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  1. #781
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    I just can't put a pitcher on a pedestal after 1 year...call me cynical. Same reason I will not accept that RA Dickey is an "ace".

    That said, I'd be happy to get Edwin Jackson at 4/56.
    Last edited by gaughan333; 12-16-2012 at 07:19 PM.
    Save the kittens, ignore sbs' posts
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    It is anyway, not anyways.

  2. #782
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaughan333 View Post
    I just can't put a pitcher on a pedestal after 1 year...call me cynical. Same reason I will not accept that RA Dickey is an "ace".

    That said, I'd be happy to get Edwin Jackson at 4/56.
    ^This.

  3. #783
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaughan333 View Post
    I just can't put a pitcher on a pedestal after 1 year...call me cynical. Same reason I will not accept that RA Dickey is an "ace".

    That said, I'd be happy to get Edwin Jackson at 4/56.
    I can understand that, but you have to admit that he has a lot of potential. I see absolutely no reason to get rid of him, and unless I'm overhelmed I wouldn't trade Garza either.

    I don't understand the love Jackson gets. If the Cubs sign him long term, I bet a lot of people will be calling him a bust and over payed in 2 years. Replacing either Garza or Samardzija with Jackson makes the rotation worse.

  4. #784
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    He does have a lot of potential, I've said that. I just want more that one year of results before he gets his pedestal positions. I'd try to talk extension with garza...if you can't get close then I'd trade him.

    The love jackson gets is because he's been a pretty reliable #3ish pitcher who consistently gets to about 190 ip per year. Something that is nice to have in a rotation, especially one like the cubs' which has some durability issues.
    Save the kittens, ignore sbs' posts
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  5. #785
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    Getting a little grumpy. So many people I wanted have gone off the board in the last week or so. Not expensive guys, either. Just players that really fit our roster, like Andres Torres.

  6. #786
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaughan333 View Post
    He does have a lot of potential, I've said that. I just want more that one year of results before he gets his pedestal positions. I'd try to talk extension with garza...if you can't get close then I'd trade him.

    The love jackson gets is because he's been a pretty reliable #3ish pitcher who consistently gets to about 190 ip per year. Something that is nice to have in a rotation, especially one like the cubs' which has some durability issues.
    I just don't see him as a #3ish starter at all. I'll make my prediction if the Cubs sign him he'll be the 4th best pitcher in the rotation at best. Garza/Samardzija/Baker will all post better numbers and Feldman will be close.

  7. #787
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    I think that's being extremely optimistic, especially on Feldman.

    A lot of times people don't account for how much 190+ innings wear on an arm. Guys who post great partial season stats won't necessarily repeat it when stretched out all year.

  8. #788
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    A healthy Baker, a big if is a better pitcher than Jackson. Jackson has bWAR of 2.1, 3.9, 1.7, 2.8, 1.6. It isn't that great. Samardzija pitched 174 innings last year and at the end the velocity was still fine. His peripherals are far superior.
    Garza has bWAR of 3.1, 3.3, 1.3, 2.5, 1. The only way Jackson out performs him is injury.
    Baker has bWAR of 1.6, 4.2, 3.1, 1.3, 4.2. Injury is the only way Jackson outperforms him.
    Scott Feldman is a stretch, but I think Gato is right that he'll benefit from getting out of Texas and the AL. Wouldn't shock me to see out up a bWAR of 1.5-2. Which is where Jackson usually is. His peripherals are the closest to Jackson amoung the Cubs starters.

  9. #789
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUBluejays View Post
    Replacing either Garza or Samardzija with Jackson makes the rotation worse.
    But Jackson plus improving the minor league system by dealing Garza is better for the organization then having only Garza and potentially losing him next year for one draft pick.

  10. #790
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    The whole "if healthy" thing is why someone who consistently pitches, like edwin jackson, is good to have.
    Save the kittens, ignore sbs' posts
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  11. #791
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcal10 View Post
    But Jackson plus improving the minor league system by dealing Garza is better for the organization then having only Garza and potentially losing him next year for one draft pick.
    They can also extend Garza and secure a still young but veteran power arm who actually has some experience pitching deep into the playoffs for a winning team.

    Completely agreed that many fans ignore the crap out of the amount of innings pitchers are capable of delivering. Right now the Cubs have zero healthy pitchers who have thrown 190+ innings on the staff. Feldman is the closest with 189 in 2009, the one time he did it.
    Last edited by SenorGato; 12-16-2012 at 09:02 PM.

  12. #792
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    They can also extend Garza and secure a still young but veteran power arm who actually has some experience pitching deep into the playoffs for a winning team.

    Completely agreed that many fans ignore the crap out of the amount of innings pitchers are capable of delivering. Right now the Cubs have zero healthy pitchers who have thrown 190+ innings on the staff. Feldman is the closest with 189 in 2009, the one time he did it.
    I would have no problem with extending Garza as well. But you can extend Garza and have Jackson too.

  13. #793
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    I guess if you want 190 blah innings Jackson is your guy. In 400+ IP in the AL Central he has 7.9 bWAR. In 500+ IP since 2008 outside of the AL Central he has 4.2 bWAR. He provides innings, and the value of a 4/5 starter. For $14-15 million I think you can do better in 2015-2016.
    Last edited by CUBluejays; 12-16-2012 at 10:04 PM.

  14. #794
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcal10 View Post
    I would have no problem with extending Garza as well. But you can extend Garza and have Jackson too.
    Then trade the farm for Price next year.

    Price, Garza, EJax, Shark, ?

  15. #795
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    Quote Originally Posted by Assman22 View Post
    Highly doubt E-Jax will get $2-3 mil less per year AAV than Anibal. He'll get four years from somebody for at least $14 mil per.
    He should but i wouldn't be surprised one bit if he doesn't. Jackson is good a pitcher but one that for some reason seems to be overlook. Prior to the 2012 season everybody expected him to cash a big deal and he ended up signing for only a year. I don't think he will sign for a year this time around but like i said before i wouldn't be shocked if he ends up signing a 3 year deal. With that said i probably would do 4-48 or 4-52 with him if needed and probably wouldn't be to worried about it.

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