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  1. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by davell View Post
    You like him more than Walker or just don't think they'd deal him? Personally(big on Shark obviously), it'd take Walker, Hultzen(who I'm not THAT high on myself), AND Franklin to move him. Eh, thats too much, replace Hultzen with Mauer or Paxton, I guess. That said, I'd still much prefer to keep Shark and trade Garza, once desperation kicks in for the teams that have watched us nab 4 while sitting on their hands.
    1. Seattle trading Walker would be on par with the Royals trading Myers. If you get him+ for Samardzija then you do it.

    2. That is entirely too much for Samardzija.

    3. Hultzen >>>>>>>> Paxton, and I'm curious as to what's to not like about that one though I'm thinking I already know it.

    4. One thing I can't get over is this revamped image in the fanbase of Samardzija based on one year...This is from someone who not only called him being a surprisingly good starter going back to last year, but who never joined the lambasting the fanbase gave him in pretty much every year of his career. He's the ultimate sell high guy on this roster.

  2. #167
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    Would dejesus/wood net us Paxton?

    I think Theo could pull that off. I'd prefer Hultzen but prob no chance there unless you replace wood with shark

  3. #168
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    I would be perfectly content w keeping all our starting pitchers. It would be nice not to watch Casey Coleman, Justin Germano, or whatever sorry excuse for a major league pitcher they decided on going with that night. Villanueva to the bullpen, Wood and Vizcaino to AAA. You can never have enough pitching depth. I think we need to get Howell too so we can deepen our bullpen.

  4. #169
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    Seattle is a good match for Barney btw...Brendan Ryan was their starting SS last year.

  5. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    1. Seattle trading Walker would be on par with the Royals trading Myers. If you get him+ for Samardzija then you do it.

    2. That is entirely too much for Samardzija.

    3. Hultzen >>>>>>>> Paxton, and I'm curious as to what's to not like about that one though I'm thinking I already know it.

    4. One thing I can't get over is this revamped image in the fanbase of Samardzija based on one year...This is from someone who not only called him being a surprisingly good starter going back to last year, but who never joined the lambasting the fanbase gave him in pretty much every year of his career. He's the ultimate sell high guy on this roster.
    I hope no one is using the term untouchable because everyone should be available. With that said, the peripherals are just so strong that I don't really see anything that suggests regression. His babip is inline, his FIP, xFIP and SIERA are all very strong. His K rate is not all that different from 2011. The only noticeable thing I see is that his GB/FB ratio jumped up a bit.

  6. #171
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    Gato, you do know what I'm worried about with Hultzen obviously. And admittedly, the control gaffe can be fixed. That said, I personalky question the upside somewhat. As for Shark, I'm just a believer. I'm willing to take out the CB experimental month and give him a September and think of him as a 5 WAR type guy. The athleticism should(in my mind) lead to repeating his delivery and keeping his command in check. I think he's a horse. Obviously, he could morph back into pre-12 Shark and we miss out on an opportunity, but I'm willing to take that chance.

  7. #172
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    I've always had a crush on Bourn. What would be the plan for Jackson if we got him?

  8. #173
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    Gato, you do know what I'm worried about with Hultzen obviously. And admittedly, the control gaffe can be fixed. That said, I personalky question the upside somewhat.
    A lefty with a fastball that sits in the low 90's and can hit 95, two plus offspeeds that he can spot has upside questions? Same guy putting up K rates over 9 right out of college making the jump to AA?

    The control gaffe is almost exactly that...Guy's control and command were both considered impeccable coming out of college, and I've personally seen him spot all three of his pitches in multiple starts with the kind of precision you want out of a major league starter.

    As for Shark, I'm just a believer. I'm willing to take out the CB experimental month and give him a September and think of him as a 5 WAR type guy.
    That is beyond ridiculous. You cannot take out a bad month at will and add over 1.5 WAR on a month that didn't happen.

    The athleticism should(in my mind) lead to repeating his delivery and keeping his command in check.
    These are thing I have said about him without awarding him numbers that are not there.

    I think he's a horse.
    He didn't even finish the season in his only season starting. Stuff like this is precisely why he's prime trade bait...

    Obviously, he could morph back into pre-12 Shark and we miss out on an opportunity, but I'm willing to take that chance.
    I like Samardzija and am fine with not trading him as well, but if Seattle or anyone else came over with a big offer there's no way I'm not taking it. Shark is talented but the wind blows one more time and the tune of the fanbase will change with it, as is usually the case. Like with Garza going into 2012, Samardzija is at an all time high in performance and at least perceived value. Unlike Garza going into 2012, this is the only time Samardzija has ever been viewed so highly by anyone but Jim Hendry, a known fool of a Took.

  9. #174
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    They shut him diwn because he reached an innings limit that had been set up for in the preseason. It's not like he didn't try and get them to scrap it either. Not sure how that can get held against him.

  10. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tryptamine View Post
    I hope no one is using the term untouchable because everyone should be available. With that said, the peripherals are just so strong that I don't really see anything that suggests regression. His babip is inline, his FIP, xFIP and SIERA are all very strong. His K rate is not all that different from 2011. The only noticeable thing I see is that his GB/FB ratio jumped up a bit.
    Could have said the same thing about Garza last year, but his HR rate went back up to balance out the career low he experienced in 2013.

    Similarly, Samardzija can go back to be the 4 BB/9 guy he's been for the vast majority of his career.

    They shut him diwn because he reached an innings limit that had been set up for in the preseason. It's not like he didn't try and get them to scrap it either. Not sure how that can get held against him.
    What actually happens is alot more important than what could have happened. Nobody gets points for what woulda/coulda/shoulda been.
    Last edited by SenorGato; 12-20-2012 at 10:39 PM.

  11. #176
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    It's actually interesting the differences between Garza's pitch selections the last couple years. A lot of people attributed Garza's 2011 to throwing more breaking balls. He went from 71.5% fastball all the way down to 53.4%. He drastically increased the use of his slider and his change up. Then in 2012 his fastball jumped back up to 59.3% while his change up dropped from 10.9% to 4.8%. He also used fewer curves. Despite this he increased the use of his slider which was his best pitch in 2011 but much less impressive in 2012. Basically he turned himself into primarily a two pitch pitcher throwing either a fastball or slider 85% of the time compared to 77% the year before. In 2011 his pitch selection would have been a lot more unpredictable for an opposing hitter.

  12. #177
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    I've been thinking since the summer that Garza was told not to stress himself out this year. He's a highly competitive pitcher who's never been in such a situation as 2012, but there was really no incentive for him to tax his body or arm last year.

    Jump back in the # of fastballs he threw...reduction in his repetoire....mysterious injury that takes him out despite the race to 100...IT'S A CONSPIRACY!

    That said, nothing to explain why Samardzija's leap forward in control can't regress. Not that I think it will, just that it is entirely within the realm of possibilities.

  13. #178
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    Ty, what do you think Theo's pitch to these free agents are like? What is his recruiting pitch like?

  14. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by OStudent09 View Post
    Ty, what do you think Theo's pitch to these free agents are like? What is his recruiting pitch like?
    I'm not Ty, but let em give this a shot. Enter Theo and Hoyer with Bourn's agent "Hey Scott, How's it going. We'd like to offer you a fair market offer for Bourn. 5 years and 15+ per. We feel this would benefit both sides. Bourn can play at historic Wrigley Field, and play plenty of home day games to eat dinner with the family at night. We are serious about winning; evidence being the Jackson signing, with ourselves comming on board." Enter Tom Ricketts. "Hey guys, TD Ameritrade *****es!". Ricketts leaves.

  15. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    I've been thinking since the summer that Garza was told not to stress himself out this year. He's a highly competitive pitcher who's never been in such a situation as 2012, but there was really no incentive for him to tax his body or arm last year.

    Jump back in the # of fastballs he threw...reduction in his repetoire....mysterious injury that takes him out despite the race to 100...IT'S A CONSPIRACY!

    That said, nothing to explain why Samardzija's leap forward in control can't regress. Not that I think it will, just that it is entirely within the realm of possibilities.
    There's no conspiracy, for Christ's sake. They were unable to trade him because of that injury. They had a deal for Olt.

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