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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickdymez View Post
    Im gonna make up stupid *** stat that changes every year.. lmfao. What a joke that some of you people have ruined your basketball watching lives living and dying by these advanced stats.

    Chill dude. It doesn't just "change every year." It adjusts for each year for the different rules and style of game incorporated. If a certain year favored more up tempo pace and less defense that caused most players PPG to rise (and other stats), PER would adjust by making sure that the average player is always 15.0 PER. I think you misread that comment
    I survived Stephon Marbury's inability
    Jason Kidd, Kenyon Martin, Richard Jefferson era
    I survived them all leaving, a 12-70 season and not getting the #1 pick
    Mikhail Prokhorov buys the Nets
    I survived Melodrama
    Deron Williams traded here
    I survived 248 games missed due to injury, 5 d-league call-ups, 14 different lineups in ONE season, Johan Petro
    I survived Dwightmare
    I survived Avery & PJC's rotations
    THE Offseason - Success TBD

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by amos1er View Post
    Looks like 11 time coaching champion Phil Jackson (Greatest Coach of All-Time) doesn't place much value on PER.

    If you go to the 44 second mark of the video, Phil states that he believes more in product that he can see, feel, touch, and watch run up and down the court rather than in numbers and statistics.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBZb_X5qjMg

    How can you all argue against perhaps the greatest basketball mind in history?
    The way I did when you tried this last time. By going by what the Spurs do, and combining EVERYTHING
    Yo Kobe, get at me bro, we'd have a good time, man

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minimal View Post
    PER is a great stat that shows how good the player is. Guys like McGee play great basketball unfortunately they don't play too much to be considered elite players, but they but up great stats for the time given.
    McGee and his PER are a good example of why stats are useful but can not be used while ignoring a persons own eyes. The guy makes some great plays and some really questionable plays. If his play was really at the level his PER implies he would be starting and playing 35-40 minutes a night. Hopefully one day his game will mature to this level.

  4. #64
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    PER is only valuable if the player is playing full minutes

  5. #65
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    I sure as hell am not sitting around talking about PER and advanced stats, at a bar, while watching the game.

    How sad would that be?


    The Knicks are back!

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Federal Reserve View Post
    This PER list also accurately displays (indirectly) just how much of an inefficient chucker Kobe Bryant really is.
    Not it doesn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by SLY WILLIAMS View Post
    McGee and his PER are a good example of why stats are useful but can not be used while ignoring a persons own eyes. The guy makes some great plays and some really questionable plays. If his play was really at the level his PER implies he would be starting and playing 35-40 minutes a night. Hopefully one day his game will mature to this level.
    Not to be a jerk or anything right, but honestly who does that? (look solely at stats). Most advanced stat users on this board tend to watch a ton of games anyways. We learned about advanced metrics because of our LOVE for the game not to take away from it. Carmelo was my fav player before and after I learnt about APBR metrics. Also if you look at the effect McGee has on his teammates stats when he's on the floor then you can see that he has a negative impact on his teammates.


    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Shoot I'd even put up Glen Rice and Mitch Richmond in their prime at or slightly better than James. Even Glenn Robinson who is a forgotten beast.


    Quote Originally Posted by LoveMeOrHateMe View Post
    Kobe GOAT LOL
    ^Finally got one.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghettosean View Post
    Sorry did you mean NBA all time records as in the best in history of the game of basketball is that what you meant

    You only prove the point that PER is a useless stat if Wade retired today he would be more effecient than Kareem in his career.



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_efficiency_rating

    Are you embarassed enough yet young one... LOL. Seriously the creator of PER admits that it's not accurate to many degrees. What makes you know more than him?!? Seriously tell me I can't wait to here your D-Wade fantasies some more...

    Stop this you are not making yourself look any better.
    You truly define ignorance. I'm not defending PER as a stat, or D Wade as a player. You sound so arrogant when you talk, yet it is you just spewing pure ignorance making yourself look dumb.

  8. #68
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    Do people not understand that using Career PER is the wrong way to use the stat?

    If you wanna compare a players best 5 years to another players best 5 years using PER or comparing Peak to Peak or even best 10 years is 100x more reasonable then using Career PER.

    Wade for example is not better then Kareem going by PER like some are ignorantly implying when trying to discredit the stat.

    #5.
    Kareem : Post Season - PER


    Peak : 32.4
    Top 5 : 28.4
    Top 7 : 26.5
    Top 10 : 26.5

    ------------------------------------------------------------

    #9.
    Wade : Post Season - PER


    Peak : 29.4
    Top 5 : 26.64
    Top 7 : 25
    PER is a fantastic stat at times and it has many uses.
    Obviously its not perfect and people can misuse it.
    Last edited by Andrew32; 12-25-2012 at 03:08 AM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew32 View Post
    Do people not understand that using Career PER is the wrong way to use the stat?

    If you wanna compare a players best 5 years to another players best 5 years using PER or comparing Peak to Peak or even best 10 years is 100x more reasonable then using Career PER.

    Wade for example is not better then Kareem going by PER like some are ignorantly implying when trying to discredit the stat.



    PER is a fantastic stat at times and it has many uses.
    Obviously its not perfect and people can misuse it.
    According to some of these guys, career PER is the absolute end all say all stat for career rankings. They just look past all reasonable arguments, and say as little as a .05 difference is concrete evidence that the player is better.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by ModernDaySavage View Post
    According to some of these guys, career PER is the absolute end all say all stat for career rankings.
    Those people don't understand the stat or say it purposely to try and discredit it.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew32 View Post
    Do people not understand that using Career PER is the wrong way to use the stat?

    If you wanna compare a players best 5 years to another players best 5 years using PER or comparing Peak to Peak or even best 10 years is 100x more reasonable then using Career PER.

    Wade for example is not better then Kareem going by PER like some are ignorantly implying when trying to discredit the stat.



    PER is a fantastic stat at times and it has many uses.
    Obviously its not perfect and people can misuse it.
    Hahaha, served em there!!

  12. #72
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    Great post Andrew.

    Also PER and "efficiency" are NOT the same thing.


    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Shoot I'd even put up Glen Rice and Mitch Richmond in their prime at or slightly better than James. Even Glenn Robinson who is a forgotten beast.


    Quote Originally Posted by LoveMeOrHateMe View Post
    Kobe GOAT LOL
    ^Finally got one.

  13. #73
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    I take it a little more seriously than win shares.

  14. #74
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    The majority people who dislike PER are those who have no clue what it represents. Because Player X has a higher PER than player Y does not make him a better player it means he has a higher player efficiency rating. Simple as that. Now read up on what it is and see how many examples you can get of players who have good PERs and players who have not so good PERs. Does PPG tell you who is a better player? How about RPG? So why on earth do you guys think PER should?

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by ModernDaySavage View Post
    According to some of these guys, career PER is the absolute end all say all stat for career rankings. They just look past all reasonable arguments, and say as little as a .05 difference is concrete evidence that the player is better.
    I argue more than most posters here on the NBA Forum and in my time here on the NBA Forum I have NEVER seen someone say this. Could you please find us an example where someone says PER is an end all stat. The only persons who say that are the ones who hate it (eg Nicky, Amoser etc). Guys who actually know what PER is and what it represents have never said that around here.

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