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  1. #46
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    If the Mets are willing to throw in 20 million sure I'd be interested in taking Santana off their hands. He's due 25.5 million this year with a 5.5 million buy out for next. I'd take a chance on him if all it cost us was 11 million for one year. He pitched decent last year and if were going for it this year why not. If were giving up TDA and Gose for Dickey we better be getting more back. Imagine the depth we'd have next season with:

    JJ
    Dickey
    Morrow
    Beuhrle
    Santana
    Romero
    Happ

    That's crazy deep.

  2. #47
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    If TDA is in the trade for a 38 year old pussballer i'm gonna be super pissed, give them JPA guy can't catch can't hit for an avg or obp

  3. #48
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    best catching prospect in baseball for 38 year old on one year deal? if extended be a diff story

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by dballss View Post
    best catching prospect in baseball for 38 year old on one year deal? if extended be a diff story
    the story doesn't get changed much. giving up on the career of the best catching prospect in the game for a guy nearing the end of his. it's unfortunate if true.

  5. #50
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    oh hot damn. this is one of those ambivalent situations for us jays fans. d'arnaud for dickey has the potential to be "the worst trade in jays' history" but at the same time we are going for it and that's what it's all about, to be in this position. the tip is in, why not got all the way?

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by masTOR_shake1 View Post
    oh hot damn. this is one of those ambivalent situations for us jays fans. d'arnaud for dickey has the potential to be "the worst trade in jays' history" but at the same time we are going for it and that's what it's all about, to be in this position. the tip is in, why not got all the way?
    It also has the potential to be the best trade in Jays history if d'Arnaud has a stroke and dies the day after the deal is finalize... What i am trying to argue here is that you have to judge a trade when its made. Its not really fair to judge a trade based on unforeseen circumstances that are out of a teams control. d'Arnaud is arguably the best catching prospect in the game. Dickey is an older knuckle ball pitcher who put 3 great seasons back to back. If it is a straight up deal, most people argue that the Mets won the deal.

    If d'Arnaud becomes a total bust 3-4 years down the road, that should have no effect on the evaluation of the trade. You are trading for d'Arnaud NOW, based on his current value... If he becomes the best player in the world, it would be really unfair to hold it against the Jays as they made the trade with the knowledge they had at hand, not some unforeseen circumstance. The Jays may get 3 great years from Dickey, and d'Arnaud busts, you never know... But you should judge a trade when its made, not on unforeseen outcomes
    Last edited by Farsight; 12-15-2012 at 03:57 AM.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farsight View Post
    It also has the potential to be the best trade in Jays history if d'Arnaud has a stroke and dies the day after the deal is finalize... What i am trying to argue here is that you have to judge a trade when its made. Its not really fair to judge a trade based on unforeseen circumstances that are out of a teams control. d'Arnaud is arguably the best catching prospect in the game. Dickey is an older knuckle ball pitcher who put 3 great seasons back to back. If it is a straight up deal, most people argue that the Mets won the deal.

    If d'Arnaud becomes a total bust 3-4 years down the road, that should have no effect on the evaluation of the trade. You are trading for d'Arnaud NOW, based on his current value... If he becomes the best player in the world, it would be really unfair to hold it against the Jays as they made the trade with the knowledge they had at hand, not some unforeseen circumstance. The Jays may get 3 great years from Dickey, and d'Arnaud busts, you never know... But you should judge a trade when its made, not on unforeseen outcomes
    obviously anything can happen, but i am looking at from a theoretical place where it has happend. d'arnaud figues to be something special, if what scouts are saying is true. all i'm saying is that d'arnaud could be "mr. met" and a franchise cornerstone and dickey could be a 38 year old who deteriorates (throws a hard knuckler). I can't recall us ever trading a young franchise player (carp left naturally, halladay was in his prime), apart from young. i can envision seeing it on the t.v years from now as a big joke on us. i don't see that with trading jpa and gose.
    Last edited by masTOR_shake1; 12-15-2012 at 04:10 AM.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by masTOR_shake1:24736305
    Quote Originally Posted by Farsight View Post
    It also has the potential to be the best trade in Jays history if d'Arnaud has a stroke and dies the day after the deal is finalize... What i am trying to argue here is that you have to judge a trade when its made. Its not really fair to judge a trade based on unforeseen circumstances that are out of a teams control. d'Arnaud is arguably the best catching prospect in the game. Dickey is an older knuckle ball pitcher who put 3 great seasons back to back. If it is a straight up deal, most people argue that the Mets won the deal.

    If d'Arnaud becomes a total bust 3-4 years down the road, that should have no effect on the evaluation of the trade. You are trading for d'Arnaud NOW, based on his current value... If he becomes the best player in the world, it would be really unfair to hold it against the Jays as they made the trade with the knowledge they had at hand, not some unforeseen circumstance. The Jays may get 3 great years from Dickey, and d'Arnaud busts, you never know... But you should judge a trade when its made, not on unforeseen outcomes
    obviously anything can happen, but i am looking at from a theoretical place where it has happend. d'arnaud figues to be something special, if what scouts are saying is true. all i'm saying is that d'arnaud could be "mr. met" and a franchise cornerstone and dickey could be a 38 year old who deteriorates (throws a hard knuckler). I can't recall us ever trading a franchise player (carp left naturally).
    theoretically d'Arnaud can die the day after hes dealt. You dont judge trades based in theoreticals or the unforeseen. Do you think the Expos knew that Cliff Lee and Brandon Phillips would become the players the are/were. When they made the trade for Colon they filled a pitching need, while giving away some good prospect who happened to be great players 8 years down the road. Do you think montreal would have made that trade knowing thats how those prospects turned out? No. Thats why hidsight and theoretics are dumb when evaluating a trade

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by masTOR_shake1 View Post
    obviously anything can happen, but i am looking at from a theoretical place where it has happend. d'arnaud figues to be something special, if what scouts are saying is true. all i'm saying is that d'arnaud could be "mr. met" and a franchise cornerstone and dickey could be a 38 year old who deteriorates (throws a hard knuckler). I can't recall us ever trading a young franchise player (carp left naturally, halladay was in his prime), apart from young. i can envision seeing it on the t.v years from now as a big joke on us. i don't see that with trading jpa and gose.
    That's the point. When you trade for a guy to put you over the top, that's the risk you take. For every prospect that succeeds, there's prospects that fail. A couple of years ago, JPA was considered a stud. Look how things change. Look at the haul Tampa Bay got for Shields and consider the Tigers had to deal for Anibal Sanchez. Dickey is worth at least TdA. That's the price of a guy that throws 200IP, gets you 180 Ks and does so consistently. If you win a chip, seeing d'Arnaud on TV years from now won't be a big deal. It's give and take. You will probably get a guy like Familia in addition to Dickey. It will be fine. Don't worry. But there's no way you get Ike Davis. Your GM will want 1 young player considering Dickey's age, but it won't be Davis.
    Last edited by yfern328; 12-15-2012 at 04:24 AM.

  10. #55
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    lol at all these blue jays and mets fans negotiating

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by waveycrockett View Post
    lol at all these blue jays and mets fans negotiating
    Discussing value maybe, not negotiating.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakedajewler View Post
    If TDA is in the trade for a 38 year old pussballer i'm gonna be super pissed, give them JPA guy can't catch can't hit for an avg or obp
    shhh...dont want any of the mets fo or scouts to see this!!

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by yfern328 View Post
    Dickey is worth at least TdA.
    Not from my perspective. I don't want the Blue Jays to give up a fringe top 10 prospect for a guy who is nearing the end of his career. As much as I like R.A. Dickey, this will be a huge win for the Mets if it happens.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtf View Post
    Discussing value maybe, not negotiating.
    Its what I love about the baseball forum so many arm chair gm's. Def the highest collective IQ on the forum...not saying much but...

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by waveycrockett View Post
    Its what I love about the baseball forum so many arm chair gm's. Def the highest collective IQ on the forum...not saying much but...
    Yeah you're right, everyone should stop posting on this forum altogether because we can't actually influence any action, including the price of beer at the stadium. While we're at it, we should probably stop buying tickets and watching it on television too, since we can't play for the teams.

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