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  1. #16
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    don't worry im not saying beasely is one of our best players, so spare me the 'oh Beasely is the worst player in the league! Beasely this! Beasely that!' My God Phrazbit! I did not mention beasely nor even alluded to him. I swear man, your whining about Beasely is borderline obsessive!

    We don't have established players? That's the coach's fault/problem, he benches his starters in the second half, his rotation sucks, causing our already bum players (accdg to you) inconsistent minutes thereby no chance to redeem/develop themselves. he lost twice already to Orlando who has the youngest coach in the league, who does not have the Lebrons, the Durants of the league.

    He constantly tweaks his lineup without changing the offensive/defensive plays, no wonder the already 'bum players' (again accdg to you) are inconsistent -- you might say, "oh its all the players' fault, esp beasely" fact of the matter is his only reaction to the losses, inconsistent play is, to change starters, or bench the players ride the hot hand, that wont last you long (shown in fact by the 7-15 record)

    Defend him all you want, never give him any accountability for all the losses, blame it all on the players, hide behind the excuse of having bum players so he can't do anything about it.fact is he lost 7 straight!

    i cant believe you give him so much credit (the suns won because he rode the hot hands, etc etc.) and yet never give him any accountability for the losses.
    Last edited by rocky4104; 12-10-2012 at 08:03 PM.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky4104 View Post
    don't worry im not saying beasely is one of our best players, so spare me the 'oh Beasely is the worst player in the league! Beasely this! Beasely that!' My God Phrazbit! I did not mention beasely nor even alluded to him. I swear man, your whining about Beasely is borderline obsessive!

    We don't have established players? That's the coach's fault/problem, he benches his starters in the second half, his rotation sucks, causing our already bum players (accdg to you) inconsistent minutes thereby no chance to redeem/develop themselves. he lost twice already to Orlando who has the youngest coach in the league, who does not have the Lebrons, the Durants of the league.

    He constantly tweaks his lineup without changing the offensive/defensive plays, no wonder the already 'bum players' (again accdg to you) are inconsistent

    Defend him all you want, never give him any accountability for all the losses, blame it all on the players, hide behind the excuse of having bum players so he can't do anything about it.fact is he lost 7 straight!
    Exactly. I know Beasley has been under performing ALOT but if Beasley is really the problem then Gentry's job is to bench him and give him as little minutes as possible, if any that is. I'm not saying let Beasley rot but if Phraz is right then Gentry has to say ok Beasley deuces.

  3. #18
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    Things are going badly for the Phoenix Suns, but not badly enough for the team to consider making a coaching change.

    A day after the Suns lost their seventh straight game to fall to 7-15, team owner Robert Sarver told ESPN.com that coach Alvin Gentry's job is safe.

    "We've got confidence in our coaching staff and we're not considering making changes," Sarver said in a telephone interview Monday.

    The Suns entered the season with playoff aspirations after an active summer that saw them sign Goran Dragic, Michael Beasley and Luis Scola as free agents. Instead, they're in 14th place in the Western Conference and in the midst of their longest losing streak since February 2004.

    Still, Sarver is preaching patience.

    "It's still early in the season," he said. "We're playing worse than our talent, and a lot of that has to do with confidence. It's up to the coaches and players to start playing better and to get that swagger back and turn things around. Things can turn quickly in this league."

    Gentry has been the Suns' coach since taking over for Terry Porter late in the 2008-2009 season. He led the Suns to 54 wins and the Western Conference finals the following season, but has not reached the playoffs since.

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    Per ESPN

  5. #20
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    I dont think Gentry is a great coach, I am not trying to say he is awesome. But our problem is NOT the coaching. I think anyone who is objective would look at our roster and not be even remotely surprised at our record.

    He has a team of guys who dont stand out and virtually all of them have been given plenty of opportunity to solidify their role but none of them have done it. We have 2 players on our entire team capable of being starters in this league and even they are wildly inconsistent and always have been. I dont see how you can blame the coach and want his head when you look at the dudes he is forced to give minutes to night after night.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrazbit View Post
    I dont think Gentry is a great coach, I am not trying to say he is awesome. But our problem is NOT the coaching. I think anyone who is objective would look at our roster and not be even remotely surprised at our record.

    He has a team of guys who dont stand out and virtually all of them have been given plenty of opportunity to solidify their role but none of them have done it. We have 2 players on our entire team capable of being starters in this league and even they are wildly inconsistent and always have been. I dont see how you can blame the coach and want his head when you look at the dudes he is forced to give minutes to night after night.
    so Gentry, the head coach, is TOTALLY blameless for ALL the losses? entirely the players (including beasely, a player you hate so much) fault? how totally objective you are man. Basketball is a team sport, you win as a team, you lose as a team.
    Last edited by rocky4104; 12-10-2012 at 08:29 PM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky4104 View Post
    so Gentry, the head coach, is TOTALLY blameless for ALL the losses? entirely the players (including beasely, a player you hate so much) fault? how totally objective you are man. Basketball is a team sport, you win as a team, you lose as a team.
    ... we have an awful TEAM. Our TEAM does not match up in terms of talent with just about anyone we play against. I am not saying Gentry is a great coach, I explicitly stated that I dont think he is a great coach. But it is utterly absurd to put the blame on the coach when the front office put together an abhorrent roster.

    My point is firing the coach changes nothing because we have a bad TEAM. You are not addressing the real problem. You can sit there and put words in my mouth all you want and claim I think Gentry is great... but the facts are plain, this roster is bad, very bad. There was no one outside of Suns fan message boards who thought this Suns team was going to be anything besides what they are.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrazbit View Post
    ... we have an awful TEAM. Our TEAM does not match up in terms of talent with just about anyone we play against. I am not saying Gentry is a great coach, I explicitly stated that I dont think he is a great coach. But it is utterly absurd to put the blame on the coach when the front office put together an abhorrent roster.

    My point is firing the coach changes nothing because we have a bad TEAM. You are not addressing the real problem. You can sit there and put words in my mouth all you want and claim I think Gentry is great... but the facts are plain, this roster is bad, very bad. There was no one outside of Suns fan message boards who thought this Suns team was going to be anything besides what they are.
    hey, don't get me wrong, we do have a bad team. i am actually on the 'lets keep this team and tank the season bandwagon'. thats what i think of the team.

    when did i say that you think gentry is great? if i did, that's not my intent.

    my point is, if you still dont get it with all our back and forth in this matter (diff threads!) why do you not blame at least some of the failure of the team on the HEAD COACH? you wanna defend gentry fine. i ask you again, EVENTHOUGH we have an awful team, do you really think that this coach is infallible? that he is entirely not at fault? that he absolutely cannot work with this bunch of bums? he is TOTALLY BLAMELESS? Is it all the players' fault? he plays no part at all on the failures of the team, the head coach?

    simply put, the 7-15 record: since we have an awful team, that means that the 7 wins are all to Gentry's credit? simply because he works with all bums? and the 15 losses are ALL the bum players' fault?
    Last edited by rocky4104; 12-10-2012 at 09:13 PM.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky4104 View Post
    hey, don't get me wrong, we do have a bad team. i am actually on the 'lets keep this team and tank the season bandwagon'. thats what i think of the team.

    when did i say that you think gentry is great? if i did, that's not my intent.

    my point is, if you still dont get it with all our back and forth in this matter (diff threads!) why do you not blame at least some of the failure of the team on the HEAD COACH? you wanna defend gentry fine. i ask you again, EVENTHOUGH we have an awful team, do you really think that this coach is infallible? that he is entirely not at fault? that he absolutely cannot work with this bunch of bums? he is TOTALLY BLAMELESS? Is it all the players' fault? he plays no part at all on the failures of the team, the head coach?

    simply put, the 7-15 record: since we have an awful team, that means that the 7 wins are all to Gentry's credit? simply because he works with all bums? and the 15 losses are ALL the bum players' fault?
    I think for all the critique of his rotations, the fact that he has been so flexible with who is playing and who isnt on a night to night basis is what got the Suns the majority of their 7 wins. People are saying that the "starters" are not getting enough playing time but if you look back through our games (wins and our losses) its very hard to pin point any look that has actually worked for more than a few quarters. I dont think he is infallible, not at all, and there have probably been a game here and there where something different would have worked better, but this team requires a lot of guess work to figure out what might work on a given night, and there for no matter what he does he is going to get second guessed.

    And its not all the bum players fault, its the bum front offices fault for assembling this disaster.

    Dont get me wrong, Gentry WILL get fired at some point because he is in an impossible position. He is in the final year of his contract, with a bad team, that the front office insanely put playoff aspirations in AND at the same time is supposed to be building for the future. Thats where the biggest problem with keeping or not keeping Gentry comes in. Claiming the team is supposed to compete while rebuilding... and all with a coach on a lame duck deal. Its dumb. You've got a coach being forced to make short term decisions because of his contract but he is coaching a team that needs to be building for the long term. Its absolutely idiotic that the team does not either extend him or replace him.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrazbit View Post
    I think for all the critique of his rotations, the fact that he has been so flexible with who is playing and who isnt on a night to night basis is what got the Suns the majority of their 7 wins. People are saying that the "starters" are not getting enough playing time but if you look back through our games (wins and our losses) its very hard to pin point any look that has actually worked for more than a few quarters. I dont think he is infallible, not at all, and there have probably been a game here and there where something different would have worked better, but this team requires a lot of guess work to figure out what might work on a given night, and there for no matter what he does he is going to get second guessed.

    And its not all the bum players fault, its the bum front offices fault for assembling this disaster.

    Dont get me wrong, Gentry WILL get fired at some point because he is in an impossible position. He is in the final year of his contract, with a bad team, that the front office insanely put playoff aspirations in AND at the same time is supposed to be building for the future. Thats where the biggest problem with keeping or not keeping Gentry comes in. Claiming the team is supposed to compete while rebuilding... and all with a coach on a lame duck deal. Its dumb. You've got a coach being forced to make short term decisions because of his contract but he is coaching a team that needs to be building for the long term. Its absolutely idiotic that the team does not either extend him or replace him.
    Thank you! eventhough you gave me a very long-winded answer to a very simple question of whether a head coach, eventhough coaching horrible players, eventhough employed by a horrible front office, should be held, at the very least, some accountability for the team's failure.

    personally, a team with a lack of talent such as this team should have a competent coach, have you not seen 'Hoosiers' or 'Coach Carter'?

    i am for keeping gentry now though, he is coaching the team to a high draft pick next year

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky4104 View Post
    Thank you! eventhough you gave me a very long-winded answer to a very simple question of whether a head coach, eventhough coaching horrible players, eventhough employed by a horrible front office, should be held, at the very least, some accountability for the team's failure.

    personally, a team with a lack of talent such as this team should have a competent coach, have you not seen 'Hoosiers' or 'Coach Carter'?


    i am for keeping gentry now though, he is coaching the team to a high draft pick next year
    I just dont see any indication the Gentry is the any worse than anything else we could get, especially at mid season. And I honestly think there are a lot of coaches who could do far far worse. You dont get to the WCF like Gentry did in 2010 with aging stars and a patch work of roles players if you're an awful coach.

    If the goal is entirely to tank then Gentry is probably the wrong guy for the job because there are a lot worse coaches out there.

    And if your goal is to make the playoffs... then good luck. Because Red Auerbach couldnt coach this trainwreck to a winning record.

  12. #27
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    ^^^Did you not see how Richardson was playing. He could literally carry us for stretches along with Stat and that made Nash's job easier. That team had the perfect mix of players. That Lopez injury was brutal and he was never the same. All Gentry did was bring back the Mike D system after Porter got fired.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrazbit View Post
    I just dont see any indication the Gentry is the any worse than anything else we could get, especially at mid season. And I honestly think there are a lot of coaches who could do far far worse. You dont get to the WCF like Gentry did in 2010 with aging stars and a patch work of roles players if you're an awful coach.

    If the goal is entirely to tank then Gentry is probably the wrong guy for the job because there are a lot worse coaches out there.

    And if your goal is to make the playoffs... then good luck. Because Red Auerbach couldnt coach this trainwreck to a winning record.
    there you go again! giving all the credit to him and none to the players!

    2010 Suns - aging stars? you mean Old Grant Hill playing effective defense against established young stars? or Old J-Rich averaging almost 20 points a game? or old Stevie with 11.4 assists (was he number 1 or 2 that year?) and almost 15 points? old guys my ***... not a championship caliber team but a playoff team nonetheless.

    not saying he's the worst coach in the league right now, he's down ther ethough. he's at best an assistant coach, someone who's great at motivating players and cultivating a good rapport with his team - that does not make you a great coach in my book

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mdm692 View Post
    ^^^Did you not see how Richardson was playing. He could literally carry us for stretches along with Stat and that made Nash's job easier. That team had the perfect mix of players. That Lopez injury was brutal and he was never the same. All Gentry did was bring back the Mike D system after Porter got fired.

    He did it playing better defense than any of Mike D's teams did and he actually utilized his bench to a fantastic degree... something Mike D NEVER did.

  15. #30
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    Doesn’t matter who the blame falls on, players or coaches end of the day it’s a combined effort. Gentry is not that great and this team is not that great. Gentry IMO is a great assistant coach, But we need a great head coach that can change the whole out look of this team.

    As much as it sucks, this team is far from the Nash SSOL. We need to move on and develop a new identity. Even Phil Jackson or Jerry Sloan couldn’t help this team with where it’s at right now for this season. But in saying that, It would be great to get a coach like those guys to take on this team and bring a different culture to this ball club.

    As it stands now this team is not doing anything and there is no point sacking Gentry. Only way I would do that is if we could lock in Sloan or Jackson for a few years that way we have them for the next off season and they can start working at next season early, but let’s be honest, can’t see that happening and I doubt Saver would wanna spend money on another coach just to end up in the same situation we are in now. We need to tank and get a good pick, No more of this stuck in the middle crap, it’s pointless.

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