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  1. #61
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    Does signing bonus count toward payroll?
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    "[He's] a really complete player... There's not really any weaknesses to his game." - Bill Belichick on Andrew Luck
    "Vontae Davis looks like Bumgarner of the San Francisco Giants. He's throwing a no hitter out there tonight" - Jon Gruden

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by preacherman View Post
    CSN Bay Area reports the salary breakdown as follows:

    "Pagan will receive a $5 million signing bonus and annual salaries of $7 million salary in 2013, $9 million in '14, $9 million in '15 and $10 million in '16."

    The signing bonus took a little of the "sting" out of it...
    Already posted mang.

    2010, 2012, and 2014 World Series Champions

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfgiants5518 View Post
    Does signing bonus count toward payroll?
    I would guess no.

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  4. #64
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    I can live with 4/40. When you see Hunter getting 13, and Upton getting 15...10 all of a sudden doesn't look that bad. Especially when you see we were desperate for some outfielders.

    The thing that is scary with Pagan though is you really do not know if he will be a consistent performer. Which is the reason he 'only' got 10 mil I would assume. If he performs like he did in 2012 this deal looks extremely good. However, he is just one year removed from basically being given away by the Mets. He also had a two month lull in the middle of the season where he looked like the worst player ever. I'm always a bit concerned with players like him who burst onto the scene in their late 20s.

    But, I would have done this deal at 4/40 if you told me at the beginning of the offseason so I'm content with it.


    The one caveat though is we still need another outfielder now. If Sabean had signed Swisher we could have gotten by with just that, but assuming Pagan is playing center we can't afford to have Blanco be the everyday LFer. His bat is too weak for a corner position.

  5. #65
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    Here's fangraphs:


    Angel Pagan just signed with the San Francisco Giants. $40 million for four years might seem like a slight overpay in terms of years, but this is obviously a team trying to win now, and they did just make a little extra coin that they can spend in order to stay competitive.

    Stop me if you’ve heard this before. Similar justifications were probably made when Aubrey Huff helped power the Giants to their first World Series title and was subsequently signed to an ill-fated deal. This is Angel Pagan, though. Not Aubrey Huff.

    In the year before the year the Giants won their first title, Huff was worse than replacement. He then put up six wins on the way to a title, and was rewarded with a contract. In the year before the year the Giants won their second title, Pagan was just a smidge above replacement. He then put up five wins on the way to a title, and was rewarded with a contract.

    The similarities end there.

    Pagan turns 32 next season, Huff was 34 in 2011. Pagan plays a premium up-the-middle defensive position at least to a scratch level, Huff finished his career worse than scratch with the glove at first base. Most importantly, there were key indicators that suggested that Huff’s 2010 was out of line with his career work, and those indicators are mostly absent when it comes to Pagan. Here are some of Pagan’s key numbers for last season, compared to his career:
    AVG OBP SLG BB% K% Speed wRC+ UZR/150
    2012 0.288 0.338 0.440 7.3% 14.7% 7.8 113 -0.1
    Career 0.277 0.333 0.424 7.6% 14.9% 7.4 104 -0.8

    Pretty close, right? Huff, in 2010, showed a walk rate that hit double digits for the first time in his career, at age 33. His speed score was above average for the only time in his career. And though the decline may not have been obvious through all the oscillation, if you looked at his career as a whole and ignored the seasons, he was obviously on his way down.

    Pagan is going to decline through his contract. He’s 31 now, it happens. And it’s not like there aren’t any numbers that were slightly outside of his norm last season — his isolated slugging percentage in 2012 was higher than it had been in a full season. He’s got faults, too. His routes in center field leave him short of scratch defensively in center field, and sometimes he makes mistakes on the basepaths. He’s still a valuable defender — 2011 looks like the outlier when it comes to defensive metrics — and he still adds value while running the bases.

    The contract is so reasonable that he’d have to fall off in Huff-ian fashion not to make it a good one. $40 million over four years is paying him like he’s basically a two and a half win player (assuming $5.5 million per win and inflation). As long as he hits a few doubles, steals some bases, and plays scratch-ish defense in center field, Pagan should be able to manage that easily. This is all assuming his knees look better at the end of this contract than Huff’s did. Those two years make all the difference in that respect.
    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index...t-aubrey-huff/
    #3in5


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    "[He's] a really complete player... There's not really any weaknesses to his game." - Bill Belichick on Andrew Luck
    "Vontae Davis looks like Bumgarner of the San Francisco Giants. He's throwing a no hitter out there tonight" - Jon Gruden

  6. #66
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    Fair deal all around. If it ain't broke don't fix it!
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  7. #67
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    #3in5


    <3
    "[He's] a really complete player... There's not really any weaknesses to his game." - Bill Belichick on Andrew Luck
    "Vontae Davis looks like Bumgarner of the San Francisco Giants. He's throwing a no hitter out there tonight" - Jon Gruden

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfgiants5518 View Post
    Does signing bonus count toward payroll?
    It comes out of Giants' bank account. Does it matter if counts or not?
    Today is the future that you have built (or neglected) yesterday.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by lethalfang View Post
    It comes out of Giants' bank account. Does it matter if counts or not?
    Yes because the Giants have set budgets, and i want them to improve their team as much as they can.
    #3in5


    <3
    "[He's] a really complete player... There's not really any weaknesses to his game." - Bill Belichick on Andrew Luck
    "Vontae Davis looks like Bumgarner of the San Francisco Giants. He's throwing a no hitter out there tonight" - Jon Gruden

  10. #70
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    My concern is we still don't have a great leadoff guy who can create runs with his legs... Pagan would be very good in the 7 spot between belt and Crawford

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by allvalleychamp View Post
    My concern is we still don't have a great leadoff guy who can create runs with his legs... Pagan would be very good in the 7 spot between belt and Crawford
    Pagan will be the lead off guy and has good speed. Whenever Brown is ready, hopefully at the start of next season at the latest, then they can slide Pagan down.

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  12. #72
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    Confirmed: Giants sign Angel Pagan - 4 years/40 mil

    I honestly have lost all faith in Gary brown. I doubt he ever becomes an effective big league starter.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by lincecum=future View Post
    I honestly have lost all faith in Gary brown. I doubt he ever becomes an effective big league starter.
    He had one down year in the minors. Why lose hope so quickly? If he does it again this year then I might join you.

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  14. #74
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    I'm glad he's back, I'm glad we didn't spend too much on him and that's all I have to say. Scoots next please.
    Last edited by jonnydanger1; 12-03-2012 at 09:36 PM.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by allvalleychamp View Post
    My concern is we still don't have a great leadoff guy who can create runs with his legs... Pagan would be very good in the 7 spot between belt and Crawford
    I thought Pagan was a very solid lead off hitter. He has wheels and has hit for a good average his last 4 years in the pros.

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