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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by nithanyo View Post
    Maybe within the jays but Definetly not baseball. I can probably think of atleast one player on every team I'd rather have than Lawrie.

    He's top 5 in the blue jays maybe. If David Price was comming I would trade Lawrie in a heart beat. His Canadian passport overrates him amongst jays fans.
    What a ****ing ridiculous statement.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halladay View Post
    What a ****ing ridiculous statement.
    Actually for a majority of teams, I could actually think of a player I would rather have over Lawrie


    The Brilliant Plan of How to Get Andrew Wiggins in a Toronto Uniform
    Quote Originally Posted by deaner View Post
    All I'm saying is the league wants to see Toronto succeeded. An outside chance Silver could say to philly... You know... That's a great trade offer from Toronto for the first pick. It's up to you but we'd love to see wiggins in Toronto.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by nithanyo View Post
    Maybe within the jays but Definetly not baseball. I can probably think of atleast one player on every team I'd rather have than Lawrie.

    He's top 5 in the blue jays maybe. If David Price was comming I would trade Lawrie in a heart beat. His Canadian passport overrates him amongst jays fans.
    Probably production wise.. but when you factor in position, age, potential and contract, i can't imagine there will be many

    Yankees - Cano
    Red Sox - No one
    Rays - Price
    Baltimore - No one. I'd take him over bundy and Machado

    White Sox - No one. Sale is good but too risky
    KC - No one. Myers is nice but i'll take the 3B
    Twins - No one
    Indians - No one
    Detroit - Miggy and Verlander despite the contracts

    Texas - Possibly Profar
    Angels - Trout
    Oakland - No one
    Seattle - No one if you consider you're gonna have to pay Felix 20+ mills soon or he's gone
    Houston - No one

    Padres - No one
    SF - Posey
    Dodgers - Kershaw even though he will get expensive
    Arizona - No one
    Colorado - No one - Tulo is injury prone and Cargo is a coors product

    Nationals - Harper/Strasburg
    Phillies - No one
    Marlins - Stanton
    Atlanta - Heyward
    Mets - No one

    Reds - No one. Votto's contract is too long
    Cubs - No one
    Pirates - Mccutchen
    Brewers - Braun
    Cardinals - Molina possibly but not a fan of paying a catcher 15 per

    I came up with about 13 players

    So yeah there are some players in the league I would take over Lawrie but it isn't as easy to find them as you might think
    Last edited by bomber0104; 12-02-2012 at 03:48 AM.

    props to vick27m

    "Art was my first major in college but it was too hard, so I majored in math"
    Ron Artest

  4. #64
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    I'll take Starlin Castro over Lawrie.

  5. #65
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    Why some people would want to trade away Lawrie and TDA for David Price is beyond me. Price is going to be making 20 mill in his last arb year, and his extension is going to be through the roof and it isn't necessarily going to be coming from us.

    We have 2 cost effective all star caliber cornerstones with a good 6 years from hitting their primes, and you want to trade them for a pitcher that will cost 20% of the payroll, regardless of how good he is? That's just a ridiculous way to build a team.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaysLeafs98 View Post
    I wonder if someone can help me understand as to why we NEED to trade a catcher? I know JPA only has value at catcher but personally I think we should hold on to both d'arnaud and JP and split the catching and DH duties until we know exactly what both can do at the major league level.
    The Blue Jays don't need to trade a catcher, but they have the opportunity to trade one and try to improve in another area. D'Arnaud is getting close to ready for the majors, and now there's John Buck in town ready to fill the position until he's ready. Arencibia is a very flawed player but he still has some trade value currently.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaysLeafs98 View Post
    I actually think both have all-star potential (JP mostly because of his HR power and great numbers with RISP) and would HATE to end up trading the wrong one. The Jays have plenty of other pieces that can be used to get a quality starter and having 3 catchers on the roster is never a bad thing.
    JP Arencibia's "star potential" is pretty much a long shot. He really has horrible OBP and shows no sign of improving in that area. His defense is also not spectacular. D'Arnaud may not have equal power potential to Arencibia, but he will hit for a better average, get on base more and have better defense. Maybe not necessarily in his rookie season, but the sooner he gets comfortable playing at the major league level, the better off he'll be.

    Moving either player to DH or 1B diminishes their value. It simply makes more sense to trade Arencibia then sign a Bobby Wilson or Jeff Mathis type of player to give them depth on the roster.

  7. #67
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    Unless AA gets something great for JPA, I don't see a trade for him until they know D'Arnaud is back to 100% and playing at the level he once was.

    Lawrie is also a top 10 player in the league once he goes back to his old approach as oppose to the first pitch BS that Murphy told him to do all season...

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schrodinger View Post
    I'll take Starlin Castro over Lawrie.
    Why would you?

    Starlin will probably continue to be a .750 OPS, sub 4 WAR player while Lawrie has the chance to be a real middle of the order bat who can deliver huge WAR seasons

    and I think their speed and defense are a wash. Castro plays the tougher position but Lawrie is a far superior defender and we got Reyes

    props to vick27m

    "Art was my first major in college but it was too hard, so I majored in math"
    Ron Artest

  9. #69
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    Jon Niese is your ideal #3 pitcher in a solid staff. I am personally a fan.

    His career 48.9 GB% indicates that he should have success here, the only thing that scares me is his HR/FB% which is at 12.6%, exactly 4% higher then that of Brandon Morrow over the past year.

    When you actually compare Morrow and Niese's years, you'd see very similar stats. Morrow had a 7.80 K/9 which is a low for him, he's usually around the mid 9's in terms of K/9, but we saw a different Brandon Morrow this year.

    Just using that as a frame of reference in terms of what you can compare production to, Morrow has much better stuff.

    What I personally love about Niese is that he's a 4 pitch pitcher. I think the reason he would have a ton of success here is indicated in his arsenal. Take a look at Niese's pitch FX:

    Last year's breakdown:

    He threw the fastball 49.0% of the time averaging at 90.4.
    He threw the cutter 27.8% of the time averaging at 87.5.
    He threw the curveball 19.4% of the time averaging at 74.4.
    He threw the changeup 3.8% of the time averaging at 83.6.

    Clearly he's confident with 3 pitches, his fastball, cutter and curveball. He throws them quite frequently. I believe that working with our pitching coaches, he could defenitely improve on his changeup, our pitching coaches usually help our pitches induce that changeup for whatever reason.

    All in all, he's really only been a starter for 3 years now in the big leagues. Don't let the ERA fool you, he had a good year in both 2011 and 2012 with a 3.28 xFIP and 3.64 xFIP n those respective years.

    In the AL East, I expect Jon Niese to be a good #3 starter who is a model of consistency, with a 3.6-3.9 xFIP and a low 3 ERA-high 4 ERA. I'd love to have Niese.

  10. #70
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    ^ first person to talk about Niese since page 1

    Jays '13

  11. #71
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    Ever since the marlins trade, some guys have been really delusional with these trade ideas. Trade top prospects for ol man Dickey, TB might be willing to trade within the division, Lawrie is overrated and tradeable... Gawd ppl. Slow yourselves down.

    Jays '13

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talick View Post
    Ever since the marlins trade, some guys have been really delusional with these trade ideas. Trade top prospects for ol man Dickey, TB might be willing to trade within the division, Lawrie is overrated and tradeable... Gawd ppl. Slow yourselves down.
    While I generally agree with your position, it should be noted that ridiculous idea's did not simply begin at the time of the trade with the Marlins. It's been going on for several years.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talick View Post
    Ever since the marlins trade, some guys have been really delusional with these trade ideas. Trade top prospects for ol man Dickey, TB might be willing to trade within the division, Lawrie is overrated and tradeable... Gawd ppl. Slow yourselves down.
    what's the view like from your pedastol

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talick View Post
    ^ first person to talk about Niese since page 1
    Reason being, at this point in their respective careers, I'd much rather pay the price to get Niese then get Dickey.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by bomber0104 View Post
    I'd rather add to JPA and go for Dickey... the dude won the Cy Young and the Mets don't seem to be asking the world for him
    38 year old knuckleballer going from the NL East to the Al East has alot of warning signs on him.

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