How is there any hope ?

[Claymation]

Boy, Mets fans are truly are defeatists, I guess its true, misery loves company.

Carry on.

[jomota]

1. Young is most likely done i'm calling it, he's not much of an improvement the only improvement the Phillies are adding is more age (Young is 36, Utley 33, Howard 33) They are getting older, only thing to watch out on the Phillies is there pitching.

2. Nats have gotten better but Haren has not been the type of pitcher he use to be so it could be said that it could either be low risk high reward or vice versa with that pick up. He still k's alot of guys Nats easily have the best pitching in our divison.

3. BJ Upton is a cancer and not a great pickup for the Braves but yes they did improve there bullpen.

4. Don't even get me started with the Marlins.

4 Reasons to look foward to the Mets this season -

1. We are gonna have Harvey for a whole year!!!

2. Will Dickey stay or will he go? If we can get Myers from the Royals that will certaintly bolster our weak outfield.

3. We have great starting pitcher depth

4. We will see a taste of what we have next year. I truly feel 2014 will be our year to compete with Wheeler!

So the Mets master plan is to stand still while other teams deteriorate. We move past teams by hoping the drift below us. Not a great plan.

What you fail to mention is this…if all those players the other teams are signing do not pan out (Young, Haren, Upton), those teams will just go out and get someone else. Teams that want to win, make moves when the have to to remain competitive. They will eat contracts, re-arrange contracts, adjust budgets, trade prospects etc. They get the job done.

The Mets worry about holding onto AA possibles so they can maybe get them to the show and "maintain control" into 2018. The Phillies, Bracves and Nats are trying to win now. Phillies may be in decline (may be) but they are at least trying to hold on to something. All we can say is that we have good announcers and just wait for two years from now. The Phillies are good now and will take whatever steps necessary to still be good two years from now. The Braves have been good forever. But we always have a better draft position and we have our eye on some kid from Idaho Prep.

Our strategy is to maintain mediocrity. We have succeeded.

[Marty Mcfly]

Well i see them doing quite a bit going into 2014, they've basically cornered themselves into doing it with how vocal they have been about having more flexibility after next season.

They have to make an attempt at winning because otherwise they will continue to lose significant revenue as less and less people show up. They'll be lucky to break 2 million this year and that's only if this team starts off well.

It's counterproductive not to, the most money they would make through the season is based on attendance and gameday related revenue at the ballpark.

They'll just do whatever it takes to hold onto the team. You think these people care about being cornered or going back on their word?

Losing has been counter-productive for years, it hasn't bothered them one iota.

[Marty Mcfly]

So the Mets master plan is to stand still while other teams deteriorate. We move past teams by hoping the drift below us. Not a great plan.

What you fail to mention is this…if all those players the other teams are signing do not pan out (Young, Haren, Upton), those teams will just go out and get someone else. Teams that want to win, make moves when the have to to remain competitive. They will eat contracts, re-arrange contracts, adjust budgets, trade prospects etc. They get the job done.

The Mets worry about holding onto AA possibles so they can maybe get them to the show and "maintain control" into 2018. The Phillies, Bracves and Nats are trying to win now. Phillies may be in decline (may be) but they are at least trying to hold on to something. All we can say is that we have good announcers and just wait for two years from now. The Phillies are good now and will take whatever steps necessary to still be good two years from now. The Braves have been good forever. But we always have a better draft position and we have our eye on some kid from Idaho Prep.

Our strategy is to maintain mediocrity. We have succeeded.

Brilliant post.

Can you believe this nonsense about everything coming up rosy in 2014?

LOL!!! They'll just do the same thing all over again, build another mediocre team as cheaply as they dare.

What have the done this year to IMPROVE with the supposed new-found flexibility?

I'll tell you what they've done Yap yap yap yap yap yap yap yap yap yap yap yap.

[Marty Mcfly]

Boy, Mets fans are truly are defeatists, I guess its true, misery loves company.

Carry on.

And this ISN'T baiting right?

Funny because whenever I disagree with anyone it's called baiting and name-calling...


One rule for one and one rule for everyone else.

[vtmet]

Much has to happen in 2013 for there to be hope in 2014. Do not be deceived.

I have faith in Sandy...sometime before David Wright's contract is up, the Mets will be playing "meaningful games" in July...maybe even August...

[Marty Mcfly]

I have hope that by 2020 we'll have finished 3rd at least.

[metswon69]

They'll just do whatever it takes to hold onto the team. You think these people care about being cornered or going back on their word?

Losing has been counter-productive for years, it hasn't bothered them one iota.

It wasn't counterproductive when they were losing 70 million dollars at the box office with a payroll of over 140 million bucks..

They had a burden to ease between that and the Madoff scandal that was still over their head till March of this year.

Now that those burdens are gone they should be more active in FA after next season.

You won't see 140 million dollar payrolls for quite some time but with all the payroll coming off the books after next year (Santana, Francisco) and the deferred money paid to Bay. Wright also having a deferred salary to some extent, they could be running around with 25 million dollar payroll after next season (If Dickey is not re-signed)

They could add 50 million dollars in payroll in one offseason on 3 or 4 players (hypothetically), improve dramatically, and be significantly better than those 130 million dollar payroll teams that they were getting worse results from.

It's entirely possible what didn't work at 140 million can work at 75 million if they spend more astutely coming into next season and the season thereafter.

Remember this offseason isn't over yet just because the Mets didn't do anything at the winter meetings.

[Claymation]

And this ISN'T baiting right?

Funny because whenever I disagree with anyone it's called baiting and name-calling...


One rule for one and one rule for everyone else.

Specifically who am I baiting?

[Marty Mcfly]

It wasn't counterproductive when they were losing 70 million dollars at the box office with a payroll of over 140 million bucks..

They had to ease that burden between that and the Madoff scandal that was still over their head till March of this year.

Now that those are gone they should be more active in FA next year.

You won't see 140 million dollar payrolls for quite some time but with all the payroll coming off the books after next year (Santana, Francisco) and the deferred money paid to Bay. Wright also having a deferred salary to some extent, they could be running around with 25 million dollar payroll.

They could add 50 million dollars in payroll in one offseason on 3 or 4 players (hypothetically), improve dramatically, and be significantly better than those 130 million dollar payroll teams that they were getting worse results from.

It's entirely possible what didn't work at 140 million can work at 75 million if they spend right coming into next season and the season thereafter.

Remember this offseason isn't over yet just because the Mets didn't do anything at the winter meetings.

It has been counter-productive though as they have lost revenue, and goodwill by the bucket-load. Having a team that is a pant-load every year can be nothing other than counter-productive.


I'm well aware that the off-season isn't over thanks, I have heard this every year for years and the end result is always the same. Mets do nothing.

[Marty Mcfly]

Specifically who am I baiting?

del

[metswon69]

[/B]


It has been counter-productive though as they have lost revenue, and goodwill by the bucket-load. Having a team that is a pant-load every year can be nothing other than counter-productive.


Please don't patronize me with this nonsense again, I have heard this every year for years and the end result is always the same. Mets do nothing.

I am not patronizing you..

I think this team has a plan on when the appropriate time to spend significant money in FA is (2014 and afterwards) , you on the other hand do not.

You expect them to suck for as long as Fred Wilpon is the owner of the team.

Sorry i don't buy that.

Eventually everyone is accountable and these owners will have no choice but to be if they ever want 3.5 million plus people in the ballpark over a whole season again.

[Marty Mcfly]

Boy Mets fans truly are naive, I guess it's true what they say, you can't educate pork.

Carry on.

[metswon69]

Boy Mets fans truly are naive, I guess it's true what they say, you can't educate pork.

Carry on.

You have a specific mindset and that's really about it.

It's not about the perceived education you think you are so gracefully passing down to everyone. It's your thing and i wouldn't expect you to deviate from it.

You can say "Why should I?" but past events don't always dictate future outcomes.

[Marty Mcfly]

I am not patronizing you..

I think this team has a plan on when the appropriate time to spend significant money in FA is (2014 and afterwards) , you on the other hand do not.

You expect them to suck for as long as Fred Wilpon is the owner of the team.

Sorry i don't buy that.

Eventually everyone is accountable and these owners will have to be if they ever want people to come back to the ballpark.

When has the team ever been accountable on or off the field?

They want people to come back to the park, and they know they only need a little bit of flimsy hope to do so, they're never going to build a monster team, they know they don't need too.

There are more than enough casual fans in NYC who will go along as long as the team is embarrassing itself.

All you people that think the Mets are going top go out and spend serious money in FA next year and beyond are crazy. They give themselves flexibility with Bay etc and then they don't spend it. All they're doing is allowing themselves to spend less this year by adding it onto future payrolls, meaning less flex down the line.

Why doesn't a team with a low payroll from 2014 onwards think their own CY Young winning ace SP, is worth 2/25?

That would give us an ACE for three season from just over $30M.

And you think they';re gonna spend big soon? they couldn't even sign Scotty Hairston.

I'll ask again tell me how adding guys on 1-2 years deals kills the future?