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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzace137 View Post
    Your probably right but I still have to see more. I'm rooting for TD as well and he's outplayed Lin a few games but I still have to see more, sorry. Lin's explosiveness to me is starting to come back he had a 19 and 8 game before the LA game, Nobody expected Linsanity numbers this year but he's been bad overall. Once I've seen enough no doubt I'll admit if it was a fluke or not, just not yet.

    I've seen all the Rocket games this year and there using Lin improperly imo. They have turned him into a spot up shooter you and I both know that's not his game. I know people will think I'm making excuses but I've seen both this years and last years version of Lin and I know Lin is best when he run's the offense and is a high usage guy. He's basically the secondary play maker for that team. Harden run's just about every play. His explosiveness is just starting to come back. Funny thing is he has a lesser role with the Rockets then he would have here with us. It's not as simple as he sucks or he's a fluke because he still performed well maybe not great after Linsanity
    Don't just make excuses for Lin, you have to see how Felton is performing now. He's doing everything that's asked of him, and to be honest, I think he's just now starting to hit his stride. Felton might also be the lynch pin for Amare.

    As far as a fluke, I think it's safe to say he won't reach the level he had during that run last year. It might be safe to say his ceiling is average PG. For what was expected out of him "average PG" is a total FLUKE. And if we retained him, I doubt we'd be where we are today.


    My man Ike got a bad rap

  2. #32
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    I'll definitely cosign Grunwald for GMOTY

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backstabber View Post
    Don't just make excuses for Lin, you have to see how Felton is performing now. He's doing everything that's asked of him, and to be honest, I think he's just now starting to hit his stride. Felton might also be the lynch pin for Amare.

    As far as a fluke, I think it's safe to say he won't reach the level he had during that run last year. It might be safe to say his ceiling is average PG. For what was expected out of him "average PG" is a total FLUKE. And if we retained him, I doubt we'd be where we are today.
    You make good point's. I agree on the Felton part he's done what we've asked him to do. He's been solid no doubt.

    As far as fluke I just don't know yet. I've seen the Rocket games and I still see flashes not as often as last year but it's there. Lin is a work horse so I wouldn't be surprised if he has a bad year and comes back strong next year, or the second half.

    One thing that I can say is Lin's confidence is at an all time low. His jump shots been awful and he's in a young team with no veterans to help him and no Kevin McHale, doods lost, with Toney right on his heels. If we retained him who knows where we would be he would be under Kidd and Woodson's watch, I mean how bad could we have been since we would still have Kidd, but that's doesn't matter anymore since that ship has sailed.

    Like I told D I still have to see more Lin's been doubted before and he proved people wrong, people are starting to doubt him again, let's see if he can rise above once again. I know a lot of knick fan's just trash our former player's as soon as they leave but I still root for most of them. I wanna see guy's like Lin, Gallo, Fields, W. Chandler do well.
    Last edited by Blitzace137; 12-07-2012 at 11:50 PM.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzace137 View Post
    Your probably right but I still have to see more. I'm rooting for TD as well and he's outplayed Lin a few games but I still have to see more, sorry. Lin's explosiveness to me is starting to come back he had a 19 and 8 game before the LA game, Nobody expected Linsanity numbers this year but he's been bad overall. Once I've seen enough no doubt I'll admit if it was a fluke or not, just not yet.

    I've seen all the Rocket games this year and there using Lin improperly imo. They have turned him into a spot up shooter you and I both know that's not his game. I know people will think I'm making excuses but I've seen both this years and last years version of Lin and I know Lin is best when he run's the offense and is a high usage guy. He's basically the secondary play maker for that team. Harden run's just about every play. His explosiveness is just starting to come back. Funny thing is he has a lesser role with the Rockets then he would have here with us. It's not as simple as he sucks or he's a fluke because he still performed well maybe not great after Linsanity
    well nothing like the present, once again a typical Lin game this season.

    2-9 and 4 pts with 4 assists and 2 TO's, Lin's per is below average and his defense has stunk up the gym this year.

    once again his man shoots lights out 7-9 scores 17 in 24 min.

    He is really hurting his team, and TD came in and played 22 min and played well.

    you didn't need much to consider him a top pg worthy of 25mil but right now with almost the same amount of time you need more of just that time?

    Sooner or later you will come around like Kash and D did. Felton is a beast and the perfect pg for this team and Lin would have been the wrong choice.

    14-4 there is nothing more to say than that.



    Now I can't fly my airplane

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzace137 View Post
    You make good point's. I agree on the Felton part he's done what we've asked him to do. He's been solid no doubt.

    As far as fluke I just don't know yet. I've seen the Rocket games and I still see flashes not as often as last year but it's there. Lin is a work horse so I wouldn't be surprised if he has a bad year and comes back strong next year, or the second half.

    One thing that I can say is Lin's confidence is at an all time low. His jump shots been awful and he's in a young team with no veterans to help him and no Kevin McHale, doods lost, with Toney right on his heels. If we retained him who knows where we would be he would be under Kidd and Woodson watch, I mean how bad could we have been since we would still have Kidd, but that's doesn't matter anymore since that ship has sailed.

    Like I told D I still have to see more Lin's been doubted before and he proved people wrong, people are starting to doubt him again, let's see if he can rise above once again. I know a lot of knick fan's just trash our former player's as soon as they leave but I still root for most of them. I wanna see guy's like Lin, Gallo, Fields, W. Chandler do well.
    nothing wrong with that if your not obsessed with it.

    I wanted marbury ,curry, Gallo and Chandler to do well, but they are not Knicks so I was never obsessed with it.

    now with Gallo and chandler I peak over but really don't even care. I'm so into this team, nothing outside or ex players, coach's means a damn thing.

    Linsanity was great, the world stopped in its tracks, it was so crazy a priest mentioned him at my nephews funeral???

    But as much as we saw great things you can't be blinded and not see he had weaknesses the rest of his peers saw and even said he won't take anyone by surprise any more.

    He gets outplayed by every pg he has played except for twice this yr, thats being a poor pg right now, and he could turn out to be good but so can TD.



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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzace137 View Post
    You make good point's. I agree on the Felton part he's done what we've asked him to do. He's been solid no doubt.

    As far as fluke I just don't know yet. I've seen the Rocket games and I still see flashes not as often as last year but it's there. Lin is a work horse so I wouldn't be surprised if he has a bad year and comes back strong next year, or the second half.

    One thing that I can say is Lin's confidence is at an all time low. His jump shots been awful and he's in a young team with no veterans to help him and no Kevin McHale, doods lost, with Toney right on his heels. If we retained him who knows where we would be he would be under Kidd and Woodson's watch, I mean how bad could we have been since we would still have Kidd, but that's doesn't matter anymore since that ship has sailed.

    Like I told D I still have to see more Lin's been doubted before and he proved people wrong, people are starting to doubt him again, let's see if he can rise above once again. I know a lot of knick fan's just trash our former player's as soon as they leave but I still root for most of them. I wanna see guy's like Lin, Gallo, Fields, W. Chandler do well.

    You're in love with his story. Triumph of the underdog. Unrecognized talent. Linsanity at it's best.

    Felton has a story too. He's been an underdog almost his whole career. Heralded as a top ten pick, to get knocked down and insulted time and time again. He landed his dream opportunity with the Knicks, performed and then was traded. Came back depressed, out of shape, overweight and was doubted again. Forced to take a lower contract to come back to his dream job, and is once again recognized in NY as one of our own.

    Time to forget Linsanity, and recognize one of our own.


    My man Ike got a bad rap

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    well nothing like the present, once again a typical Lin game this season.

    2-9 and 4 pts with 4 assists and 2 TO's, Lin's per is below average and his defense has stunk up the gym this year.

    once again his man shoots lights out 7-9 scores 17 in 24 min.

    He is really hurting his team, and TD came in and played 22 min and played well.

    you didn't need much to consider him a top pg worthy of 25mil but right now with almost the same amount of time you need more of just that time?

    Sooner or later you will come around like Kash and D did. Felton is a beast and the perfect pg for this team and Lin would have been the wrong choice.

    14-4 there is nothing more to say than that.
    It's Toney Parker he shoots lights out against everyone lol

    I didn't really think he was a 25 million player. I thought 5 years per was fair. Obviously Rockets overpaid to bring in his market/brand. We knew what we had which was a raw young player. Rockets just tried to cash in on him. I knew they would be better off with Dragic or Lowry, I've said that even before they signed Lin. I was willing to match because we were already over the cap.

    Nobody really knows how good Lin could have been under Kidd's watch and Woodson's defensive system. I kinda feel bad for the kid he's out there in Houston with no veteran's to help him he's on his own and like you said he's hurting the team right now with his poor play. I wan't him to do well just to prove the doubters wrong it's not even about Felton vs Lin at this point.

    As for Felton he's been great I have no complaints.
    Last edited by Blitzace137; 12-08-2012 at 12:09 AM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzace137 View Post
    It's Toney Parker he shoots lights out against everyone lol

    I didn't really think he was a 25 million player yet. I thought 5 years per was fair. Obviously Rockets overpaid to bring in his market/brand. We knew what we had which was a raw young player. Rockets just tried to cash in on him. I knew they would be better off with Dragic or Lowry, I've said that even before they signed Lin. I was willing to match because we were already over the cap.

    Nobody really knows how good Lin could have been under Kidd's watch and Woodson's defensive system. I kinda feel bad for the kid he's out there in Houston with no veteran's to help him he's on his own and like you said he's hurting the team right now with his poor play. I wan't him to do well just to prove the doubters wrong it's not even about Felton vs Lin at this point.

    As for Felton he's been great I have no complaints.
    fair enough, because I want him to flop because of all the summer posts about how the Knicks FO are dumb ***** and Dolan blah blah blah.......

    But this is a Knicks forum and while you may be obsessed and protect him this is not the forum (pun) for Linsanity.

    We all know if he was still Linsanity I'd probably have to quit with all the deleted posts and bans lol.........but thank God he's not and he's actually been very bad, so I can't see and defense for him at this point.

    We can wait, but he is not going to be a top pg in this league with so many young quick, talented pg's we have now.

    Felton is a tough son of gun and just plays great in NY. Everyone harped on Fat Ray but I look at it this way , only judge Ray by how he plays in NY, and that is pretty damn good. Nothing else really matters or I should care less.

    Right now I'd take, Ray, Kidd and Pablo any one of them over Lin. And I think I'd even take TD over him today.

    Just my opinion and I said Lin can prove me wrong this yr but he sure is going about it all wrong.



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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backstabber View Post
    You're in love with his story. Triumph of the underdog. Unrecognized talent. Linsanity at it's best.

    Felton has a story too. He's been an underdog almost his whole career. Heralded as a top ten pick, to get knocked down and insulted time and time again. He landed his dream opportunity with the Knicks, performed and then was traded. Came back depressed, out of shape, overweight and was doubted again. Forced to take a lower contract to come back to his dream job, and is once again recognized in NY as one of our own.

    Time to forget Linsanity, and recognize one of our own.
    Honestly I wanted Felton back, that was my mindset when we had Toney stinking it up. I always like thinking ahead, at the time I thought if we can't land Nash we have to get Felton. Then Lin came along and all that was forgotten. I just didn't like the way Lin was shown the door.

    Felton was a lottery pick, Lin was a underdog since high school it's just not the same type of underdog story.

    Anyways I got love for Felton and what he's been doing, he plays with heart, loves NY and this team. I have no complaints.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    fair enough, because I want him to flop because of all the summer posts about how the Knicks FO are dumb ***** and Dolan blah blah blah.......

    But this is a Knicks forum and while you may be obsessed and protect him this is not the forum (pun) for Linsanity.

    We all know if he was still Linsanity I'd probably have to quit with all the deleted posts and bans lol.........but thank God he's not and he's actually been very bad, so I can't see and defense for him at this point.

    We can wait, but he is not going to be a top pg in this league with so many young quick, talented pg's we have now.

    Felton is a tough son of gun and just plays great in NY. Everyone harped on Fat Ray but I look at it this way , only judge Ray by how he plays in NY, and that is pretty damn good. Nothing else really matters or I should care less.

    Right now I'd take, Ray, Kidd and Pablo any one of them over Lin. And I think I'd even take TD over him today.

    Just my opinion and I said Lin can prove me wrong this yr but he sure is going about it all wrong.
    Fair enough like I said I have no complaints with Felton at this point. I just don't think a lot of the Lin bashing is warented he did good things for us, that's reason I defend him. Let's see how things transpire the rest of the way. Let's go knicks. Were winning that's all that matters until Amare comes back that is lol jk
    Last edited by Blitzace137; 12-08-2012 at 12:47 AM.

  11. #41
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    Right now its no contest


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  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    fair enough, because I want him to flop because of all the summer posts about how the Knicks FO are dumb ***** and Dolan blah blah blah.......

    But this is a Knicks forum and while you may be obsessed and protect him this is not the forum (pun) for Linsanity.

    We all know if he was still Linsanity I'd probably have to quit with all the deleted posts and bans lol.........but thank God he's not and he's actually been very bad, so I can't see and defense for him at this point.

    We can wait, but he is not going to be a top pg in this league with so many young quick, talented pg's we have now.

    Felton is a tough son of gun and just plays great in NY. Everyone harped on Fat Ray but I look at it this way , only judge Ray by how he plays in NY, and that is pretty damn good. Nothing else really matters or I should care less.

    Right now I'd take, Ray, Kidd and Pablo any one of them over Lin. And I think I'd even take TD over him today.

    Just my opinion and I said Lin can prove me wrong this yr but he sure is going about it all wrong.
    STILLA, don't kid yourself.

    The reason NY let Lin go had nothing to do with money, or with them thinking he couldn't play. They pegged him as the starting PG, Woodson came out and said so, took the kid out to dinner, even came out in the paper and said NY would "absolutely" match the offer.

    Mind you, this is while Felton was readily available and we still had even our MMLE to sign him outright and our S&T pieces.

    Alot of things that we don't know about happened when Lin got the new offer, jealousy among teammates, Dolan feeling like he was crossed...etc... But prior to that, NY was absolutely ready to make Lin the starting PG.

    Heck even one Knick official was asked when they passed on Lin, "who he thought was the better player now and for the future", and he said "Probably Lin".

    So I think you're trying to give NY's FO too much credit on this one. The fact remains they handled it poorly. If they really felt strongly that he was not a starting caliber PG as you claim, they would have been looking for a S&T with HOU and they would have gone hard after Felton from the get go. Felton was just a backup plan that has happened to work out real well for us.

    I like Grunwald and what he's done, but its ok to admit they made a mistake. Fact remains we let a 23 year old PG who was on top of the world go for absolutely nothing and had to turn around and use every remaining asset we had to get Felton.

    I thought Lin was on par with Felton, I may have been wrong about that, although I think he would have done better here. But my whole thing was, you don't let a guy like that go for nothing.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    STILLA, don't kid yourself.

    The reason NY let Lin go had nothing to do with money, or with them thinking he couldn't play. They pegged him as the starting PG, Woodson came out and said so, took the kid out to dinner, even came out in the paper and said NY would "absolutely" match the offer.

    Mind you, this is while Felton was readily available and we still had even our MMLE to sign him outright and our S&T pieces.

    Alot of things that we don't know about happened when Lin got the new offer, jealousy among teammates, Dolan feeling like he was crossed...etc... But prior to that, NY was absolutely ready to make Lin the starting PG.

    Heck even one Knick official was asked when they passed on Lin, "who he thought was the better player now and for the future", and he said "Probably Lin".

    So I think you're trying to give NY's FO too much credit on this one. The fact remains they handled it poorly. If they really felt strongly that he was not a starting caliber PG as you claim, they would have been looking for a S&T with HOU and they would have gone hard after Felton from the get go. Felton was just a backup plan that has happened to work out real well for us.

    I like Grunwald and what he's done, but its ok to admit they made a mistake. Fact remains we let a 23 year old PG who was on top of the world go for absolutely nothing and had to turn around and use every remaining asset we had to get Felton.

    I thought Lin was on par with Felton, I may have been wrong about that, although I think he would have done better here. But my whole thing was, you don't let a guy like that go for nothing.
    why would Houston want a S&T with NY or any othe team for that matter when he was free to sign and give up nobody like they did?

    we let a 24 yr old pg go and have a much better 28 yr old pg..............no matter what you have to credit the GM............


    Nothing? 25 mil saved, and Felton cost $10.8 for the next 3 years.

    So if you say Lin is not on par with Felton and we saved almost 16 mil dollars and another 50 mil in lux tax how is that nothing?

    I don't think Lin works at all with our roster, heck he don't even work with one star?

    He will at best an average pg, and we have better than that for our roster for the next 3yrs and knowing Felton even more.

    Heck you can't even say Lin has a longer life span than Ray, their bodies are so different, Ray is like Kidd and he will play till his 41.......I truly don't believe Lin will last as long.

    And I'll go one step further, we will get a pg of the future to first back up Ray and learn from him then take over. And this pg will be better than Lin.

    There are so many very talented young Pg's playing now and in college right now, its hard to dispute this. We do have a couple first round picks in the next 3 years so I'm very confident in this fact.

    We got Shump at #17 right? You just never know.



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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    why would Houston want a S&T with NY or any othe team for that matter when he was free to sign and give up nobody like they did?

    we let a 24 yr old pg go and have a much better 28 yr old pg..............no matter what you have to credit the GM............


    Nothing? 25 mil saved, and Felton cost $10.8 for the next 3 years.

    So if you say Lin is not on par with Felton and we saved almost 16 mil dollars and another 50 mil in lux tax how is that nothing?

    I don't think Lin works at all with our roster, heck he don't even work with one star?

    He will at best an average pg, and we have better than that for our roster for the next 3yrs and knowing Felton even more.

    Heck you can't even say Lin has a longer life span than Ray, their bodies are so different, Ray is like Kidd and he will play till his 41.......I truly don't believe Lin will last as long.

    And I'll go one step further, we will get a pg of the future to first back up Ray and learn from him then take over. And this pg will be better than Lin.

    There are so many very talented young Pg's playing now and in college right now, its hard to dispute this. We do have a couple first round picks in the next 3 years so I'm very confident in this fact.

    We got Shump at #17 right? You just never know.
    EVERYONE was under the impression that we would match just about anything. So NY could have explored a S&T. I'm not saying you were going to get back a stud player. But they could have gotten SOMETHING, HOU has ALOT of young players. And in a S&T scenario Lin would have cost HOU less. Hell they didn't want Kmart, could you imagine him on this roster? Ideal SG for us. Not sure if we could have matched salaries... but NY never even explored this because they thought all along Lin would be the starting PG. So you're giving them too much credit as if they planned this all along.

    And HOU wasn't the only team interested, Lin reportedly had 3 teams lined up to speak to...

    That's pretty much my point, NY didn't decide "Lin is not the real deal, let's let him go". They were backed into that position and scrambled to get Felton.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    EVERYONE was under the impression that we would match just about anything. So NY could have explored a S&T. I'm not saying you were going to get back a stud player. But they could have gotten SOMETHING, HOU has ALOT of young players. And in a S&T scenario Lin would have cost HOU less. Hell they didn't want Kmart, could you imagine him on this roster? Ideal SG for us. Not sure if we could have matched salaries... but NY never even explored this because they thought all along Lin would be the starting PG. So you're giving them too much credit as if they planned this all along.

    And HOU wasn't the only team interested, Lin reportedly had 3 teams lined up to speak to...

    That's pretty much my point, NY didn't decide "Lin is not the real deal, let's let him go". They were backed into that position and scrambled to get Felton.
    K-mart would be nice. I don't get why it's so hard to admit, Felton was the back-up option all intentions were to sign Lin, I Agree with you on that part, even though things were a bit sketchy, since word came out Felton said he would be a knick during Dolans Christmas party, so who knows. Also I agree there is no way Lin would be this awful with us under Woody and Kidd that's my guess. Look at how Kidd has already helped Ray.

    If the Knicks thought Lin wasn't the real deal they should have done a S&T for anybody like we did with David Lee. It makes no sense to let him walk for nothing, which makes you think the initial intention was to match like you said.

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