Comp Spec System Discussion...Again

[PhillyLuver]

The only way I would be ok with comp specs is if your comp was taking a teams draft pick or having a draft pick added to the draft.

I'm against adding any players. For a few reasons
1. This is a historic league. We should have random names like Beavis and Butthead
2. I've heard many people say that adding players changed the ratings system and were running fine.
3. It would be unfair to all the people that have been playing for the past year+ and lost out on chances to claim players

1. By that logic, we shouldn't just be cutting teams willy nilly because we can't find active GMs.
2. It clearly doesn't, TKO is no more volatile than this league.
3. By that logic, we could never really make any significant change because it would be unfair to people who didn't benefit from it before. If it's the right decision for the league, we have to go through with it regardless of what happened in the past.

Obviously this means I am all for it. Trading is half the fun in OOTP, and it's hardly a factor in this league. A lack of "activity," which is generally measured in trade volume, is what causes our GM problems in my opinion.

[PhillyLuver]

Whenever the vote is ready my vote will be no like last time, hate comp spects. The talent level is fine in this league, no reason to mess with that. We seem to be getting some new gms so why are we messing with this now? I thought we were figuring out contraction first.

Even with the new GMs, we only have 21. That is garbage compared to TKO's 30 plus 1 on the waiting list. I've tried recruiting people to the league and they say no thanks because they think there's nothing happening. I think anything that will fuel a trade market needs to be explored before we have even more GM problems. You can only contract so many times.

[sexicano31]

Want

[azazel529]

Even with the new GMs, we only have 21. That is garbage compared to TKO's 30 plus 1 on the waiting list. I've tried recruiting people to the league and they say no thanks because they think there's nothing happening. I think anything that will fuel a trade market needs to be explored before we have even more GM problems. You can only contract so many times.

Bingo. This may be a way to avoid having to proceed with contraction, or at least take a wait and see approach. And the comp system will lead to a more active trade market, more impact players hitting FA, and over time the draft will get a tad deeper too. Look how many GMs from the TKO league either take a look over here and don't bother, or sign up to give it a try and then vanish within a season. Most of them say "I don't have the free time for two leagues" because they're trying to be polite and avoid saying what they're thinking, which is "this league looks ****ing boring as ****".

It's because we're essentially caught in a mode of loading up whatever you can before opening day and then seeing how it pans out all season. Heck, in TKO I think I've pulled off like half a dozen trades since opening day and that's not at all uncommon. Rebuilding teams can acquire specs to replenish their farm easier, and competing teams can acquire stars or role players much easier because there are more people shopping/selling and the higher activity level helps that a ton.

Want

I'll be damned, look who made it off the shitlist. While you were gone we traded Bonds to Milwaukee for a cotton candy machine.

[sexicano31]

Hah! Jokes on you. I signed him to a 6 year extension!

[azazel529]

Hah! Jokes on you. I signed him to a 6 year extension!

That cotton candy machine walks for FA at the end of the season. Sucker!!!

[sexicano31]

Ugh you guys suck

[metsrock229]

1. By that logic, we shouldn't just be cutting teams willy nilly because we can't find active GMs.
2. It clearly doesn't, TKO is no more volatile than this league.
3. By that logic, we could never really make any significant change because it would be unfair to people who didn't benefit from it before. If it's the right decision for the league, we have to go through with it regardless of what happened in the past.

Obviously this means I am all for it. Trading is half the fun in OOTP, and it's hardly a factor in this league. A lack of "activity," which is generally measured in trade volume, is what causes our GM problems in my opinion.

Ratings have definitely changed in TKO as we progressed.

[PhillyLuver]

Ratings have definitely changed in TKO as we progressed.

What I meant is that players boost and die just as often in this league as in TKO. If you're talking about ratings getting inflated, I don't think that's been a major concern in TKO and isn't necessarily a bad thing. The competitive balance has remained even as ratings have gotten higher.

[Bill_R10]

Pl, people do a hystoric league for the players not the teams.

Once again I'm for a conp draft pick system, but I'm 100% against comp specs.

[PhillyLuver]

Pl, people do a hystoric league for the players not the teams.

Once again I'm for a conp draft pick system, but I'm 100% against comp specs.

Usually the purpose of historic leagues is to maintain a sense of reality. Like my Seattle Pilots becoming the Brewers, getting a stadium according to what actually happened, etc. This is why we don't have player edits and also why I'm hesitant to contract teams. However, I think this needs to be sacrificed for the greater good of the league. Whether that means contraction or comp specs, it's worth it. The players will still be there, with or without added comp specs.

[sexicano31]

Usually the purpose of historic leagues is to maintain a sense of reality. Like my Seattle Pilots becoming the Brewers, getting a stadium according to what actually happened, etc. This is why we don't have player edits and also why I'm hesitant to contract teams. However, I think this needs to be sacrificed for the greater good of the league. Whether that means contraction or comp specs, it's worth it. The players will still be there, with or without added comp specs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUpbOliTHJY

[TheKid]

Pl, people do a hystoric league for the players not the teams.

Once again I'm for a conp draft pick system, but I'm 100% against comp specs.

The problem with a draft pick system in place of a comp spec system is you'd have to nix draft pick trading.

For example...You sign an A level comp player, requiring you to give up a 1st round DP... but you already traded that pick.... what do you do? Does it go to the next year instead? Does it go to the next round instead? What would be fair in that case?

Moving the pick to the year after creates an issue because you're now delaying the compensation another year and the draft in the following year could be 10X worse than the year you were intending to get it for. This potentially screws over the team getting the comp pick.

Moving the pick to round 2 seriously screws with the team getting the comp pick. The drop off in talent in this league between round 1 and the teams round 2 pick is like falling off a cliff. That wouldn't be right either.

Forget signing 2 players that are compensation worthy... or one in back-to-back free agent classes while also trading your first? Now we're talking 2-3 year's staving off compensation for that player...

This is the reason why there's no draft pick trading in the MLB, the system doesn't work with draft pick compensation. It's either we kill the market by nixing draft pick trading, just so we can have a draft pick compensation... or we use a comp spec system and don't nix draft pick trading.... (this is all assuming we adopt some form of compensation, which i'm in favor of).

[azazel529]

Usually the purpose of historic leagues is to maintain a sense of reality. Like my Seattle Pilots becoming the Brewers, getting a stadium according to what actually happened, etc. This is why we don't have player edits and also why I'm hesitant to contract teams. However, I think this needs to be sacrificed for the greater good of the league. Whether that means contraction or comp specs, it's worth it. The players will still be there, with or without added comp specs.

Exactly. The historical aspect isn't harmed by having a comp spec system. If anything, it is potentially saving it if it helps us avoid contraction, and it doesn't do away with any of the players that are imported for the draft classes each year. We'll likely have some star players with names that aren't recognized, but how many of you can tell me a single thing about the real life careers of Pat Putnam, John Hale, or Bill Gullickson without looking it up? Sure, it's interesting to see guys that were no names in real life turn out to be stars in our league but is that really that terribly different from seeing a comp spec with a random name become a star? Either way, it's still a guy you've never heard of, and all of the historical players from each year are still there.

Alternatives to this type of comp system have been discussed at length in TKO, without ever finding a replacement that doesn't have a potentially huge flaw. TK isn't just talking out of his *** with his comment on draft pick compensation, he knows because he has had to deal with this repeatedly as the commissioner of the TKO league. He's right...that method is just a trade off for a new and different problem that would still result in a dead trade market, which is part of why we're talking about implementing compensation to begin with.

[metsrock229]

Pl, people do a hystoric league for the players not the teams.

Once again I'm for a conp draft pick system, but I'm 100% against comp specs.

The problem with a draft pick system in place of a comp spec system is you'd have to nix draft pick trading.

For example...You sign an A level comp player, requiring you to give up a 1st round DP... but you already traded that pick.... what do you do? Does it go to the next year instead? Does it go to the next round instead? What would be fair in that case?

Moving the pick to the year after creates an issue because you're now delaying the compensation another year and the draft in the following year could be 10X worse than the year you were intending to get it for. This potentially screws over the team getting the comp pick.

Moving the pick to round 2 seriously screws with the team getting the comp pick. The drop off in talent in this league between round 1 and the teams round 2 pick is like falling off a cliff. That wouldn't be right either.

Forget signing 2 players that are compensation worthy... or one in back-to-back free agent classes while also trading your first? Now we're talking 2-3 year's staving off compensation for that player...

This is the reason why there's no draft pick trading in the MLB, the system doesn't work with draft pick compensation. It's either we kill the market by nixing draft pick trading, just so we can have a draft pick compensation... or we use a comp spec system and don't nix draft pick trading.... (this is all assuming we adopt some form of compensation, which i'm in favor of).

This is not necessarily true, if a Team has traded away their pick, they can't sign the Comp free agent.
There would have to be some regulation and I'm sure some people will sign them anyway, but that's fixable