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  1. #91
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    mets is 100% on the money here

  2. #92
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    I'm going to assume that the lack of further discussion means this system is genius.


    If You Ain't Huckin, You Ain't ****in

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by metsrock229 View Post
    I'm going to assume that the lack of further discussion means this system is genius.
    I don't tihnk its as good as mine!

    Mine solves two problems.

  4. #94
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    Since you all asked what I mean by two problems I shall explain.

    The main problem everyone is complaining about right now (besides number of GM's) is the no compensation for letting a FA go, and with that then there is no big talent available in FA market.

    The other thing this is causing is basically making no financial concerns. As it stands right now every single team has the maximum amount of money they can have. Of those 24 teams only 5 are projected to have a net negative this year:

    Brewers: -$415,623
    Twins: -$1,373,265
    Astros: -$3,724,691
    Phillies: -$5,539,502
    Tigers: -$28,848,518

    Phillies could be in a tiny bit of trouble being down to only 15 million, and myself well I am in trouble, but only for a year as I signed a 30 million dollar player to a one year deal. The reason I did that was because well I knew I would have no problem making financial ends meet in the future.

    Looking at the 5 teams their salary next year drops by: 7.3M, 4.6M, 14.3M, 18.3M, 38.7M. So in reality every single one of these teams (if they do nothing) will be again at the maximum by the end of next season.

    No one has a money issue in this league, so this makes it even dumber to let someone go because well its not going to hurt them to keep them on the team.

    So again I bring back the NBA thing where you can match a teams extension (well beat it by X%), in order to cause the original team to spend more of their money or let them go to the other team (of course other teams can beat that offer and its almost sort of an open bidding type thing. Now to beat the deal you would have to beat the offer by 10% lets say, and the original team would have to make an offer that would be at least 95% of the opposing teams offer.

    So lets take the Barry Bonds example. Lets say he is extended for 5 years 10 million per. I would have to make an offer for 5 years 11 million. To which the Cubs would have to reoffer him at least 10.45 per year, to which another team would have to reoffer him at least 11.5 million per and so on and so on.

    Now in order for this to happen we would have to say that extensions be done by a certain amount of time or that extensions could be matched beaten through out FA or something.

    Now if we want compensation we could do a draft pick thing that I would propose be something like this.

    Using a similar proponent to TKO's A,B,C,D,E type system but with draft picks.

    Type A (under age 29 worth 100 VORP last two years): Team who beat the extension would lose their first round draft pick to the team that lost the player. 1/2 point would be added to each of the 5 or 3 major attributes for the draft pick. So if they got the first draft pick then no points would be added. the 15th pick 7 points would be added to each attribute and so on. So the number would be rounded down.

    Type B/C (over 29 with 100 VORP or under 29 with 75 VORP) Team who beat the extension would lose their first round draft pick to the team that lost the player. 1/3 point would be added to each of the 5 or 3 major attributes for the draft pick. So if they got the first draft pick then no points would be added. the 15th pick 5 points would be added to each attribute and so on. So the number would be rounded up at .67. First 5 draft picks would be protected and the second round pick would instead be given. Team that received pick would be allowed to draft their own player.

    Type D (over 29 with 75 VORP) Team who beat the extension would lose their first round draft pick to the team that lost the player. 1/4 point would be added to each of the 5 or 3 major attributes for the draft pick. So if they got the first draft pick then no points would be added. the 15th pick 4 points would be added to each attribute and so on. So the number would be rounded up at .5 and .75. First 10 draft picks would be protected and the second round pick would instead be given. Team that received pick would be allowed to draft their own player.

    Now with this plan we would have to eliminate draft pick trading, and this would also allow a team to only sign one player away from another team per year.

    Timing of a team to match the other teams offer would have to be put in but that could easily be figured out if you guys liked this idea.

    Anyhow just what I have been kicking around in my head. Because I think one thing people are over looking is that no one is really under any financial burden and teams (like what I did) could offer up a huge amount of money to a minor league FA. Although he is 5 and ****ing 15.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by poodski View Post

    The other thing this is causing is basically making no financial concerns. As it stands right now every single team has the maximum amount of money they can have. Of those 24 teams only 5 are projected to have a net negative this year:

    Brewers: -$415,623
    Twins: -$1,373,265
    Astros: -$3,724,691
    Phillies: -$5,539,502
    Tigers: -$28,848,518

    Phillies could be in a tiny bit of trouble being down to only 15 million
    I haven't read the rest of the post yet, just noticed this and wanted to point out for accuracy that the figures you're quoting are just the "Projected Budget Room" from my team financial page, which has nothing to do with my team's actual overall financial standing. The only thing it is indicating is that I spent more than I was budgeted this year, which is pretty common in every league I've been in. It's when your payroll is above the amount of revenue you take in that you're in trouble.

    I'm actually already at a $4mil profit with one more sim and the playoffs left to go. My total profit for the season will be between $8mil-$10mil, with $20mil in cash as well. Milwaukee and Minnesota are both already at the point of turning a profit as well.

    I am not in danger...I AM the danger.

  6. #96
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    That proves my point even further. All but probably me will be at max cash next year.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by poodski View Post
    The main problem everyone is complaining about right now (besides number of GM's) is the no compensation for letting a FA go, and with that then there is no big talent available in FA market.
    First of all Po, thanks for taking the time to put what looks to be quite a bit of thought in to a potential solution. The thing is, the lack of a compensation system is not really the main problem nor would it be the solution to everything on its own. It isn't that simple. The real thing that has been threatening the continuation of the league is the inconsistent activity level. We have some new GMs and it's great to have fewer vacant spots for once, but we've been at this point many times already and we always have a few that flame out quickly and vanish, leaving us with open teams once again. On average we have had 4 teams vacant all the time, and the majority of the vets of the old PSD league and the TKO league that have either not participated or tried but didn't stay long admitted that the league just wasn't that fun for them. They're used to something with a higher activity level as far as trading and FA, the season chat, and competitiveness in general. We have always been missing that to some degree. Our season chat moves along, and we have some very competitive GMs, but we've also had tons of seasons where half the league clearly didn't care and just stuck around to kill time. I think that's a huge reason why a few of us have been so dominant. I'm far from the best OOTP GM from the old PSD league or the TKO league, yet I have the highest win percentage in the history of this league to go along with 15 playoff appearances and 4 titles. Luck played a part in it, and skill was a bit of the equation, but lack of significant competition has had a hell of a lot to do with my long term success.

    The true problem is inconsistent activity as a whole, with a pretty steady issue of keeping spots filled and keeping everyone interested. The things that contribute to that are a big fat circle of perpetuation, that keeps things good enough to get by but too boring for several people that didn't want to stick around. I think the three things that contribute to that most are the lack of an active trade market, consistently thin draft classes, and having the FA market every year be somewhat thin too.

    I think there are multiple things contributing to each of those issues as well, and they all kind of tie together. The trade market and the lack of activity essentially effect each other. Fewer GMs (and also fewer active ones that truly try) means less potential trade partners. But from there the options are always thinned even further because it is extremely tough to find a GM that you'll be compatible with as far as player values and availability of players that fit your needs and theirs. Most of us are used to something similar to MLB when it comes to trading...I have a superstar, you give me your top prospects and some other stuff and we have a deal. But in this league prospects are almost non-existent because draftees either develop very very quickly or die off and decline just as quickly. Once they're fully developed, the GM they belong to isn't as inclined to trade them because he now has a talented young future superstar making minimum wage and under team control for several seasons. Draft picks are generally a valuable commodity in other leagues too, but with the draft classes being thin (Bill, shut your mouth about potential boosters because that doesn't count at all) a first round pick isn't a great trade chip unless it's going to be a high pick, which could be difficult to predict obviously. A lack of prospects plus draft picks that won't usually get you an impact player equals no trade partners that can give you a solid return on your superstar.

    Which leads us to the lack of options in FA. This is obviously tied to the fact that not many GMs let their vets walk because keeping them is a no brainer. The extensions are affordable (which is generally the case in any league for the most part), there's no compensation if they walk, and there's little to no chance of getting a trade offer worth taking. There has been a lot of discussion of finances in this league in the past because players are overpaid all the time. Again...common in other leagues too. But in this one we're all overpaying for guys that aren't even that good because there's seldom an alternative. You can pay a guy $3mil to post a .650 OPS and hope you outbid the other couple GMs that have a need at that position, or settle for some other guy with similar or worse production. I'm not at all saying that the league is predominantly filled with players that can't post an OPS north of .650, but it is pretty common to have a guy like that be the best available option at a position during FA. Limiting the amount of extensions you can give would result in more higher end free agents (and more non-****** ones), but it also implements a new limit for helping GMs keep their own team competitive and ultimately they just end up bidding with everyone else. Those of us that can afford it will still sign the best players, and everyone else will still be relegated to the bottom of the standings. Staying competitive in this league is already very difficult because it is tough to replace a productive player if they leave or decline, unless you get lucky or spend a ton of money.

    Quote Originally Posted by poodski View Post
    Now with this plan we would have to eliminate draft pick trading, and this would also allow a team to only sign one player away from another team per year.
    Say goodbye to what's left of the non-existent trade market, which is what actually began this discussion. A better trade market, better FA and better draft classes will put us in the right direction and keep the league from dying off in another half dozen seasons. Doing anything to further hurt the trade market just makes it potentially worse, and if we implement a comp system that isn't even that much of a benefit due to the fact that impact prospects aren't part of the equation, then what are we actually gaining by making the change? More players will start hitting FA, but we will still see teams struggle to address their needs, we will still have a **** trade market, we will still have a huge lack of prospects in the farm system, and we will still end up with constant vacancies when GMs get bored or frustrated by the flaws and lack of activity in the league. I'm not saying I'm positive that the TKO comp system is the answer to all of our problems, maybe it is maybe it isn't. What I'm saying is I haven't seen anyone come up with a viable option that addresses all of our problems without trading them in for new problems that will be just as detrimental to the survival of the league. We need to be focused on addressing that...not just one detail.

    I am not in danger...I AM the danger.

  8. #98
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    Holy God in heaven. Way too many TL;DRs up in here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Impaler View Post
    Some posters like yourself don't understand how a single is better then a home run,
    #TWTW

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by poodski View Post
    That proves my point even further. All but probably me will be at max cash next year.
    Or...it means we have been fortunate to have our GMs be fiscally responsible the majority of the time. I've personally put quite a bit of effort in to explaining the ins and outs of the finances in this game to several of the GMs that don't own the game and can't see the full picture, or simply don't know. Everything from ticket prices and fan loyalty, to cash and total annual revenue. I honestly think the economy of this league is really tough to handle because it spans a period where baseball grew a ton from that standpoint. Player salaries, revenues and everything all kept getting bigger and bigger. We're actually not THAT far off of what the highest annual salary really was at this point in 1991. Aside from your $30mil player, $10mil is our top annual salary and by March 1992 the top salary was just over $7mil. I doubt there were a dozen guys making close to that like there is in our case though. But all in all, I don't feel a lack of potential financial issue is doing much. We're still all limited, we just don't get into budget trouble. That's a good thing, isn't it?

    I am not in danger...I AM the danger.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDIsMyGod23 View Post
    Holy God in heaven. Way too many TL;DRs up in here.
    Huh?

    I am not in danger...I AM the danger.

  11. #101
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    Comp Spec System Discussion...Again

    Tl;dr = too long, didnt read


    If You Ain't Huckin, You Ain't ****in

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDIsMyGod23 View Post
    Holy God in heaven. Way too many TL;DRs up in here.
    +1 but the basis of what I read from Az was that he would rather TKO's system than Pood's system, which I agree with.

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhillyLuver View Post
    +1 but the basis of what I read from Az was that he would rather TKO's system than Pood's system, which I agree with.
    While that is true, what I was really trying to say is that we have multiple issues that are contributing to one big issue. Making one or two minor changes that leave us in a similar state won't do much good. Whether it's the use of TKO's comp system or something else completely different, we have to find a way to resolve everything well enough to get the league running smoother with fewer vacancies and more activity.

    I am not in danger...I AM the danger.

  14. #104
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    Some input on my system would be nice


    If You Ain't Huckin, You Ain't ****in

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by metsrock229 View Post
    Some input on my system would be nice
    Considering its the most fair system for all gms, I am disappointed no one else was interested.

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