Comp Spec System Discussion...Again

[metsrock229]

Some input on my system would be nice

Considering its the most fair system for all gms, I am disappointed no one else was interested.

Exactly. I'm more disappointed it was pretty much ignored

[RandyRocks77]

Exactly. I'm more disappointed it was pretty much ignored

sorry to be honest I haven't had the time to check it out.. been working 10-12 hours a day for a few weeks straight now..

[poodski]

Exactly. I'm more disappointed it was pretty much ignored

What happens if your pick is traded or you sign more than one of these players?

Who gets your pick? What happens to the other team that didnt get your pick?

[metsrock229]

please elaborate because every time it's been brought up before there are always serious flaws and loopholes.

This is not necessarily true, if a Team has traded away their pick, they can't sign the Comp free agent.
There would have to be some regulation and I'm sure some people will sign them anyway, but that's fixable

We would just have to keep track of draft pick trading, which we already do. Heading into the FA sims, we would make it clear which teams can't sign a FA because they've traded away their first. Or prior to simming, the person running the sim can check the teams that can't and withdraw any offers that would not be allowed.

If a person trades their first the sim of signing someone, then the contract could be nulled. If a person has 2 1st round picks, they could sign 2 FAs worthy of 1st round comp.

Yeah, it may be more work making sure people don't find loopholes, but they did say they are aware it's more work. I would rather have them put in a little more work than to put in a faulty system. However, all they would have to do after is move 1st round picks around instead of creating comp prospects.

Here you go Po, and just change the 1st rounders to 2nd rounders.
I understand if people offer to more than one guy hoping they get just one, but maybe we disallow offering to more than one if you can't sign more than one. We could also have the gm pm the commish running the sim saying which he prefers in case he signs both so if he does he can null the other and put him back in fa?

Another option is resorting to the previous year's pick

[TheKid]

sorry to be honest I haven't had the time to check it out.. been working 10-12 hours a day for a few weeks straight now..

welcome to my life. My regularly scheduled shifts are 12 hours and I rotate between night and days every month, so I know how hard it is sometimes to keep up with reading these types of things...especially when there are a few guys who are passionate enough to type essays on the subject lol.

[azazel529]

Exactly. I'm more disappointed it was pretty much ignored

To be honest, I haven't read the entire thing. Just glanced at it and planned to read it when I had more free time, then it got kind of buried when no one really commented on it. I'll take a look at it when I have a moment.

welcome to my life. My regularly scheduled shifts are 12 hours and I rotate between night and days every month, so I know how hard it is sometimes to keep up with reading these types of things...especially when there are a few guys who are passionate enough to type essays on the subject lol.

I work 12s too, but I don't have to alternate between first and third shift. God, that would suck. How the hell do you keep an even remotely regular sleep schedule?

[azazel529]

I feel like Twitchy with the amount of time/research I'm putting into this discussion.

Blasphemy!!! How dare you compare yourself to the Deity that is Brother Twitchy!!!

Here you go Po, and just change the 1st rounders to 2nd rounders.
I understand if people offer to more than one guy hoping they get just one, but maybe we disallow offering to more than one if you can't sign more than one. We could also have the gm pm the commish running the sim saying which he prefers in case he signs both so if he does he can null the other and put him back in fa?

Another option is resorting to the previous year's pick

Alright mets, I finally read all of it. I admit I like your idea a little better than Po's (sorry Po) but most of what I said about his could apply to yours. I admit that for selfish reasons I'm not terribly wild about the idea of draft based comp...essentially it would end up being a shitload of work to keep track of it all. But also, the way it affects the trade market could get messy and unpredictable. We're hoping that one of the results from whatever changes we implement will be that the trade market is stimulated significantly. I don't see that happening with this system, partially because this system doesn't result in the creation of sufficient additional valuable trade chips and also because a lot of GMs might feel hesitant to make a trade involving a comp pick when the draft classes have still been not so great and even a boosted second rounder is seldom anything close to a potential impact player. Also, I'm not wild about the idea of limiting people to how many extensions they can sign (Po's way) or limiting how many comp eligible players someone can sign (your way). Again...keeping track will get messy and the work will be in Randy and I's lap to keep track of it, plus if part of the reason we're trying to implement changes is to make the FA pool consistently better than limiting the ability to sign comp eligible players kind of defeats the purpose, especially if it also doesn't stimulate the trade market much or result in a gradual increase in talent in the draft class as the game's reaction to the added talent.

At the moment I still see our best option to be a combination of implementing TKO's comp system along with slowing the development speed of prospects. Everyone that says getting a clone of Bonds as comp is too much is actually right. Two things to consider though is that it will be rare that a guy like that hits FA and gets comp, but also we could put a stipulation in the comp rule that there's a maximum total ratings number that any comp can have. So most could be very good, but none can be immediately a younger version of the best player in the game. We end up with a higher talent level, which will start to increase the depth of the draft classes. There will actually be prospects in the farm systems, over time draft picks will become more valuable, and with some type of compensation available GMs holding a pending FA will have some leverage and incentive to either trade or not re-sign some of their impact players. That gives us consistently better FA pools, more trading, and eventually better draft classes as well. The combination of all of these things would lead to higher activity and fewer teams constantly vacant. Anything short of hitting that goal isn't enough to save this league. Our alternatives will be contraction, and eventually just closing up shop if activity stays low and we only have a handful of GMs consistently competing and genuinely participating.

[poodski]

You don't gotta be sorry for not liking my idea, twas just an idea.

I still think finances are an issue no one is really discussing.

[azazel529]

The version for JD: I don't like that idea...I'd rather do TKO's system (or a modified version of it) along with slowing the development of prospects.

[azazel529]

You don't gotta be sorry for not liking my idea, twas just an idea.

I still think finances are an issue no one is really discussing.

I discussed it. In general we've discussed it a ton over the last handful of seasons, but mostly from a standpoint that there's a big gap between the rich teams and the poor teams, and with FA being the only way to build and fill holes the rich teams always win the bidding.

The conversation died down a bit when we realized that most of the league had no idea how to read their finances and had been ignoring offers to increase their seating capacity and ticket prices. I'm open to hearing your thoughts though. What you've said so far I just didn't agree with, honestly.

[poodski]

I discussed it. In general we've discussed it a ton over the last handful of seasons, but mostly from a standpoint that there's a big gap between the rich teams and the poor teams, and with FA being the only way to build and fill holes the rich teams always win the bidding.

The conversation died down a bit when we realized that most of the league had no idea how to read their finances and had been ignoring offers to increase their seating capacity and ticket prices. I'm open to hearing your thoughts though. What you've said so far I just didn't agree with, honestly.

What do you mean you don't agree with me? That there isnt a financial issue?

[azazel529]

What do you mean you don't agree with me? That there isnt a financial issue?

No, I think when you brought it up you pointed out that few teams do have a financial issue, which you believe contributes to our problems. It was the post where you showed some financial figures.

[poodski]

No, I think when you brought it up you pointed out that few teams do have a financial issue, which you believe contributes to our problems. It was the post where you showed some financial figures.

Ohhhh yeah you totally misread what I meant.

13 teams are set to make at least 10 million this year.

2 more at over 8. 5 of those 13 to make over 20 million dollars.

Every single team has the max cash in the bank. I pointed out that a few teams are scheduled to lose money which you pointed out to really only be me thats going to lose money.

So we are going to go into next year with all but one team having the max amount of cash. I think thats a problem. There is no where to spend the money.

I will exploit the **** out of it just like I did this year. I ll sign another player in a few years to a 30 million dollar contract again just because I can. Players hit FA are signed to big deals, and then take garbage money for an extension.

Tony Phillips is a great example. I signed him for 7.2 million per because well I had tons of money. Then I extend him for less than half of that per.

[azazel529]

Ohhhh yeah you totally misread what I meant.

13 teams are set to make at least 10 million this year.

2 more at over 8. 5 of those 13 to make over 20 million dollars.

Every single team has the max cash in the bank. I pointed out that a few teams are scheduled to lose money which you pointed out to really only be me thats going to lose money.

So we are going to go into next year with all but one team having the max amount of cash. I think thats a problem. There is no where to spend the money.

I will exploit the **** out of it just like I did this year. I ll sign another player in a few years to a 30 million dollar contract again just because I can. Players hit FA are signed to big deals, and then take garbage money for an extension.

Tony Phillips is a great example. I signed him for 7.2 million per because well I had tons of money. Then I extend him for less than half of that per.

Ah...I think I got part of your initial point, but I thought you were saying that the lack of teams with financial problems was contributing to our situation. Which I disagreed with, but you're right that there's nowhere to spend the money. In my case I just know what my revenue total is likely to be and I spend within that limit, which gives me a pretty high ceiling. But your point is correct as far as taking a loss that will be quickly replenished. Right now we're all overpaying in FA for mediocre players most of the time, and a lot of the teams with less financial resources just put out one big offer on one big ticket player or several smaller offers on role players. Interesting observation Po.

[RandyRocks77]

back to the Comp spec topic... just another random thought here... what if you rate a Comp pick and any player from your draft results (not counting first round) gets a boost.. I was just looking up some real players and what teams got in return..
1993 Braves signed Greg Maddux... Cubs got Jon Ratliff (what did he do? played one game) I think if a team is to get a Comp spec/pick than it ought to be a risk... to many players with high talent always fill out.. I'm not sure what % to raise these comp players to but it ought to be a gamble not a reward..

or just to gain a little more talent is to have some Diamonds in the Rough...