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  1. #1
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    Who Gains/Loses the Most if Advanced Stats Come 20 Years Ealier

    Sister thread from the baseball forum. Felt it was interesting enough to ask here.

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    Thats a good question but I would have to look a few names up. Off the top of my head Im thinking Charles Barkley would be looked at differently. Still its kind of hard to gauge when you dont know what public perception is anyways.
    Last edited by Chronz; 12-28-2012 at 09:35 PM.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

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    you stole my thread. that is all.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    you stole my thread. that is all.
    lol Didn't I say it was a thread from the baseball forum?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guppyfighter View Post
    lol Didn't I say it was a thread from the baseball forum?
    well good luck to you in generating more interest than the baseball one got (not much).
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  6. #6
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    loses the most - Iverson. in the light of advanced stats he looks an awful lot like Monta Ellis.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    loses the most - Iverson. in the light of advanced stats he looks an awful lot like Monta Ellis.
    The first and last years of Iverson's career were the only seasons of his entire career in which he posted a negative RAPM (ranked amoung the top 10 in SGs everyone of those years). Monta Ellis? He has done so every year of his career. Never a positive statistical player.

    Not a good comparison by any means. That's more of an "eye" comparison than a statistical.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swashcuff View Post
    The first and last years of Iverson's career were the only seasons of his entire career in which he posted a negative RAPM (ranked amoung the top 10 in SGs everyone of those years). Monta Ellis? He has done so every year of his career. Never a positive statistical player.

    Not a good comparison by any means.
    They both play the game for themselves first and foremost, and the statistics are awfully similar. i don't know which ones you are looking at. Not saying identical, but close. they both shoot (shot) at a low enough percentage to indicate they didn't seem to know they were hurting their teams by doing so.


    The biggest difference is the way basketball fans no longer embrace the notion of a solo gunslinger on the court. If you swapped the two of them in time Allen Iverson never becomes as big as star. A superstar? Sure. But not one that is revered the way Iverson was in the early 2000's. Ellis is a perfect example of how the attitudes in basketball have changed. He produces 90% of what Iverson did and gets the cold shoulder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swashcuff View Post
    That's more of an "eye" comparison than a statistical.
    you are talking to a guy who hasn't had tv in more than 6 years. the only times i've seen him play have been games against my raptors. this opinion is based on things other than the "eye".
    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 12-29-2012 at 10:31 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  9. #9
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    Who gains the most are obscure players. Who loses the most are a generation of fans that would've been basing their perception off stats instead of enjoying the game......


    BRIA MYLES.....SWAG!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Starks View Post
    Who loses the most are a generation of fans that would've been basing their perception off stats instead of enjoying the game......
    I don't get this statement.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Starks View Post
    Who gains the most are obscure players. Who loses the most are a generation of fans that would've been basing their perception off stats instead of enjoying the game......
    How so, my love for the game has only grown now that I understand it more.
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Starks View Post
    Who gains the most are obscure players. Who loses the most are a generation of fans that would've been basing their perception off stats instead of enjoying the game......
    I don't agree at all dude. If anything, I like the game even more since I started getting into advanced stats...

    If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    They both play the game for themselves first and foremost, and the statistics are awfully similar. i don't know which ones you are looking at. Not saying identical, but close. they both shoot (shot) at a low enough percentage to indicate they didn't seem to know they were hurting their teams by doing so.


    The biggest difference is the way basketball fans no longer embrace the notion of a solo gunslinger on the court. If you swapped the two of them in time Allen Iverson never becomes as big as star. A superstar? Sure. But not one that is revered the way Iverson was in the early 2000's. Ellis is a perfect example of how the attitudes in basketball have changed. He produces 90% of what Iverson did and gets the cold shoulder.



    you are talking to a guy who hasn't had tv in more than 6 years. the only times i've seen him play have been games against my raptors. this opinion is based on things other than the "eye".
    According to advanced stats that's completely ignorant. A.I.'s shooting never hurt his team as every single season in his NBA career he was a positive player in terms of his offensive statistical value. Even the later years. Monta on the other hand has statistically hurt his team in every season in the league and has been of negative statistical value every year. Anyone who thinks A.I.'s shooting hurt his team in more ways than it helped 1. never watched him player and 2. don't have an understanding of the advanced stats in which they are watching.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swashcuff View Post
    According to advanced stats that's completely ignorant. A.I.'s shooting never hurt his team as every single season in his NBA career he was a positive player in terms of his offensive statistical value. Even the later years. Monta on the other hand has statistically hurt his team in every season in the league and has been of negative statistical value every year. Anyone who thinks A.I.'s shooting hurt his team in more ways than it helped 1. never watched him player and 2. don't have an understanding of the advanced stats in which they are watching.

    Well there must be a lot of people on here that fit that description because one of the most popular PSD myths is that "AI was a overrated chucker."

    You know we have heard that from numerous posters for years.


    BRIA MYLES.....SWAG!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    loses the most - Iverson. in the light of advanced stats he looks an awful lot like Monta Ellis.
    LOL...... are you srs right now?


    2012 allstar

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