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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve4x4 View Post
    again you are bringing up the same thing. stallworth hit & killed someone while drinking and driving. a tragedy, a huge mistake, one that unfortunately could happen to any of us on one day where we have a poor lapse in judgement.
    can you accidentally run a torturing, murdering death camp for dog for five years? cheering on as animals are tortured and killed? ooops?

    not. the. same.

    and again, if you cant see that, that is YOUR moral opinion, and this is mine.

    as far as blaming environment, your "streets of east new york"...that is weak and cowardly. we are all born with the ability to make decisions. there is a very long list of extremely successful & honest people raised in these areas. it does NOT automatically give you the excuse to take part & run heinous five year long crimes.

    but thats the last ill say about that.

    regardless vick is a terrible option for us at QB which it seems most of us agree on, lets leave it at that...
    lol...really? My moral opinion is that I would NEVER drink and Drive. Let alone kill someone while under the influence.
    You rationalize DUI/DWI as not nearly as bad a crime, maybe because you do it? Whats the difference between you drinking and driving and Vick running a dog fighting ring? How many HUMANS die a year as the result of drunk driving?

    If you know there is a possibility of killing someone while you are drunk behind a wheel, yet you still do it doesnt that make you just as guilty as Vick? maybe even a psychopath as you say.

    See as far as the death camp. Thats how you view it. But someone who is raised around that atmosphere wouldnt see it as anything but a money maker, a possible way out. They would rationalize it as they arent hurting anyone just dogs they dont care about. Is it wrong? YES. But its the streets.

    As far as the environment excuse as weak. Easily said by someone who didnt have to grow up in the ghetto. I was blessed with strong parents, ones who would not let me stray. Some people arent born with 2 great parents. Most kids in the hood dont have father figures to guide them in the right direction. So what happens to these kids? They turn to gangs or something they can do to make money ie drugs dog fighting etc. These are common things in any ghetto USA.

    In case you havent heard public schooling in the ghetto is terrible. So yeah while we each have the ability to make decisions we dont always make the right ones. Nor do each of us have the same amount of help afforded to us.


    Last I will quote naughty by nature. "If you ain't never been to the ghetto
    Don't ever come to the ghetto
    'Cause you wouldn't understand the ghetto"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM709xTjP24
    Last edited by GreenLantern; 12-21-2012 at 10:34 AM.


    "The Butt of all jokes"

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenLantern View Post
    lol...really? My moral opinion is that I would NEVER drink and Drive. Let alone kill someone while under the influence.
    You rationalize DUI/DWI as not nearly as bad a crime, maybe because you do it? Whats the difference between you drinking and driving and Vick running a dog fighting ring? How many HUMANS die a year as the result of drunk driving?

    If you know there is a possibility of killing someone while you are drunk behind a wheel, yet you still do it doesnt that make you just as guilty as Vick? maybe even a psychopath as you say.

    See as far as the death camp. Thats how you view it. But someone who is raised around that atmosphere wouldnt see it as anything but a money maker, a possible way out. They would rationalize it as they arent hurting anyone just dogs they dont care about. Is it wrong? YES. But its the streets.

    As far as the environment excuse as weak. Easily said by someone who didnt have to grow up in the ghetto. I was blessed with strong parents, ones who would not let me stray. Some people arent born with 2 great parents. Most kids in the hood dont have father figures to guide them in the right direction. So what happens to these kids? They turn to gangs or something they can do to make money ie drugs dog fighting etc. These are common things in any ghetto USA.

    In case you havent heard public schooling in the ghetto is terrible. So yeah while we each have the ability to make decisions we dont always make the right ones. Nor do each of us have the same amount of help afforded to us.


    Last I will quote naughty by nature. "If you ain't never been to the ghetto
    Don't ever come to the ghetto
    'Cause you wouldn't understand the ghetto"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM709xTjP24



    i dont even feel this warrants a response...

    best of luck to you in your ghetto, done with this topic.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve4x4 View Post


    i dont even feel this warrants a response...

    best of luck to you in your ghetto, done with this topic.
    It did not need one. Just an alternate way of thinking.

    appreciate the good luck though. Gonna need it in this ghetto


    "The Butt of all jokes"

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve4x4 View Post
    your "joke" what have made more sense saying psychologist steve rather than pastor steve. you went off in two different directions, shoulda stuck with one.

    what exactly are you falsely making up that i said?

    where did i say he is still running dog rings?

    where did i mention anything about a developmental illness such as Aspergers?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy
    "Three behaviors bedwetting, cruelty to animals and firestarting, known as the Macdonald triad were first described by J.M. MacDonald as possible indicators"

    my mention of pyschopathy was to express the severity of vicks crime when someone here was comparing it to a DUI.

    again boils down to moral opinions, but your little rebuttal here is just silly & ignorant...

    c'mon man!
    I'm sure Vick starts his fair share of fires, who doesn't? But until I see some solid evidence of bedwetting im not condemning him to the loonybin just yet. Ill tweet Marcus and see if he has any valuable insight.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve4x4 View Post


    i dont even feel this warrants a response...

    best of luck to you in your ghetto, done with this topic.
    Why would that not warrant a response? I think if anyone should have been facepalmed it should have been you trying to rationalize drinking and driving. For that its face palm x26236523761763517635.


    #Hernandezing


    Quote Originally Posted by bwallstreet View Post
    haha delusional
    Someone underestimated the jets!

  6. #51
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    Drinking & driving, wife beating, and dog fighting are all terrible things. However, the person doing any of them typically doesn't even consider this until after they are in trouble for having done them. I think this is one of the reasons why all of these things can be weighed equally.

  7. #52
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    If we talking bout bringing in Vick should be what he does on the football field. Can't believe people still on this dogfighting topic. Call me what y'all want say what you want bout me. I don't want Vick because his career passing numbers ate strikingly similar to Mark's. People make mistakes get over it.

  8. #53
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    Just read that Mike Pettine has turned down the contract extension that was offered to him. It appears as if he won't be back with us. Could Rex Ryan be next?


    Props To CheapTrikz For The Sig

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crom-Viscera View Post
    Just read that Mike Pettine has turned down the contract extension that was offered to him. It appears as if he won't be back with us. Could Rex Ryan be next?
    Doesn't make sense for him to extend not knowing Rex's fate. He should be back unless Rex isn't that is if he doesn't already have a HC gig somewhere lined lined up.

  10. #55
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    Under Pettine our defense has been ranked in the top 10 so if does get another job somewhere else I will be really happy for him because he's deserved it


    Props To CheapTrikz For The Sig

  11. #56
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    I find this a bit ridiculous.

    For those that are adement about not wanting Vick, who are you going to go with if McElroy doesn't work out.

    There is no Aaron Rodgers coming here, there is no Tom Brady coming here, the Jets missed out on Peyton Manning last year, Drew Stanton probably wants nothing to do with this organization, even Tim Tebow doesn't want to be here.

    You don't want Vick? You'd prefer to have Mark Sanchez QB the Jets another year?

    F that!!!

    Can Michael Vick make the Jets a viable team for 2 years? Yes he can.
    Is Michael Vick a long-term solution? No he isn't. But...
    Can the Jets potentially catch lightning in the bottle with Vick, and groom a young franchise QB behind him? Yes!

    You don't want Vick because of the past dog thing?
    Well excuse me, Mr. holier-than-thou, don't act as if you never smoked a blunt.

    And if you haven't, then you probably need too.


    Point is ladies and gentlemen, the Jets CAN NOT go into next year with Mark Sanchez as the only viable option at QB (if McElroy fails).
    There is no better option available in FA. NONE!

    Outside of Geno Smith are there really any QBs in the draft that you'd want to come in and start day 1, without any grooming? Doubtful.

    Something must be done, if even to hold the ship for a year or 2.

    If a better option that Vick comes along then by all means let's hear it, and don't give me imaginary dream scenerios like acquiring Matt Flynn for a 5th rounder, or trading Sanchez for Flynn straight up. NOT going to happen people.

    The Jets will be on the hook for most of Sanchez's contract whether he plays here or not.

    Vick is not going to get a $5M deal on the market and he knows it. He's very doubtful he'll sign for the vet min, but he may be attainable for a realistic couple mil per year.

    Now let's weigh this out:

    If the Jets manage to trade Sanchez and agree to take on $5M of his contract, and in turn sign Vick to a $2.5M deal, then the Jets would only have invested $7.5M into the starting QB position.

    Yes it sounds like quite a bit, BUT Sanchez would be off the books the following year, and Vick may or may not be brought back at a similar rate.

    So in effect the Jets would be saving money, while grooming a player at the same time.

    Maybe this is too complicated for some of you to follow, while others of you may completely understand and agree or disagree with the notion.
    However it's viewed, conceptually it makes absolute sense.
    Last edited by MrX27; 12-21-2012 at 01:37 PM.


  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrX27 View Post
    I find this a bit ridiculous.

    For those that are adement about not wanting Vick, who are you going to go with if McElroy doesn't work out.

    There is no Aaron Rodgers coming here, there is no Tom Brady coming here, the Jets missed out on Peyton Manning last year, Drew Stanton probably wants nothing to do with this organization, even Tim Tebow doesn't want to be here.

    You don't want Vick? You'd prefer to have Mark Sanchez QB the Jets another year?

    F that!!!

    Can Michael Vick make the Jets a viable team for 2 years? Yes he can.
    Is Michael Vick a long-term solution? No he isn't. But...
    Can the Jets potentially catch lightning in the bottle with Vick, and groom a young franchise QB behind him? Yes!

    You don't want Vick because of the past dog thing?
    Well excuse me, Mr. holier-than-thou, don't act as if you never smoked a blunt.

    And if you haven't, then you probably need too.


    Point is ladies and gentlemen, the Jets CAN NOT go into next year with Mark Sanchez as the only viable option at QB (if McElroy fails).
    There is no better option available in FA. NONE!

    Outside of Geno Smith are there really any QBs in the draft that you'd want to come in and start day 1, without any grooming? Doubtful.

    Something must be done, if even to hold the ship for a year or 2.

    If a better option that Vick comes along then by all means let's hear it, and don't give me imaginary dream scenerios like acquiring Matt Flynn for a 5th rounder, or trading Sanchez for Flynn straight up. NOT going to happen people.

    The Jets will be on the hook for most of Sanchez's contract whether he plays here or not.

    Vick is not going to get a $5M deal on the market and he knows it. He's very doubtful he'll sign for the vet min, but he may be attainable for a realistic couple mil per year.

    Now let's weigh this out:

    If the Jets manage to trade Sanchez and agree to take on $5M of his contract, and in turn sign Vick to a $2.5M deal, then the Jets would only have invested $7.5M into the starting QB position.

    Yes it sounds like quite a bit, BUT Sanchez would be off the books the following year, and Vick may or may not be brought back at a similar rate.

    So in effect the Jets would be saving money, while grooming a player at the same time.

    Maybe this is too complicated for some of you to follow, while others of you may completely understand and agree or disagree with the notion.
    However it's viewed, conceptually it makes absolute sense.
    Great post man, and its true that vick is the only viable option RITE NOW (if McElroy fails). And to be honest if the deal is efficient and it came down to him or sanchez I would be all in for vick. I dont want sanchez to even smell the grass on the field.


    #Hernandezing


    Quote Originally Posted by bwallstreet View Post
    haha delusional
    Someone underestimated the jets!

  13. #58
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    Michael Vick passing numbers just looking so similar to Mark. Mark passed for 3400 yards last year, Vick never threw for that much. 6 playoff games for Mike same for Mark in half the years. Vick led league in turnovers before being hurt, we all know who leads now. Is Mike more talented than Mark sure. But we really bringing in a QB with the same exact deficiencies as Mark. He can't read a D, is a turnover machine and has never developed as a true passer. They had same record last year and worse one this year with more "weapons" and Mike can't stay on the field.

    Its been so annoying hearing the word "circus"all year. If their is one guy that we can sign that will allow them to say that same **** next year would me Mike Vick. I've always been a fan of Vick but truthfully I'll pass.
    Last edited by NYShepinFL; 12-21-2012 at 03:19 PM.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve4x4 View Post
    major difference between what vick did and all your other "examples"...

    vick first-hand ran an organized system where dogs were brutally handled, tortured, and killed. again this was organized and went on for at least FIVE YEARS, this was not a mistake.

    comparing that to a DUI is a joke. comparing to sanchez's college rape allegation, he was never convicted even after a thorough investigation. and the ellis thing, details said he was basically in a fight with a dude who was starting stuff with his girl, and he won.

    NONE of that compares to the organized death camp vick ran. the torturing of animals is a sign of a true pyschopath. 21 months in prison does not wipe that slate clean. if it does for you, thats your moral decision....

    besides the fact that he is a terrible choice to QB for the jets given decline, age, and $$...he is also pure scum.

    Thank God there are some Jets fans that get it. Rio40 and VillaMaravilla you guys too. Thank you for bringing some intelligence to this thread. I am literally terrified of the possibility of the Jets bringing Vick in. I can only think of a few other teams that would consider bringing him in (ARI & BUF & KC) so it really worries me that they might be targeting him. Like others have stated, just because he "served his time" doesn't mean we all have to forgive the guy. Again, this wasn't an isolated incident, it's a mindset and a lifestyle and he was the ring leader who funded everything. He was never sorry, only sorry he got caught. And if there was any video on the horrific things he did, people would not be so quick to forgive and forget. Jets better not even toy with the idea of bringing him to the team. We all know this upcoming draft doesn't have a Luck or RGIII or Wilson, but I'd much rather hand the reins to a rookie QB next year and take our lumps with him, than waste time with a heartless criminal just to win a couple more games possibly.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYShepinFL View Post
    Michael Vick passing numbers just looking so similar to Mark. Mark passed for 3400 yards last year, Vick never threw for that much. 6 playoff games for Mike same for Mark in half the years. Vick led league in turnovers before being hurt, we all know who leads now. Is Mike more talented than Mark sure. But we really bringing in a QB with the same exact deficiencies as Mark. He can't read a D, is a turnover machine and has never developed as a true passer. They had same record last year and worse one this year with more "weapons" and Mike can't stay on the field.

    Its been so annoying hearing the word "circus"all year. If their is one guy that we can sign that will allow them to say that same **** next year would me Mike Vick. I've always been a fan of Vick but truthfully I'll pass.
    Ok, but you fail to mention that Michael Vick was subject to the single worst OL in football today, and it's not even close.

    If you though playing behind Wayne Hunter was bad, imagine playing behind 3 Wayne Hunter's on 1 offensive line.

    It's always been stated the the Jets are a run first team, and one element your not taking into consideration of Vicks stats is he runs to gain yardage.

    Therefore with a QB like Vick it's not passing yards alone that accounts for how he moves the football.
    Behind a solid OL he has always done well enough to win games.

    Now the Jets OL is not the OL from a few years ago, BUT they are a decent enough unit to win behind.

    You say no to Vick fine, but it sounds like you're defending Sanchez enough and to the point where it seems you want him back for another year as starting QB of the Jets.

    If so, than no way.


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