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Thread: Copeland

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enzo View Post
    Even if the Knicks wanted to move Novak, who would want him? He's being tremendously over paid in my opinion.
    Yeah, he is, still surprised at that 4th year being on there.

    But he was signed with house money.

    Lakers would do it for Jordan Hill, especially now that D'antoni is the coach.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kashmir13579 View Post
    IDK man i think Novak is better at making rotations.. They are both equally poor rebounders.
    Novak overall is a smart basketball player, even on D, hes just extremely overmatched physically on that end. He probably does cover his rotations better and generally knows where to be out there, but I think Cope is a little more physically imposing which benefits him because he and Novak are usually out there at the 4 spot. I think its safe to say they are both extremely poor on D.
    Last edited by D-Leethal; 12-30-2012 at 07:28 PM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backstabber View Post
    Best quote of the thread. No doubt you have to ask only whether Cope should take Novak's minutes, because when you look at both players rebounding and defense are a wash. Its likely Cope is a better rebounder and defender, than Novak.

    Offensively, Cope is enough of a sharp shooter from outside of 3pt range - that his offense is clearly better than Novak. This is hard to deny.

    If we say that Novak provides space for the offense, then if you don't respect Cope's range he's good enough to beat you. 50% from 3pt range. Plus he brings much more offensive versatility.

    We're all in love with Novak, but he's been proven for years to be a one trick pony. The best one trick pony in the league, but still a one trick pony. He's been that all of his career that's why he's had trouble getting on the court, prior to coming to the Knicks.

    We have a player (Cope) that gives us enough of Novak's skill set, but brings much more to us offensively. We just have to choose to use him.
    I agree. Its tough to gauge how important Novaks spacing really is. At this point I'd almost rather they helped off Cope so we can burn them for it than have them smother Novak and get a bunch of 3 pts 1 reb performances out of Novak.

    Novak is just way to easy to contain, he's barely going off on poor defensive teams anymore. Like Anji said, the opponents worst defender is capable of locking him down as long as he doesn't fall asleep.

    Right here and now, Cope is shooting better too even when left open.

  4. #34
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    Don't get me wrong I like having Novak on this roster, not sure we need to trade him, shooters that can shoot the blood out of the ball like he can belong on any roster, but right now we have a better option who can very possibly fill Novak's role better than Novak.

  5. #35
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    All Novak can do is shoot the three, no diss, but that's it.

    Even if not traded, he needs to see his minutes cut, Cope has been the better player this year.

    I really can't support how Novak's court presence keeps a man on him as a defense.

    Teams aren't even putting guys his size on him, any defender regardless of size prevents Novak from shooting.

    He isn't making the open shots as much either.

    Cope is gonna try to score when he has the ball, and if you can get it to him, he'll come get it.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Leethal View Post
    I agree. Its tough to gauge how important Novaks spacing really is. At this point I'd almost rather they helped off Cope so we can burn them for it than have them smother Novak and get a bunch of 3 pts 1 reb performances out of Novak.

    Novak is just way to easy to contain, he's barely going off on poor defensive teams anymore. Like Anji said, the opponents worst defender is capable of locking him down as long as he doesn't fall asleep.

    Right here and now, Cope is shooting better too even when left open.
    Exactly what I mean. Now knowing this, why would we want to be semi-dependent on Novak heading towards the playoffs. Teams like the Heat, Celtics and Bulls would make him totally ineffective. Having him on the floor for 20 minutes would kill us.

    Start to really develop Cope now in the 2nd third of the season, and get him ready for the playoffs. We have too much of an investment in Novak and he really is not going to reap the rewards.


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  7. #37
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    I say all this knowing Novak's effectiveness is limited without Melo or Amare on the floor. But really, he was still pretty ineffective in the playoffs, when we had both Melo and Amare. But no Kidd.

    I guess its like making a soup, if you throw in the right combination, Novak is extremely deadly. I just think Cope is safer.


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  8. #38
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    I can't wait till Novak hits 7 3's in a game and everyone jumps back on the Discount double check bandwagon.

    Novak presence opens up so many shots for JR and Kidd bc of the spacing.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony3124 View Post
    I can't wait till Novak hits 7 3's in a game and everyone jumps back on the Discount double check bandwagon.

    Novak presence opens up so many shots for JR and Kidd bc of the spacing.
    We all know how fans are, and yes when Novak has a game like you described people will go nuts as usual. The rational fans will say "Good job Novak, but you went 5-25 the 4 games before that".

    In regard to the spacing issue...We all agree that Novak opens up the floor because a defender needs to have a body on him at all times, but if Copeland keeps this up won't teams eventually do the same thing with him? Not to mention Copeland can create his own shot when a mans on him and Novak can't.
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony3124 View Post
    I can't wait till Novak hits 7 3's in a game and everyone jumps back on the Discount double check bandwagon.

    Novak presence opens up so many shots for JR and Kidd bc of the spacing.
    Novak should be responsible for pushing his game just like every other player on the Knicks. You can't consume 20 min on the floor, not play defense, not rebound; and be taken out of the game offensively.

    Dude, is super soft. Even his 3pt game is soft. Always pump fakes off the 3 when a defender closes out. Why not draw the foul, sometimes? It would definitely make him more effective, and maybe not so predictable of a player.

    His game is very limited. When he has an open shot, there is no player better in the game. No doubt he'll have another 7 3pter game, but will he have that game in the playoffs, because that's where our eyes should be.


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  11. #41
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    Yeah we should trade Copeland, and others, and get a good playmaking PG. I don't even want Felton to come back, guy started the seaosn well but was getting consistently worse all around. Guys shoots way too much and misses way too much


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  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enzo View Post
    We all know how fans are, and yes when Novak has a game like you described people will go nuts as usual. The rational fans will say "Good job Novak, but you went 5-25 the 4 games before that".

    In regard to the spacing issue...We all agree that Novak opens up the floor because a defender needs to have a body on him at all times, but if Copeland keeps this up won't teams eventually do the same thing with him? Not to mention Copeland can create his own shot when a mans on him and Novak can't.
    If they help Cope were getting him wide open 3s, the 3s Novak got last season when he surprised the league with his relatively consistent 3 point barrages.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kashmir13579 View Post
    Would we have to trade all that just for Nate?

    Anyways, what was it i heard about Nate being released from the Bulls?
    Not sure on contracts for these guys but when Amare and Shump gets back they wont play.

    I dont think Pablo can give us what we need when guys are out...that leaves us with an aging Kidd and a guard coming off an ACL injury. JR cant run the point. We need to get a little better...Ill take Nate over pablo and White.

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  14. #44
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    ^^^^^I don't know if he does or he doesn't but Pablo might have a no trade clause in his contract. I'm pretty sure that he just signed up for this one year to play with only the Knicks to scratch it off his bucket list.
    Last edited by Enzo; 12-31-2012 at 12:51 AM.
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  15. #45
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    For all those pointing to Cope's better all around offensive game, when we're at full strength, we''re not gonna need all that. I hope we're not gonna be relying on Cope manufacturing offense much longer, although he is darn good at it.

    What Novak has that Cope doesn't is the ability to shoot quick coming off screens and curls. Cope has been automatic on spot up catch-and-shoot jumpers or little freeze moves off the dribble, but Novak curling off a set play is more useful down the line IMO.

    We're short handed right now, so Cope is definitely a better option. But when it's a tight game later in the season and Woody draws up one of his patented out of bounds plays, it's more likely to involve Novak than Cope. (assuming Melo and co are healthy)

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