X-mas GT: New York Knicks (20-7) @ LA Lakers (13-14): Melo Doing LaLa twice tonight

[nycericanguy]

No I don't think Felton has been overly selfish.

For the most part he takes open shots, but if you're shooting like 33% over the past month or so, at some point you have to say "let me get something else going", or let me attack the basket and not avoid contact.

Felton goes 5-19 yesterday and scores 10 points

Westbrook goes 5-19 yesterday but scores 21.

He can still be an effective player even if he's shooting poorly, but he has to stop being so afraid of contact!

Its ironic people call him a "bulldog" and say he's so tough, yet he avoids contact at all costs.

Yet another PG who people call soft gets clobbered by Tyson CHandler and still immediately gets up and keeps attacking the basket and getting to the FT line.

[Stressindecade]

I don't think Kidd can play much PG anymore. He can't get into the paint and collapse the D. He's a great ball mover but we need penetration from our PG. As bad as Felton has been, hes the only guy we have in that regard or were going to be back to Mike Bibby style PG play. I didn't see Kidd make much of an impact in any way when he was the primary ball handler, and to be honest made some head scratching Felton-type plays down the stretch yesterday including throwing the ball away more than once and passing up a wide open three to tie the game late in the 4th just to throw it out of bounds.

Kidd not taking the open 3 did baffle the sh.. out of me bcause the team collapse after that play
I cant get upset with Kidd, because Kidd averaging 34 minutes at the SG position won us 20 games out of 28 games.

Howard, Gasol, Meta, Kobe, and Nash were not only suppose to get Tyson Chandler to foul out, but Tyson was suppose to be in foul trouble the first 6 minutes into the game if Lakers had a real NBA headcoach.

Certain things were confirm in the Xmas game vs Lakers ....

1) Dantoni is a BUM coach/Pau Gasol need to retire from NBA
2) Felton is a tier-2 PG with no creative moves for teammates to score

If our 28 games were a test toward a Starter/Finisher PG, Felton failed the test 15 games in the season .. the luxury of having 3 PG in our 28 game rotation save us from losing a lot of winning-games where we didnt have to depend soley on a tier-2 PG.

Raymond Felton has worked his way back into being traded on the February deadline .. was Portland coach wrong lastseason for taking Felton out of the starting lineup when Felton & his ex-teammate Gerald Wallace didnt click on either side of the court?

[D-Leethal]

No I don't think Felton has been overly selfish.

For the most part he takes open shots, but if you're shooting like 33% over the past month or so, at some point you have to say "let me get something else going", or let me attack the basket and not avoid contact.

Felton goes 5-19 yesterday and scores 10 points

Westbrook goes 5-19 yesterday but scores 21.

He can still be an effective player even if he's shooting poorly, but he has to stop being so afraid of contact!

Its ironic people call him a "bulldog" and say he's so tough, yet he avoids contact at all costs.

Yet another PG who people call soft gets clobbered by Tyson CHandler and still immediately gets up and keeps attacking the basket and getting to the FT line.

I agree with you here. Its on him to recognize the nights when the shot isn't going down and make positive plays elsewhere. I don't expect Woody to bench him or tell him not to shoot if his shots not going down - thats on him. Of course Woody is going to keep his confidence up and tell him to keep shooting when the shots present themselves.

I never thought Lin was soft per-se, his playing style definitely isn't soft, but he was playing 'shook' out there for a good chunk of this season and didn't even look like he wanted the ball to come this way. Sort of like Brewer looks right now. He has obviously snapped out of it and the whole Rockets team is playing like the best team in basketball the past week or 2.

[SB Nick]

You clearly understand basketball. Love reading post like this.

People might call me a Felton homer but I really don't see it as him being selfish. I think the team tells him he needs to be aggressive and take those shots. Even during the game last night, Felton missed the floater, you heard Melo say 'Don't float it like that!', Felton went, 'Don't shoot it?', and Melo said 'No, attack the gap THAN shoot it'....

The way Felton said 'Don't shoot it?' sounded more than willing to me to pass those shots up but that would be going against the game plan. Like a 'You don't want me to shoot, I won't shoot' type of thing.

I think the bail out shots he has to take when Melo is on the weakside late in the shotclock will go to Amare and hopefully Shump will take care of some of the penetration scoring duties so we don't have the displeasure of watching those floaters anymore.

IMO, people just seem to have some reverse logic when thinking of how a coach should handle a guy who's ice cold. They think the best way to treat a guy whos lacking confidence is to shatter his confidence even more, when the reality is, like Woody said, thats the time the player needs his coach to GIVE him more confidence and help him along the way, not kick the dude while hes down and compound the problem.

Coaches will rarely bench guys they trust and guys that have contributed to a #1 seed (#2 now) in the East for missing shots. Its going to take a lack of effort or a better replacement ala Shump > Brewer to get benched.

[Mbellz3o8]

No I don't think Felton has been overly selfish.

For the most part he takes open shots, but if you're shooting like 33% over the past month or so, at some point you have to say "let me get something else going", or let me attack the basket and not avoid contact.

Felton goes 5-19 yesterday and scores 10 points

Westbrook goes 5-19 yesterday but scores 21.

He can still be an effective player even if he's shooting poorly, but he has to stop being so afraid of contact!

Its ironic people call him a "bulldog" and say he's so tough, yet he avoids contact at all costs.

Yet another PG who people call soft gets clobbered by Tyson CHandler and still immediately gets up and keeps attacking the basket and getting to the FT line.

Who cares ? Last time I check did Lin play the knicks or play for the knicks yesterday ? No. Why does somebody have to bring him up in almost every single thread. Move on holy **** some fans are like that psycho ex girlfriend who just won't realize its over and will never happen anymore. We have RayRay for good and bad now deal with it. Don't mean to attack you or anything but every single damn thread almost has to mention Jeremy ****ing Lin... He left the knicks not the other way around. You want to talk about him and root for him go be a rockets fan.

[still a fan]

No I don't think Felton has been overly selfish.

For the most part he takes open shots, but if you're shooting like 33% over the past month or so, at some point you have to say "let me get something else going", or let me attack the basket and not avoid contact.

Felton goes 5-19 yesterday and scores 10 points

Westbrook goes 5-19 yesterday but scores 21.

He can still be an effective player even if he's shooting poorly, but he has to stop being so afraid of contact!

Its ironic people call him a "bulldog" and say he's so tough, yet he avoids contact at all costs.

Yet another PG who people call soft gets clobbered by Tyson CHandler and still immediately gets up and keeps attacking the basket and getting to the FT line.

Nice post till the end? Why go there? Any chance of that happening?
Your post had great insight in comparing guy's who shoot in quantities then you went into an area that cannot be given a mulligan?

The focus should be on what can be done, not what can't?

So that said, I think D-Leeth is misreading or not understanding what some are saying about accountability?

I don't want Felton benched and he says he can't bench Brewer but look at the minutes? What good is 8 min? To me thats a benching and if teams have now said okay whoever is playing brewer you wait for Melo and whoever is guarding Melo you rough him up and make it difficult.

so in those louzy 8 minutes that can cause a swing, right now you do sit the guy, and use Cope because you can't leave him open.

As far as Felton, I'm not a believer in a pg shooting 19 times a game, leave those for the Durant's and Melo's and Hardens. Westbrook gets away with it because he's utltra quick and gets to the line quite often and causes havoc.

Ray is our only penetrator, and I keep saying hold him accountable for playing more of a Rondo game rather than a westbrook game. I'm not saying you don't shoot wide open shots but their must be a happy medium to also getting Melo the ball the way Kidd seems to always do.

Kidd finds Melo and Ray hasn't figured that out yet, and when I say finds I mean in a shooting position. When Ray finds Melo its with a guy all over him and Melo goes Iso.

So let me say this, teams have figured out its Brewer first let him beat us then its Ray. Ray will be free get into the lane, why?

They won't leave Melo, they won't leave kidd anymore, and they won't leave novak and they are covering the Chandler lobs.

So now Rondo has figured out how to get to the line, how to finish and how to still get his teammates the ball in scoreing position.

Ray

[still a fan]

Just to finish, Ray has to figure this out.

Ray has one speed and you watch Rondo and Kidd and CP3 and Lin and others and they have different speeds maintaining their dribble, not its all out to the rim and hope.

I also still feel Ray will be fine when both Iman and amare return because anyone who watches the Knicks know both these guys can get shots.

And Sheed as well, I think him out hurts our PG play as well.

[Anji]

I don't like our pick and roll, People cry about Felton doing something else, but when we run our picks Felton is the only guy open lately.

It's fine when it works but if everybody is stays at home, it's basically a play ran for Felton. We need to use Melo/Jr Smith more in Feltons pick and rolls

[bofakop]

Our fans are doing the same thing...both about the refs and the jump off a building mentality after a tough road L.



You are just one of those guys that assume if the coach did something differently - what that something is who knows - things will work out for the better.
If he apparently coached us to 2-3 losses out of 8, I'm sure out of the 20 W's hes coaches us to more than 2-3 of those. Oh let me guess, Woody is only along for the ride during the W's but single handedly causes us our L's?

Brewer and Felton earned their time on the court by being a big part of our 20-8 start and they aren't going to be benched at the first extended stretch of poor play. Especially when Shump isn't back yet and like it or not, Felton is our only PG who can beat his man off the dribble and force the D to collapse the paint. When do you reinstate them then after benching? How long do you bench them for? You just bench them for a few days and throw them back in and see what happens a week later? What coach in this league does that?

Yea just because I don't see the coach directly leading to L's doesn't mean its not happening, I get that, just like you saying it doesn't mean its actually happening. Complaining after ever L about coaching decisions doesn't mean any other decision would have changed the outcome.

I didn't say were playing well these last 4 games, I said were still 2-2 despite it, and were 9-3 for the month before that during our toughest month. 11-5 for the toughest month of the entire schedule. You don't start benching guys or making drastic changes when your still pulling out W's at the tail end of a brutal month.

I get it though, you lose, blame the coach, thats what we do here.

Did you really just expect us to go cruise control at our 9-1 clip straight through the season with no bumps along the way? Does any team ever do that?

Do you even read my posts or are you arguing for the sake of arguing?? I have been saying all along I like Felton..HE NEEDS TO SIT TO GET HEALTHY NOT BENCH HIM!!

We can Start Kidd or Prigs at PG for a few games...til he recovers.. and no neither penetrate..but JR does, and he is playing major minutes, so use him to do that..we are in this for the long haul..Woodson has to step up and tell Felton to sit for a few games..cause Felton is not the type of player to sit on his own...THATS WHAT COACHES NEED TO DO!!

and what the H@$% are you talking about in the bolded statement above??
I have been saying for a while ..During wins and losses ..Brewer is doing nothing for us on either side of the ball right now put someone out there that will at least get respect from the D and Felton needs to sit to get healthy. Is that so hard to understand????

Am I wrong?? apparently Woodson is finally starting to see what a bunch of us have been seeing for a while..Brewers Minutes finally starting to go way down..why play him at all if he is not helping the team? ..What took him so long?

You constantly talk about ruining the chemistry of the team..by making a change...Really?? The Chemistry has changed already..you think Melo has any confidence passing the ball to Brewer right now??(sound familiar?) Where is the ball movement we had earlier this season??

Good coaches make adjustments....thats what they do when a team is struggling..but Woodson..is doing the reverse...playing guys that are struggling ..major minutes??? We are what 6-4 last 10 games allowing over 100 PPG? Is that what this team was built to do???

Who cares if Brewer gets his feelings hurt??? If he was healthy playing his typical Defense you put up with it..BUT HE IS NOT...sit him down ..he is not one of your stars.. He is a role player failing at his role right now!!!

Hahn wrote this about Felton http://t.co/zJEHhPZr Hmmmmm

[javaid64]

Well the stats don't lie, In term of PG he is very poor, not only doesn't he make his shots, he doesn't pass much and is way to over utilized.


He is 4th among usage for PG which is wayyy to high.....60 PG shoot a better TS% which is disgusting, 45 PG pass more often than he does...He hasnt displayed anything is way of saying he is better than LIN......the only reason his PER is higher than lins is his usage inflates his STATS....

[still a fan]

I don't like our pick and roll, People cry about Felton doing something else, but when we run our picks Felton is the only guy open lately.

It's fine when it works but if everybody is stays at home, it's basically a play ran for Felton. We need to use Melo/Jr Smith more in Feltons pick and rolls

yep anji, you got his dead on,

this is the NBA and the pick and roll must be used, but it doesn't have to be Ray all the time.

I see melo once in awhile and it works, do it more than simple ISO's that have a second and third guy there ready to clobber him.

Help Melo, lets not always make him do it himself, run the pick and roll with him and Chandler, if they cover Chandler damn you want Melo wide open?

Use JR the way he is playing lately more and take the ball from Ray.

Yes Ray is our best pg at getting to the rim but we do have other guys that can get to the rim and hit open jumpers.

[D-Leethal]

I don't like our pick and roll, People cry about Felton doing something else, but when we run our picks Felton is the only guy open lately.

It's fine when it works but if everybody is stays at home, it's basically a play ran for Felton. We need to use Melo/Jr Smith more in Feltons pick and rolls

This is pretty spot on and pretty much what I get at when I try to say the D forces Felton to shoot. Tyson can only really catch the ball at the rim and score. If he needs to beat 1 guy before scoring he can't do it, if he has to put the ball on the floor for one dribble or a spin move or a drop step to beat his man he can't do it. So teams are falling way back to the basket off the screen - both defenders - to force Felton to make a play in the lane - either float it up over the defense or pull up off the dribble from 12-15 feet - and completely shutting down Tyson on the roll.

Doing this with only 2 defenders - the guy guarding Felton and the guy guarding Tyson - allows them to completely stay home on our 3 point shooters. The ball movement leads nowhere and the only open shot as a result is Felton in the lane/mid range area. Thats exactly what Noah said when he said their game plan: 'Stay home on their shooters and make Ray Felton beat us'.

Its even tougher when they have a guy like Metta who you can live with guarding Melo 1v1. There are about 2 of those dudes in this league.

[D-Leethal]

Do you even read my posts or are you arguing for the sake of arguing?? I have been saying all along I like Felton..HE NEEDS TO SIT TO GET HEALTHY NOT BENCH HIM!!

We can Start Kidd or Prigs at PG for a few games...til he recovers.. and no neither penetrate..but JR does, and he is playing major minutes, so use him to do that..we are in this for the long haul..Woodson has to step up and tell Felton to sit for a few games..cause Felton is not the type of player to sit on his own...THATS WHAT COACHES NEED TO DO!!

and what the H@$% are you talking about in the bolded statement above??
I have been saying for a while ..During wins and losses ..Brewer is doing nothing for us on either side of the ball right now put someone out there that will at least get respect from the D and Felton needs to sit to get healthy. Is that so hard to understand????

Am I wrong?? apparently Woodson is finally starting to see what a bunch of us have been seeing for a while..Brewers Minutes finally starting to go way down..why play him at all if he is not helping the team? ..What took him so long?

You constantly talk about ruining the chemistry of the team..by making a change...Really?? The Chemistry has changed already..you think Melo has any confidence passing the ball to Brewer right now??(sound familiar?) Where is the ball movement we had earlier this season??

Good coaches make adjustments....thats what they do when a team is struggling..but Woodson..is doing the reverse...playing guys that are struggling ..major minutes??? We are what 6-4 last 10 games allowing over 100 PPG? Is that what this team was built to do???

Who cares if Brewer gets his feelings hurt??? If he was healthy playing his typical Defense you put up with it..BUT HE IS NOT...sit him down ..he is not one of your stars.. He is a role player failing at his role right now!!!

Hahn wrote this about Felton http://t.co/zJEHhPZr Hmmmmm

You are nitpicking and getting way too worked up over it. Chill b. Woody is frontrunner for COY right now.

[bofakop]

You are nitpicking and getting way too worked up over it. Chill b. Woody is frontrunner for COY right now.

Why..because I don't agree with you...? Do we have to be happy because we have a good record .. there is always room for improvement, and if I feel that the Coach is making mistakes with his IN GAME coaching.. I sure have a right to my opinion on a Knick discussion board

I am not worked up at all.. Just stating things that I would think would be obvious to your COY Candidate....

He is not mine at this point... to me right now that award would go to a former Knick Player ....or even Hollins

[D-Leethal]

Why..because I don't agree with you...? Do we have to be happy because we have a good record .. there is always room for improvement, and if I feel that the Coach is making mistakes with his IN GAME coaching.. I sure have a right to my opinion on a Knick discussion board

I am not worked up at all.. Just stating things that I would think would be obvious to your COY Candidate....

He is not mine at this point... to me right now that award would go to a former Knick Player ....or even Hollins

Never once said you didn't have a right to your opinion? All I did was give my opinion that your opinion is the typical overreaction to a loss we see after every L on this board. Woodson has been the best coach since Van Gundy for us. Our record with him is second to only Popovich over that time frame. Lets not act like his incompetence is out there losing us games on the reg is all I'm saying. I expect everyone to nitpick and microanalyze his decisions after L's at this point. Thats what we do here.