Raymond Felton

[Kashmir13579]

Wow don't get your panties in a bunch. Firstly, I accidentally posted that in here. It was meant to be a knee jerk hyperbole in a game thread, during a particular 2 game span Where Felton is banging and clanging. AND let's face it the kid ain't shy.. I don't know what game youre watching D, where that comes off so outlandish. Forgive me for lack of paragraghs or grammatical correctness, as I an typing this from my phone. That also means I can't look at numbers. But last time I checked, Felton was taking quite a lot of shots at an efficiency that would make Carmelo blush. Now we're winning and that's fine. Felton has been about what I thought he'd be with less turnovers. Sometimes when he shoots the ball, I wish he passed instead.. That's really all I meant.

[Kashmir13579]

I've already admitted he's a better fit for this team than Lin, so get over it. I never said Felton's play was spectacular or nice to look at. I don't think many NBA fans would, even as the Knicks sit pretty at 15-5.

[D-Leethal]

Wow don't get your panties in a bunch. Firstly, I accidentally posted that in here. It was meant to be a knee jerk hyperbole in a game thread, during a particular 2 game span Where Felton is banging and clanging. AND let's face it the kid ain't shy.. I don't know what game youre watching D, where that comes off so outlandish. Forgive me for lack of paragraghs or grammatical correctness, as I an typing this from my phone. That also means I can't look at numbers. But last time I checked, Felton was taking quite a lot of shots at an efficiency that would make Carmelo blush. Now we're winning and that's fine. Felton has been about what I thought he'd be with less turnovers. Sometimes when he shoots the ball, I wish he passed instead.. That's really all I meant.

You thought he'd be at 16-7 shooting 40% from 3?

And to be honest, my post about looking justified with regards to Lin wasn't directed at you, more towards guys like blitz who get on Felton in game threads for every little mistake, never give him his due after a great performance and are self-proclaimed Lin lovers. You are at least there to give props.

Felton put us on his back for probably the two biggest road wins we have had in god knows how long. Honestly they might be the best best road wins we've had in a decade.

I will say this, I think you value efficiency a little too much, and overlook things for guys who are efficient spoon-fed scorers and don't give the same pass for guys who are forced to actually create their own shots at times and thus, downing their percentages - nor account for the fact that these guys have to do that.

I mean the efficiency crew (not sure if you were part of it - specifically nycrican) was trying to tell everyone last season Fields was better than JR because he was so efficient. But I mean, what the hell did Fields have to do? If he was forced to create a shot he'd pass to a guy like JR because Fields can't even get a shot off on his own. JR takes bad shots that do not need to be taken, we all know this, but a chunk of those he's forced to take because he's one of the few on this team that can. Brewer wouldn't even get a shot off 1 on 1 and would look like Jeremy Lin against Danny Green last night whereas JR and Felton can create off the dribble and get a shot off whenever they need to - thus they become bailout options who have to take 3-4 extra shots a game that have extremely small chance of going in.

I didn't even read the whole thread, I went to the Nugs came, got home and saw people fawning over Gallo, bashing Melo and Felton. It pissed me off. The same guys that are the first to harp on a bad performance barely give any due for a tremendous one. Lets not forget this guy is playing thru an injury nearly everyone would sit for and hes pretty much re-injured it in every game hes played with it.

Long story short, I think there is way more to this game than scoring efficiently, and the most efficient scorers usually have the least amount of skills, and are so efficient because they are never put in a position where they need to take a bad shot - because they aren't capable of getting a shot off when the D clamps down.

[D-Leethal]

I mean I literally hear the way you guys talk about tons of players around the league on this forum. Every dude that doesn't score efficiently gets lambasted. Every dude that scores efficiently is praised big time.

[KnicksPain]

You thought he'd be at 16-7 shooting 40% from 3?

And to be honest, my post about looking justified with regards to Lin wasn't directed at you, more towards guys like blitz who get on Felton in game threads for every little mistake, never give him his due after a great performance and are self-proclaimed Lin lovers. You are at least there to give props.

Felton put us on his back for probably the two biggest road wins we have had in god knows how long. Honestly they might be the best best road wins we've had in a decade.

I will say this, I think you value efficiency a little too much, and overlook things for guys who are efficient spoon-fed scorers and don't give the same pass for guys who are forced to actually create their own shots at times and thus, downing their percentages - nor account for the fact that these guys have to do that.

I mean the efficiency crew (not sure if you were part of it - specifically nycrican) was trying to tell everyone last season Fields was better than JR because he was so efficient. But I mean, what the hell did Fields have to do? If he was forced to create a shot he'd pass to a guy like JR because Fields can't even get a shot off on his own. JR takes bad shots that do not need to be taken, we all know this, but a chunk of those he's forced to take because he's one of the few on this team that can. Brewer wouldn't even get a shot off 1 on 1 and would look like Jeremy Lin against Danny Green last night whereas JR and Felton can create off the dribble and get a shot off whenever they need to - thus they become bailout options who have to take 3-4 extra shots a game that have extremely small chance of going in.

I didn't even read the whole thread, I went to the Nugs came, got home and saw people fawning over Gallo, bashing Melo and Felton. It pissed me off. The same guys that are the first to harp on a bad performance barely give any due for a tremendous one. Lets not forget this guy is playing thru an injury nearly everyone would sit for and hes pretty much re-injured it in every game hes played with it.

Long story short, I think there is way more to this game than scoring efficiently, and the most efficient scorers usually have the least amount of skills, and are so efficient because they are never put in a position where they need to take a bad shot - because they aren't capable of getting a shot off when the D clamps down.

I nearly shed a tear reading this, so happy we have Pigs feet. What a time to be a knick fan!

[Dankster]

Well to Raymond's defense, most of the shots he's been taking have been good ones. The majority are jumpers off high screens and passes from wing players, and he gets a lot of floater opportunities when running the pick and roll with Chandler. Sometimes unfortunately, they're just not going in.He's tempered down some of the really bad shot selection he had during his last time here when he was essentially thrusted into the 2nd option scoring role (Gallo and Wilson were still too young and inconsistent to take on that role 2 years ago.)

The amount of shots he took in Chicago made me cringe a bit, but I'm ok with it as most of them came within the flow of the offense, just like it has been for the entire season. I fully expect his FGA's to drop once Stat returns, and have no problem with Felton taking the 3rd most attempts (or JR.)

[nycericanguy]

I mean I literally hear the way you guys talk about tons of players around the league on this forum. Every dude that doesn't score efficiently gets lambasted. Every dude that scores efficiently is praised big time.

Its hard to ignore Felton going 9-30, then 4-15.

Its hard to ignore JR shooting 26% over his last 5 games.

I'm not an efficiency wizard, but I can't stand guys that keep chucking when they are missing. JR shoots 2-14 over 3 quarters, then hit a big shot in the 4th and he's praised. But in truth, if he had played decent for 3 quarters we wouldn't need a big shot in the 4th.

Now combine that with the fact that JR & Felton almost NEVER get to the FT line, and yes, they really are very inefficient.

Felton has been solid on both ends, but this idea that he's having a great season... sorry I don't buy it. He's shooting 41% this year, same as career, assists and TO's about the same. The only difference this year is he's taking alot more shots per game so he's scoring more, and he's shooting the 3 better.

Now you say they shoot poorly because they create their own shots, but I don't see it that way, I see them shooting poorly because they force shots. I see JR & FElton, and Sheed for that matter, take more poor quality shots than anyone on this team, so its not a coincidence that all 3 of those guys have horrible fg%. Its just about taking quality shots.

[nycericanguy]

And I don't want to bash this team because i'm obviously very happy at the start.

but i just think if we ultimately want to win a title, we can't have guys taking so many bad shots. You look at the Spurs who have won all those titles, you don't see Parker or anyone on that team chucking up horrible shots... they are a true professional team.

[Jesse2272]

I just bought a Ray jersey

hes my ****ing hero

[HouRealCoach]

^^^^I voted for him to the All Star game but I know he won't win

[JEDean89]

love me some felton, but he does chuck as illustrated in the chicago game.

[Jesse2272]

Wow don't get your panties in a bunch. Firstly, I accidentally posted that in here. It was meant to be a knee jerk hyperbole in a game thread, during a particular 2 game span Where Felton is banging and clanging. AND let's face it the kid ain't shy.. I don't know what game youre watching D, where that comes off so outlandish. Forgive me for lack of paragraghs or grammatical correctness, as I an typing this from my phone. That also means I can't look at numbers. But last time I checked, Felton was taking quite a lot of shots at an efficiency that would make Carmelo blush. Now we're winning and that's fine. Felton has been about what I thought he'd be with less turnovers. Sometimes when he shoots the ball, I wish he passed instead.. That's really all I meant.

This post freaks me out is this you

Ok Chronz get off that high horse buddy

[D-Leethal]

And I don't want to bash this team because i'm obviously very happy at the start.

but i just think if we ultimately want to win a title, we can't have guys taking so many bad shots. You look at the Spurs who have won all those titles, you don't see Parker or anyone on that team chucking up horrible shots... they are a true professional team.

Have you watched Russel Westbrook play? Stephen Jackson?

I personally think every team in this league throws up bad shots. Almost every star player does too. People really blow it out of proportion here. As a team we are pretty damn good with our shot selection offensively.

Look I wasn't trying to start a flame war but I do personally feel like efficiency has tendency to rule all in this place. I didn't mean to disrespect you or Kash, I usually agree with everything you dudes post on here.

[D-Leethal]

Its hard to ignore Felton going 9-30, then 4-15.

Its hard to ignore JR shooting 26% over his last 5 games.

I'm not an efficiency wizard, but I can't stand guys that keep chucking when they are missing. JR shoots 2-14 over 3 quarters, then hit a big shot in the 4th and he's praised. But in truth, if he had played decent for 3 quarters we wouldn't need a big shot in the 4th.

Now combine that with the fact that JR & Felton almost NEVER get to the FT line, and yes, they really are very inefficient.

Felton has been solid on both ends, but this idea that he's having a great season... sorry I don't buy it. He's shooting 41% this year, same as career, assists and TO's about the same. The only difference this year is he's taking alot more shots per game so he's scoring more, and he's shooting the 3 better.

Now you say they shoot poorly because they create their own shots, but I don't see it that way, I see them shooting poorly because they force shots. I see JR & FElton, and Sheed for that matter, take more poor quality shots than anyone on this team, so its not a coincidence that all 3 of those guys have horrible fg%. Its just about taking quality shots.

IDK man, watching the games, specifically Bulls, I feel I was watching a different game than you guys. Bulls writers were saying that was the best D they played all season, we had absolutely nothing on them. Felton was forcing shots because he had to. We moved the ball all over and get nothing.

You can't give the ball to Brewer and say go score. You can't do that with Novak. You can't do that with Tyson, especially if the PnR is not there. Those guys would get swallowed up and not even get a freakin shot off, regardless of how efficient they are when they can expose the defense and get clean looks.

They shut down our pick and roll like they do to most teams, and they didn't leave our shooters. We had nobody capable of drawing doubles to get anyone open. None of those guys had enough space to get shots off. The ball went back to Felton and JR because they are the guys who can get a shot off.

Sheeds shots are terrible. JR has more than his fair share of moments too but I think he brings an all around game that makes up for it most nights. I don't think Felton's shot selection is that much of a problem, and regardless I think a huge chunk of a PG's worth should be dictated by the quality of your offense, and we have one of the best. I gave him his fair share of **** for the Nets game but he has done more than enough to make up for that.

[nycericanguy]

Have you watched Russel Westbrook play? Stephen Jackson?

I personally think every team in this league throws up bad shots. Almost every star player does too. People really blow it out of proportion here. As a team we are pretty damn good with our shot selection offensively.

Look I wasn't trying to start a flame war but I do personally feel like efficiency has tendency to rule all in this place. I didn't mean to disrespect you or Kash, I usually agree with everything you dudes post on here.

People get on Russell ALOT for the shots he takes, but at least he gets to the FT so much that he can still score alot.

Popovich doesn't play that game, Jackson hasn't been chucking in SA.