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  1. #1
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    How in the world did the Celtics in 1990 lose to the Knicks in the playoffs?

    How in the world did the Celtics in 1990 lose to the Knicks in the playoffs?

    Celtics were 52-30 that year while the Knicks were 45-37.


    Mchale, Bird, Parish, Lewis and DJ all played 75+ games that year.


    In the 1st round series the Celtics were up 2-0 and then lost 3 in a row including the last game of the series at home.

    In that playoffs:

    Bird averaged 24/9/9 on 44% with a PER of 21
    Mchale averaged 22/9/3 on 61% with a PER of 20
    Parish averaged 16/10/3 on 57% with a PER of 19
    Lewis averaged 20/5/5 on 60% with a PER of 18
    DJ averaged 14/3/6 on 48% with a PER of 12


    For the Knicks Ewing averaged 28/10/3 on 52% with a PER of 25 and then Wilkins was the next highest scorer at 15/4/5 on 46% FG with a PER of 16.
    "Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
    - Michael Jordan

    Thanks MJ-Bulls for the picture.

  2. #2
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    Who knows, your stats make it seem like the celts had the upper hand. Knicks must have had great bench play.

  3. #3
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    Of the old war horses only Parish had a big year at age 37.

    McHale had broken his foot 3 years earlier and was never the same, and this was the first of his serious decline years.

    Bird was two years post back problems (serious ones), and in the second year of his steep decline, with only one more year left.

    The team really revolved around a new nucleus: Gamble, Lewis, Shaw, Pinckney, Brown.

    Gamble had his best year as a pro, but was a dog IMO; he went from 15.6/3.3/3.1 to 6.0/1.2/1.7 in the playoffs. The other 4 guys all did well in the playoffs with Shaw probably having the biggest lag, but it wasn't so bad.

    The rest of the bench: Kleine, Smith, etc. was nothing. The team cohesion was way down over a few years earlier because frankly Parish wasn't a leader and the Bird and Mchale were on their last legs. The guard situation was in control of a very young crew:

    Shaw 24, Brown 22, Lewis 25, Gamble 25

    So the reason was Bird & McHale were falling apart, and Gamble was a stiff in the playoffs. Chris Ford wasn't any great coach either.

    p.s. Outside of Shaw, Brown, Lewis and hopes for the future I did not enjoy watching this team, there was the obvious playoff failure looming, no way this team could win, and they didn't.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    told you all since 2010 he was a toolbag.....

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Of the old war horses only Parish had a big year at age 37.

    McHale had broken his foot 3 years earlier and was never the same, and this was the first of his serious decline years.

    Bird was two years post back problems (serious ones), and in the second year of his steep decline, with only one more year left.

    The team really revolved around a new nucleus: Gamble, Lewis, Shaw, Pinckney, Brown.

    Gamble had his best year as a pro, but was a dog IMO; he went from 15.6/3.3/3.1 to 6.0/1.2/1.7 in the playoffs. The other 4 guys all did well in the playoffs with Shaw probably having the biggest lag, but it wasn't so bad.

    The rest of the bench: Kleine, Smith, etc. was nothing. The team cohesion was way down over a few years earlier because frankly Parish wasn't a leader and the Bird and Mchale were on their last legs. The guard situation was in control of a very young crew:

    Shaw 24, Brown 22, Lewis 25, Gamble 25

    So the reason was Bird & McHale were falling apart, and Gamble was a stiff in the playoffs. Chris Ford wasn't any great coach either.

    p.s. Outside of Shaw, Brown, Lewis and hopes for the future I did not enjoy watching this team, there was the obvious playoff failure looming, no way this team could win, and they didn't.
    I can understand losing to the Pistons or Bulls that year, but still not a reason to lose to the Knicks.
    "Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
    - Michael Jordan

    Thanks MJ-Bulls for the picture.

  5. #5
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    Too many inexperienced kids, the foremost of them in the regular season failing totally in the playoffs. Poor cohesion between that group and the old guys, and Bird and McHale on life support. Outside of some names that team did not bear resemblance to the great team of '85-'86. They had weakened each year since that team and the last ring. Other guys like Ainge, DJ, Walton were long gone.

    How come the '68-'69 Celtics didn't win the title? Why did the Jabbar/Magic Lakers lose twice to the obviously inferior Rockets team?

    **** changes.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    told you all since 2010 he was a toolbag.....

  6. #6
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    Weren't the Knicks, despite the regular season record, a young team on the rise? Is it that hard to believe they couldn't pull an upset of a washed up Celtics squad?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hangtime View Post
    Weren't the Knicks, despite the regular season record, a young team on the rise? Is it that hard to believe they couldn't pull an upset of a washed up Celtics squad?
    Up and coming? Yeah. Never did make it - then or later.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    told you all since 2010 he was a toolbag.....

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Up and coming? Yeah. Never did make it - then or later.
    Nah, they didn't quite make it but at the time they were becoming perenial playoff contenders and the Celtics were becoming perenial lottery pickers. Knicks were becoming a better team than the aging Celts.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hangtime View Post
    Nah, they didn't quite make it but at the time they were becoming perenial playoff contenders and the Celtics were becoming perenial lottery pickers. Knicks were becoming a better team than the aging Celts.
    Would have been interesting to see them play in 1992 as well.
    "Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
    - Michael Jordan

    Thanks MJ-Bulls for the picture.

  10. #10
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    Some say after 1989 nothing of Bird should count because of his back injury.
    "Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
    - Michael Jordan

    Thanks MJ-Bulls for the picture.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JordansBulls View Post
    Some say after 1989 nothing of Bird should count because of his back injury.
    Bird says looking back he should have retired as soon as it happened. He went through a lot of pain and disappointment in those years.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    told you all since 2010 he was a toolbag.....

  12. #12
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    We beat them with youth and enthusiasm. I will always remember Bird scored on Johnny Newman and then Newman went right back and dunked on Larry Bird. My dad said the Knicks had no chance before the series and then laughed when I said we would sweep the last 3. Patrick had a monster game 4. We dominated them on the boards with Patrick and Oaks. Bird was still hard to stop. Patrick really stepped up.
    I'm always happy to discuss anything from hoops, to hockey, to reality TV with anyone that is polite regardless of their opinion. With that said if you are disrespectful, dishonest, or an extremist type poster I may not waste my time replying to you.

  13. #13
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    I vaguely remember that series, but I do remember believing wholeheartedly that the Knicks would win the series. I was 13 years old and was just really becoming the die hard Knick fan that I am today...

    Patrick destroyed the Celtics in the last 3 games of the series...



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hylBSIMbeZg

    Game 5 highlights full game breakdown, check Pat's series stats @ 5 min. mark...
    Me & Mrs. D'Antoni @ The Garden

  14. #14
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    ewing

    Quote Originally Posted by JordansBulls View Post
    Some say after 1989 nothing of Bird should count because of his back injury.

    blasphemous player that are good enough to play always should hang on if they want and we never would have gotten to see flashbacks like the Bird Riflemen duel in 91
    Rep Power: 0




    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  15. #15
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    b/c youre biased against anyone who shamed Jordan in his career (Bird), thus you seem to think Bird didn't have back problems and ankle surgery, and that Parish wasn't 37, or that McHale wasn't old and hobbled due to a bad broken foot 3 years before, or that their bench wasn't crap.

    or that Ewing didn't have his best year of his career that year, or that the Knicks had good depth, or that they were much younger.

    yea let's judge the 1990 old as freakin dirt Celtics on a series that went the distance. let's ignore what Bird did the year AFTER against the Pacers.

    hey while youre at it, let's talk about MJ on the Wizards and all the playoff games he played in, or all the sweeps he didn't have against Bird, and then after, all the humiliation the Pistons put him through.

    caz that never happened. LOL

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