal margin)
- Defenses are sub-par
- Very expensive tickets
- Most owners are foreign and generally too much foreign money flowing which makes the league more like a business.


Serie A

Positives:
- Very detailed game, tactics are emphasized which adds a beauty to the game
- Each team has its own identity in terms of style play.
- At least 3-4 "wow" goals every month that would make goal of the season in most leagues
- Great rivalries
- Top level defenses
- Excellent competition throughout the league. The first relegation spot is often decided 2-3 matchdays before the end of the season and league is often decided in the last game.
- Amazing atmosphere in derbies and big games for small clubs
- Cheap tickets
- Owners/Chairmen are fans of their teams


Netagives:
- Relatively corrupted
- Stadiums are huge and attendance not satisfying
- Occasions of violence
- Many clubs on the verge of bankruptcy
- Badly marketed and underrated players
- Half the players are foreign
- Not enough star power
- Teams do not perform very well in Europe

Bundesliga

Positives:
- Fast paced game
- Very competitive throughout the league, one team can challenge for the title one year and next year might be fighting relegation
- Results are very hard to predict
- Most players are German
- Very cheap tickets
- Stadiums are almost always full
- Excellent atmosphere
- Fans own the teams. 50% + 1 rule
- Teams not allowed to go under (financially) in a season
- Excellent marketing

Negatives:
- Defenses below average
- League depends on one team's condition (Bayern Munich) which tends to dominate
- Star power almost non-existent besides Bayern Munich players.
- Underrated players
- Teams do not perform very well in Europe
- Fewer games than other top leagues


Goals scored this year

La Liga: 491 after 17 games - 28.88 per matchday - 24.55 per team

Premier League: 567 after 20 games - 28.35 per matchday - 28.35 per team

Serie A: 496 after 18 games - 27.55 per matchday - 24.8 per team

Bundesliga: 444 after 17 games - 26.11 per matchday - 24.67 per team

5+ margin wins and high scoring games(8+)

La Liga: Atletico Madrid-Deportivo 6-0, Mallorca-Real Madrid 0-5, Valladolid-Rayo 6-1 / Deportivo-Barcelona 4-5, Zaragoza-Deportivo 5-3

Premier League: Chelsea-Aston Vila 8-0, Arsenal-Southampton 6-1, Fulham-Norwich 5-0, Manchester City-Aston Vila 5-0, QPR-Swansea 0-5, / Arsenal-Newcastle 7-3

Serie A: Pescara-Juventus 1-6

Bundesliga: Bayern Munich-Stuttgart 6-1, Bayern Munich-Hanover 5-0, Dortmund-Gladbach 5-0 / Freiburg-Hoffenheim 5-3

[Pete Dahh Sneak]

You forgot Serie A and La Liga is filled with players who think they're on fire and are dying.